2011 cummins problem

[Todd B]

I have a 2011 dodge one ton dually, Cummins, with 165,000 miles on it.  Sometimes when I am driving it seems like the truck stalls and if I take my foot off the gas and immediately accelerate and everything seems perfect.  It happened the first few times when I was going 80 mph on the freeway and like I said, it only last a second or two.  So I had my engine breather filter and fuel filters replaced.  Two days later it happened again at 40 mph.  Does anybody have any ideas what's going on.  Its my main workhorse and I have been working 2 hours from home on a job and I am not sure if I can trust it.  Its at the dealer right now and they are looking into what could be going on. 

[JBNeal]

Injection pump may be needing a tune up or TPS may be flickering...lots of electronics that need to run through a diagnostic procedure before knowing for sure  

[Jeff Balazs]

Might check the fuel tank vent.

[Niel Hoback]

This is from my son who also has that engine; disconnect the battery for a few minutes. It's possible the drive train computer needs rebooting.

[Todd B]

Update:

My dodge dealer couldn't find any codes or anything wrong with my truck.  They even tested my fuel thinking I possibly had a bad tank of full. They recommended 911 rescue additive in my fuel.  I added with the next 2 tanks of fuel.  I ran 2 days in a row 270 miles, 1st day empty truck and my mileage went from 12 MPG which is very common to 14.5MPG, the second day I pulled a 16' Enclosed trailer and my mileage went from 9.2 MPG which is very common to 10.6 MPG.  I never had any stalls and the acceleration seemed to be much quicker.  I am not sure if it is the filters or the 911 but I have never had this good of fuel mileage, and I bought this truck new. 

 

I am not sure if the dealer unhooked the battery as suggested by Neil.  I wanted to wait and see what happened with the other things before I unhooked the battery. 

 

 

 

[Todd B]

I am still having problems after many attempts to fix. I will start from the beginning. I thought it was bad fuel and then it started happening again.  It seems "on occasion" when I let off the gas and then accelerate it wants to stall or hesitate, sometimes it feels like when you would pull the choke on a gas engine.  Some times it won't come out of that until you pull over and shut the truck, then you can immediately start the truck and it will take off perfectly.  Sometimes it will do again right away and other times I could drive for 200 miles. This went on for weeks and was getting worse, then a code came up and they said it was my turbo.  I replaced the turbo, ($3,000) and it seemed much better but it still has a slight hesitation, always after I back off of the gas and then accelerate. It don't have the power it normally does neither.  So then we replaced the fuel pump in the tank,($600) the tank was spotless inside.  The truck again seemed to run better and more power.  Then it started to do the same thing, it hesitates after you back off and then accelerate. None of these things will throw a code.  My mechanic found away with I think by pumping the brake to display code faults.  Several popped up and one of them is the computer ($1,850) .  I am nervous on spending this because we are not sure that's the problem.  I had planned on getting a new truck at the end of the year for tax purposes but I hate sticking more into the truck, but I cannot sell it knowing there is a problem. 

Any help will be greatly appreciated. 

Todd B

[Plymouthy Adams]

would this puppy by any means have a crank/cam sensors?  not that familiar with diesel...but I am thinking they may....these oft time in most cars so equipped will drop a signal and mess a lot of stuff up....

had a similar problem years ago in gasoline powered vehicle dealership could not fix but was only Easter egging it...went to the dealer ship, asked for a room, driveability book and the schematics.  (knew the service manager)  Traced it to a voltage regulator in the controller behind the kickpanel...popped that in...flawless from then on....In this case  six codes were always called out, I traced all six to find they got their control voltage from this regulator.  Easy fix for me, well I say easy, I was two hours in the books and schematic...compared to dealer techs guessy choosy method  I was weeks ahead of them in ultimate repair by elimination

[Jerry Roberts]

On 8/17/2017 at 8:57 AM, Todd B said:

... display code faults.  Several popped up and one of them is the computer ($1,850) .  I am nervous on spending this because we are not sure that's the problem...  

When one of my vehicles needed a new computer and the price was big bucks , I found a used one on ebay for $50 and it has been running great for several years now . 

[Todd B]

I still am having problems.  I can't bring myself to throwing more money at it until I find more info about the problem.  The truck hesitates or stalls only randomly, when it does its almost always on acceleration.  I would love to figure this out but have drawn a blank with many mechanics.

 

[greg g]

Todd, are you one of those fellows who has about four pounds of keys on your key ring, and does that lump hang and swing around supported by the truck key in the ignition switch??  When I worked at the Dodge dealership I over heard a conversation between a customer and one of the service advisor.  The truck in question was a 2500 with gas hemi.  Symptom was every time the truck (work truck with tools and other stuff in the bed) went over the railroad tracks he crossed going to and from home, the truck would quit.  pull over restart and proceed as normal.  The truck had about 80K and was four or five years old.  The service advisor was explaining they couldn't duplicate the condition regardless of how many times the crossed the tracks.  They actually took his truck over his route crossing the tracks in both directions at various speeds.  The guy muttered his discontent, took his key and attached it to his key ring that had about 30 keys on it.  He was grumbling as he walked out to retrieve his truck.  I stopped him and told him I had heard the discussion.  I asked him to try something out on his trip home.  Separate the truck key from his other ring and see what happens.  He was back in about three days later to report that without his large key ring hanging the truck was fine hadn't stalled after the tracks since.

The weight of the keys had worn the ign switch to the point that after hitting the bumps, the switch got jiggled enough to take the switch far enough out of the on position to kill the engine but not far enough to be obviously off.

Might be worth a look at if you have more than the key being supported by the ignition switch.

 

Edited September 16, 2017 by greg g

[Todd B]

Interesting story but this is not the case here.  I have my key fob and one key on my key ring.  It doesn't shut off, it just stalls out for a few seconds and then takes off like there nothing wrong (almost always after I back off the throttle and then accelerate again).  Sometimes it really stalls, feels like you pulled the choke on a gas engine. Once in a great while it keeps stalling until I pull over and shut the truck off.  I can immediately restart the truck and everything is fine.  Sometimes for several hundred miles, sometimes it may do it again within a few miles. 

 

Thanks for everybody's thoughts, and prayers would be appreciated. Todd

[lonejacklarry]

1 hour ago, Todd B said:

   It doesn't shut off, it just stalls out for a few seconds and then takes off like there nothing wrong (almost always after I back off the throttle and then accelerate again).   

OK, this one is from deep center field if I may.  Many years ago I had a new Fiat 124.  The electrics were horrible but that is a different story.

The car would run fine for weeks and then stall as you describe.  Coasting to the roadside and restarting solved the problem temporarily.  Sometimes it would go months and sometimes it would happen twice in one day.  It was in the service department for days at a time and, of course, they were "unable to duplicate".

Finally, an old guy I knew suggested that something might be floating around in the fuel tank and, periodically, it would block the gas flow and make the vehicle stop.  After it stopped the suction on the gas line went away and whatever it might be floated away.  The dealer would not do it so I drained the tank into a strained container.  Nothing.  I peered into the tank and discovered a 2 x 3 piece of cellophane was stuck to the side.  It looked like a cellophane wrapper from a pack of cigarettes.  After checking for more pieces, I put it all together again.

Never had the problem again.

[halffast52]

 it does sound like the crank position sensor is going bad it controls the timing rpm ect. I think I would try that before I spend 1800+ on a new ecm a new cps is about $40 just make sure you use a mopar  or Cummins one just went through basically the same thing with a jeep liberty it threw codes for ecm random misfire vac leak I got the cps at advanced auto it still ran like crap and threw same codes put the mopar brand cps in it runs great and no codes again this is just my two cents best of luck hope you get it figured out

[DJ194950]

For what it is worth- several years ago my equip. rental co. had an almost new fork lift with a cummins turbo diesel that ran fine but would just die sometimes and then run fine again for days. After several customers got tired of this it was sent to our heavy repair shop at our yard.

I ended up with this job. I could not get the damn thing to die after several days and hours of use. I called the factory help for the industrial uses and was told it was most likely the computer.

When I questioned the rep if it could be caused by the cam position sensor I was told it Could be. I checked the prices of replacement computers and the cam pos. sensor.

Computer ( no fancy controls for speed, accessories,etc.) was about a grand. The pos. sensor about 150 bucks or even less. I tried the cam pos. sensor and sent the machine back on rent. Never heard another word about that machine!

Also the cam pos. sensor was way easier to replace!

Just my 2cent.

DJ

Edited September 16, 2017 by DJ194950

[Todd B]

1 hour ago, lonejacklarry said:

OK, this one is from deep center field if I may.  Many years ago I had a new Fiat 124.  The electrics were horrible but that is a different story.

The car would run fine for weeks and then stall as you describe.  Coasting to the roadside and restarting solved the problem temporarily.  Sometimes it would go months and sometimes it would happen twice in one day.  It was in the service department for days at a time and, of course, they were "unable to duplicate".

Finally, an old guy I knew suggested that something might be floating around in the fuel tank and, periodically, it would block the gas flow and make the vehicle stop.  After it stopped the suction on the gas line went away and whatever it might be floated away.  The dealer would not do it so I drained the tank into a strained container.  Nothing.  I peered into the tank and discovered a 2 x 3 piece of cellophane was stuck to the side.  It looked like a cellophane wrapper from a pack of cigarettes.  After checking for more pieces, I put it all together again.

Never had the problem again.

I thought that may be the problem also because we changed fuel filter's twice and there was slime on them. So I had the mechanic pull the tank, it was clean inside, and at the same time we changed the fuel pump. I thought we had it for a week or so and then it  started doing it again. 

[Todd B]

Well after I changed several items my truck still stalls out, only now it’s once in a blue moon.  But now I have another strange, very strange thing going on. Few weeks ago I left for work and drove about 10 miles and my truck was blowing cold air, I stopped and shut my truck off and immediately started it again, my heater worked perfectly.  (Remember when my truck acted like a ford and would stall out I would shut it off and restart it). So I drove it this morning and the heater set at half heat it blew unbelievably hot, it feels like a sauna in the cab.  My temp gauge read normal. My mechanic thinks it’s the computer all along, even the reason behind the stalling. But I am afraid to spend that kind of money and not sure that’s the problem. This truck is just a back up truck for me and is not driven daily.  Any thoughts???

[Brent B3B]

Kind of sounds like it could be the “blend door” to me, but your mechanic probably has a better idea.

That stalling out thing is weird... I suppose the pressure at the fuel rail was checked. I heard that “ slime” in the system is a killer

 

keep us updated Todd, I am curious 

[Tooljunkie]

Backing off and hitting throttle may be a bad connector or a broken wire. A wiggle test would be something i would do. 
Running, operating temp.

pull and twist every harness at both ends. 
uncluding under  truck harness

so set park  brake and block wheels. 
this electronic pedal?

could be app sensor is going bad. 
 

[keithb7]

What a P.I.T.A. @Todd B. Looking back at your threads I see that this has been going on for over 3 years. Electrical problems on modern vehicles can be a nightmare without a doubt. If you are diligent in searching, you may get lucky and find someone who wrecked, and is parting out their 2011 Ram Diesel. You could maybe get a deal on a good used computer this way. Hate to bring it up again, but Facebook Marketplace is a good spot to be looking. I just looked there and found a 2013 Ram Diesel being parted out near me here.

 

At the risk of sounding like an arm-chair quarterback, could a fuel pressure gauge have been installed in the cab to monitor the fuel system to see what it going one there? Before throwing money at that system? Dropping the tank and changing the fuel pump was an expensive experiment. I installed fuel pressure gauge in my 1999 Ram Diesel. It's nice to know exactly what is going on while I drive it.

Edited May 16, 2020 by keithb7

[Todd B]

Thanks for all the input from all. The truck is in incredible shape and actually has more power than my 2018 Cummins. Maybe not more pulling power but definitely more power off the line and to get to 60 faster. It’s (only) got 225,000 miles and I would love this issue figured out. 

[48Dodger]

Hmmmm.......restricted diesel particulate filter?

 

48D

[Ulu]

I haven’t been a diesel guy since before the days of smog control, but I think a blocked particulate filter would just cause a constant loss of top end power. Just the same as if your muffler collapsed internally from rust and it was plugging up the system.

 

But what if there is something loose in the exhaust system causing a random blockage, like that cigarette pack floating around in the gas tank? I can’t imagine what, but it’s an interesting hypothesis.

 

I have decades of professional experience with computers, but I have never had a computer failure in one of my cars, trucks or motorcycles.

 

That being said, there are things I know that apply to almost all computers.

 

They do not like heat, and if this computer is somehow getting overheated it could cause random problems. This applies to the sensors and switches and senders as well so if anything is directing extra heat to them it could be a problem.

 

Another thing, and one of the things that also can cause overheating, is poor connections to peripheral devices. That, and the failure of peripheral devices themselves, which in the car means the switches and sensors.

 

If a high current from such conditions does not actually kill the computer it can cause it to miss behave in random ways until the connection is repaired and in some cases could cause permanent internal damage.

 

I am sure that after three years you have checked every single wire & connection pin, but I would go back over them. Make sure there is absolutely no stress on the plug where the computer connects to the main harness and that every single wire seems to be seated properly and the connector both before and after it is inserted.

 

I don’t know if you have drive-by-wire throttle, but I would definitely look into that. There were big recalls on foreign drive-by-wire throttle assemblies.

I would put a sensitive Voltmeter on the main regulator output and monitor that voltage whenever it happens. Maybe there’s some totally unrelated problem that is causing a voltage drop.

 

Your voltage shouldn’t drop too quickly as the engine slows, So if it spikes way down suddenly, that would be a clue.

 

What would it be a clue to?

 

Maybe an internal problem with the alternator or related wiring.

 

You generally need 11.5 V Min (or some close specific base voltage) At the computer itself, before the computer will boot and operate correctly, so if something is robbing your juice this could cause a random shut down.

Edited May 18, 2020 by Ulu

[Todd B]

I had the tank out and it was spotless inside.  You did make me think of something.  A few years back one of my batteries smelled funny and I opened the hood and the battery was bubbling. I pulled the ground and changed the battery. I will check the date on the battery in the morning. I kind of think that is when all this happened. 

[Ulu]

I remember once having my ammeter pegging, because my ground cable had come slightly loose while I was driving.

I fixed it right away and I didn’t damage my regulator or anything, fortunately.

 

I can imagine that a bad ground on any computer control vehicle could be a cause of voltage spikes And blown equipment.

[ggdad1951]

Todd, I'm hurt you haven't reached out to me!  Drop me a PM with the details and I'll call up my coworker contacts at the EBU to see if they have an idea, I know a few engine guru's down there.