Oil pump prime loaner.

[rcl700]

I'm slowly progressing with my 48' I now have the 230 installed and wiring 90%. What I'm in need of is a oil pump with the gear removed so that I can prime the engine. 

I'm hoping that maybe someone in the group would be willing to lend out the pump they used for the same task. I really don't want to buy a replacement pump just for priming one engine. 

 

Please PM me if you can help. It could just get mailed out and mailed back. 

[kencombs]

I've never seen such tool.   How is the pump driven with no gear? I use an external pump or pressure tank to prime through one of the ports into the  main oil gallery on the drivers side.

[Plymouthy Adams]

there is the slot for the distributor that is driven by the gear that is in turn driven by the cam....so in a stationary engine, the shaft is turned via the slot and thus effectively pump oil.  

[rcl700]

1 hour ago, kencombs said:

I've never seen such tool.   How is the pump driven with no gear? I use an external pump or pressure tank to prime through one of the ports into the  main oil gallery on the drivers side.

When using your method, do you use the return port where the external oil filter line goes into the block? 

[kencombs]

2 hours ago, rcl700 said:

When using your method, do you use the return port where the external oil filter line goes into the block? 

No,  I've always removed a plug and used one of the others, not the filter connections.

[kencombs]

4 hours ago, Plymouthy Adams said:

there is the slot for the distributor that is driven by the gear that is in turn driven by the cam....so in a stationary engine, the shaft is turned via the slot and thus effectively pump oil.  

Darn, that is a long drive shaft to reach all the way across the block, and engage a slot.   I've done similar with Fords but the hex shaft is much easier to align and hold in place.  And much more room above the engine that beside it when installed.

[Loren]

You know I’ve thinking about this too.

However I was going in a different direction.

I was thinking of using an old propane tank or a refrigerant tank that you could put oil in and pressurize it with a tire valve then connect it to the engine oil galley. If you look in the shop manual the factory talks about an oil pressure leak down test. You take the pan off and pressurize the galley to see where the oil is leaking. They even had a special tool to do the test and criteria for how much leakage was allowed.

That’s a lot more than I had in mind though. All I wanted to do is lube the engine before a first run. What I was thinking was this is a way to make sure the oil pump was primed ( of course you’d have to roll the engine over to turn the pump several rotations before it would prime )

Summit Racing and others have such equipment but it’s pricey.

[Plymouthy Adams]

No one said it was a walk in the park but yet..it is also not hard if you think outside the box a bit with a bushing in the distributor hole to maintain centric alignment when spinning the pump with the priming shaft also one will make from round stock.  

[rcl700]

19 minutes ago, Loren said:

You know I’ve thinking about this too.

However I was going in a different direction.

I was thinking of using an old propane tank or a refrigerant tank that you could put oil in and pressurize it with a tire valve then connect it to the engine oil galley. If you look in the shop manual the factory talks about an oil pressure leak down test. You take the pan off and pressurize the galley to see where the oil is leaking. They even had a special tool to do the test and criteria for how much leakage was allowed.

That’s a lot more than I had in mind though. All I wanted to do is lube the engine before a first run. What I was thinking was this is a way to make sure the oil pump was primed ( of course you’d have to roll the engine over to turn the pump several rotations before it would prime )

Summit Racing and others have such equipment but it’s pricey.

something like this? 

 

 

[Los_Control]

I just wonder what our fathers and Grandfathers did in this situation and how it worked out for them.

[Sniper]

You know, a pump up garden sprayer and some fittings would make a very cheap priming tool.

 

I use a similar rig to clean injectors.

 

 

[Sam Buchanan]

45 minutes ago, Los_Control said:

I just wonder what our fathers and Grandfathers did in this situation and how it worked out for them.

 

Probably the same way many of us have done with many engines.......put oil in the engine, start it and verify oil pressure is indicated in a few seconds. Done.

 

An overhaul should include applying assembly lube to the bearings and moving parts and that offers lubrication until the pump fills the galleys.

Edited Monday at 12:03 AM by Sam Buchanan

[9 foot box]

   There is no mention of you priming your oil pump when you put the engine together. That’s mandatory to getting oil pickup from the floating screen in the pan with at least 4 quarts of oil. You don’t have an oil filter on the engine in your picture. I recommend mounting a Wix 24755 spin-on filter adapter. I mount mine a bit higher and rearward to clear throttle and shift linkage and easier access to the dip stick. I use a 1320 filter. Sam has a post on his mounting, I changed it bit and made my own flare fittings on the lines for my relocation of the filter. With the various aftermarket by-pass filters and gaskets, I know that a spin-on is performing as it should, doesn’t leak and it’s easier to replace. Rick D.

[Ivan_B]

5 hours ago, Los_Control said:

I just wonder what our fathers and Grandfathers did in this situation and how it worked out for them.

Just crank the engine, cold, to circulate the oil

And, as previously mentioned, use proper lubrication during the assembly.

[kencombs]

I always pack the oil pump with vaseline before installing.   Helps it start pumping immediately.   First started this when working a little Buick aluminum v8 in the sixties.   Oil pump was in the front cover, internal passage to pickup in the back.   Factory manual specified the vaseline packing to get it primed quickly.  Decided to do it on every pump.   A lot of the engines I worked on in the 60's-80s were for sale and sat for days, weeks or months before their first start.

[Merle Coggins]

17 minutes ago, kencombs said:

I always pack the oil pump with vaseline before installing.   Helps it start pumping immediately.   First started this when working a little Buick aluminum v8 in the sixties.   Oil pump was in the front cover, internal passage to pickup in the back.   Factory manual specified the vaseline packing to get it primed quickly.  Decided to do it on every pump.   A lot of the engines I worked on in the 60's-80s were for sale and sat for days, weeks or months before their first start.

 

I've done that several times too. It works well. I've also seen a procedure for our flat head engines where you dunk the pump in oil and turn the pump by hand until it purges all air out of it. Then install it, with it full of oil. Apparently this is also sufficient for the pump to be able to pull up oil from the sump upon first startup. 

[Los_Control]

14 hours ago, Ivan_B said:

Just crank the engine, cold, to circulate the oil

And, as previously mentioned, use proper lubrication during the assembly.

IIRC, they also would remove the coil wire just so it could not start, until they saw oil pressure on the gauge.

 

Sometimes I think we  make things too complicated, just because we can.

[Dave72dt]

18 minutes ago, Los_Control said:

IIRC, they also would remove the coil wire just so it could not start, until they saw oil pressure on the gauge.

 

Sometimes I think we  make things too complicated, just because we can.

May have pulled the coil wire, may have pulled the plugs, may have just started it.  Depends on how they were taught or reasoned would suffice and had success with.  Assembly lubrication could have varied widely also.  May have been just engine oil, maybe a swipe of grease, STP was common after it was available, white lithium, etc.  Actual assembly lube as we know it today, would not have been in very many DIY garages or neighborhood service stations either.

[Young Ed]

I know the ones I helped Dad with over the years were all assembled with lubriplate on the bearings. Then spin with no plugs until oil pressure showed and with 30w non detergent as break in oil. Was it right? IDK but it worked on all but one. That one I personally believe sat too long( close to a decade) and either the lubriplate dried up or dirt got in the engine 

[Ivan_B]

11 minutes ago, Young Ed said:

Then spin with no plugs until oil pressure showed and with 30w non detergent as break in oil.

And this is probably the correct way of doing this 😉

[Young Ed]

Just now, Ivan_B said:

And this is probably the correct way of doing this 😉

I must say we have a tractor powered flathead build that I need to resume this season. I'm very torn on what process to use for the initial startup. Because like the one I mentioned earlier it's been sitting for years now. 

[Ivan_B]

Same as usual... I would check the bores, to make sure that there is no rust. Then, spray some oil, in there, and rotate the engine by hand (no plugs or ignition, of course) to lubricate everything before attempting to start it. You can certainly pressurize the oil system manually, as discussed above, but I suspect that this would be excessive for a working engine that was in storage.

[Young Ed]

20 minutes ago, Ivan_B said:

Same as usual... I would check the bores, to make sure that there is no rust. Then, spray some oil, in there, and rotate the engine by hand (no plugs or ignition, of course) to lubricate everything before attempting to start it. You can certainly pressurize the oil system manually, as discussed above, but I suspect that this would be excessive for a working engine that was in storage.

This isn't a good used one. It might not have been bored out but it certainly has all new bearings. My concern is the lubricant applied to the fresh bearings has dried up or left the surfaces. 

[Ivan_B]

So the engine has not been run after what ever was done with it? Okay, just pressurize the system with some sort of pump, to be on a safe side, then

[Dave72dt]

Lubriplate would not have left the surface but could have dried up.