Feeling kind of defeated

[librado65]

Just needed to clear my head as Im an over the road truck driver and hardly home (long haul both USA/Canada) and my 50 Coronet has been stressing me out...

 

I posted on here a few months back about my flathead issues: non stop smoking...was told by local mechanic that the piston rings are worn out. So I figured that I would do a v8 swap since the shop couldn't rebuild it or even find a machinist in town to work on the flathead. Car sat and I eventually got it towed back home because they just wouldn't work on the car.

 

Fast forward, I met a fellow Mopar guy on here (or was it on FB groups?)...who has been kind of enough to recommend a mechanic in his area of Florida. I had the Coronet towed to that shop. They tell me the issue is piston rings, as well. But they do not have the knowledge to rebuild the flathead engine. So fellow Mopar guy from here had another source, but this other source are backed up in rebuilding engines for at least 6months. 

 

The car has sat for going on a year and half now. I come home once a month to central Florida for a week from being on the road and just get sad looking at the Coronet parked. I just want to cruise in the Coronet. Im currently on the road as I type this and I'm just feeling so defeated that I have not had any luck on getting my Coronet back on the road meanwhile all I do is drive a 18wheeler for a job.

 

Sorry I just needed to vent to the Mopar crew.

[TodFitch]

These L-6 engines are dirt simple and much more forgiving than modern engines so it surprises me that you can't find someone willing to work on it.

 

Heck, when young and ignorant with only simple hand tools I was able to do a ring and valve job on my '33 over the space of a couple of weekends. And I did it without removing the engine from the car. It held together just fine for another 20K to 30K miles before I decided to get it rebuilt professionally when I took the car all the way apart for restoration. Ring and valve jobs were pretty standard fare back in the day and well within the skill level of an amateur mechanic. If the diagnosis is correct that it is simply the rings then you might be able to do the same depending on how worn the cylinders are.

 

If on tear down and inspection you find things are not that simple, then you'll find lots of members here have done professional level rebuilds and can give you advise and direct you to resources.

[librado65]

7 hours ago, TodFitch said:

These L-6 engines are dirt simple and much more forgiving than modern engines so it surprises me that you can't find someone willing to work on it.

 

Heck, when young and ignorant with only simple hand tools I was able to do a ring and valve job on my '33 over the space of a couple of weekends. And I did it without removing the engine from the car. It held together just fine for another 20K to 30K miles before I decided to get it rebuilt professionally when I took the car all the way apart for restoration. Ring and valve jobs were pretty standard fare back in the day and well within the skill level of an amateur mechanic. If the diagnosis is correct that it is simply the rings then you might be able to do the same depending on how worn the cylinders are.

 

If on tear down and inspection you find things are not that simple, then you'll find lots of members here have done professional level rebuilds and can give you advise and direct you to resources.

 

I was under the impression that they were simple to work on as well. But I just haven't had any luck. I, personally, don't have time to work on it due to my job. Thanks for the reply 

[oldodge41]

I like what TodFitch said, that's what I would do. But if you don't want to go that route maybe pick up a running flathead and do an engine swap. Facebook seems to have guys doing v-8 swaps and selling off flathead stuff fairly regular lately. Iknow, they are everywhere until you need one, but it's an option.

[FarmerJon]

Looking back at your previous trials and tribulations with this engine, it sounds like you already tried the running engine swap, only to be burned by a dishonest/lazy/ignorant shop.

These are simple machines, but the last 3 (or more) generations of "professional " mechanics have NO experience with them.  

Honestly,  it is getting hard to find an honest/competent mechanic even for easy Late Model car work. Numerous guys at my work have cars that shops wont fix. Several have cars that have waited many months just for basic collision repairs. 

Engine Machine shops are no better: the old guys are closing up shop, and the newer shops only want to do basic stuff on SBC and late model quick jobs...

It sucks.

I get the lack of time, I am close to the same age, with a job that wants me there 50-65 hours a week, and a wife and kids at home, (rightfully) wanting my attention during the few hours I am there.

Your Coronet is a nice looking car. If the only thing holding it back is an engine, lets take the time to rediagnose, make a plan, and make it happen. Once you have a plan, taking a day or two once a month to implement it will have you feeling better and will get it back together faster than you think. 

Depending on the policies and realitys of your work, could you use the fact that you travel the USA to get the machine/engine work done outside of your home state? 

[Plymouthy Adams]

for sure, work can often be overwhelming when it comes to wanting to do a few things for yourself to relax and move forward on projects.   While may not be the best means to an end, the hobby can eat your brain, time and money and put you in a funk real quick.  What is the possibilities of buying a completed car to enjoy till time and circumstances allow you to attack the engine yourself.  Shops want the quick and easy money and collision repair is just that, for the modern quick to fix late model where OTC parts and wrecking yards can support...that is why at 10 years of age, most any can become a total loss with just a minor fender bender.  At 10 years most yards pass these cars to pick and pull, they have lost the insurance support. 

[Tom Skinner]

Librado65,

I have done a ring job in one day. You can too. One must have a Head and Oil Pan Gasket, Ridge Reamer, and Torque Wrench, and you can take it apart in one half day. Then determine if there is no discernable Taper in the cylinders. (You can take a loan Tool a Taper Tool from Advance Auto) If your good to go order a Standard Sized Rings Set order from Andy Bernbaum or Vintage Power Wagon, then reassemble in your next available day. As was stated if these shops can't fix a Flathead they aren't worth a Tinkers Dang anyhow. They are quite simply simpletons. Or total B--- Sh----s. Or Both.

Tom Skinner

Huntersville NC

[Dan Hiebert]

Chin up!  We understand the need to vent, it helps.  Life happens, can't do much about that, but you have options to get your car up and running.  Silver lining to the over-the-road dark cloud is that putting your car in a long queue may not be a bad option, since you're out on the road a lot.  That also gives you the opportunity to seek out a decent shop, which are indeed far and few in between.  I had to wait almost a year to get our Dodge's radiator restored!  It would have been longer if I'd gone out of State.  Unknown who you drive for, but mayhaps you have backhaul (that's what the truckers up here call it) opportunities to get either the whole car, or just the engine, to a shop and back.  I don't know of any shops that work on older engines that don't have a waiting list, because there are many more that can't or won't do that work, for whatever reason.  These things can take a while, you've got a nice car and plans for how you want to enjoy it, don't lose hope.

Edited February 22 by Dan Hiebert
typo

[vintage6t]

If you just want the joy of cruising in a classic, and not the pain, cost and time of making something roadworthy then I'd sell it. Buy a finished car to enjoy and do minor tinkering on when needed.

 

Sad to say but in the long run you'll come out ahead in every respect. Given that there is not a huge general interest in those old mopars, with a little patience and a lot of looking I'd but you'd find something different for a very good deal.

Edited February 22 by vintage6t

[Los_Control]

Back when these cars were in daily service, it was common to have a mechanic at the local gas station do rings and valves.

Simply drop the pan and pull the head and then do what work was needed with the engine still in the vehicle.
 

I understand that you are too busy yourself to do the work ..... Here on facebook we have a mobile mechanic that is local. .... just a idea.

 

31 minutes ago, FarmerJon said:

Looking back at your previous trials and tribulations with this engine, it sounds like you already tried the running engine swap, only to be burned by a dishonest/lazy/ignorant shop.

If this is true, and the engine sat for a long time not being used, it is common also for the cast iron rings to stick to the aluminum pistons. Two dissimilar metals causing corrosion.

The rings are a spring that expand against the cylinder wall to seal. They also need to freely rotate in the ring landings of the piston.

Obviously if they are stuck to the piston they wont seal and will smoke like a freight train ..... Is possible you have just one offending piston/cylinder causing your problem.

A compression test would tell you .... also looking at the spark plugs to see which ones are oil fouled would tell you something.

 

Personally I would drop the pan and pull head ... you need to know if the cylinders have been bored in the pass to find out what size rings to order .... top of the pistons would be stamped with size .... no stamp then stock pistons ... in theory.

I would want to measure the bores looking for taper just to know what condition they are in .... Hone the cylinders and slap it back together with new rings.

Rings are fairly cheap, and if the cylinders are worn and need bored .... you will now know and can make a game plan from there.

If the Gods are smiling on you all will be fine .... if not, I bet it will at least be better and not smoke as much and you will be able to drive it again while making a game plan.

 

As far as bearings go, if you have good oil pressure the bearings are probably fine .... but inspect them for wear and replace if needed.

Again if it was rebuilt and the crank was turned, the crank will be stamped to indicate proper bearing size.

 

These engines are very forgiving, they do not have tight exact tolerances like modern engines .... No rocket scientist needed to work on one.

Seems you should be able to find someone that can help.

 

Machine shops are crazy, seems like they might be getting forced out by rules and regulations ..... there are very few left out there.

I talked to one last week about a short block for my wife car. Is a fair price, no core needed they have the block in stock. Pay 1/2 down and takes 3 months to build it.

And it is a 3.5 hour drive one way to pick it up ... closest shop I could find.

There is a shop closer, but they only do specialty work for off road construction vehicles. And thinking they may add automotive down the road.

[Sniper]

It's crazy.  There is NOTHING unique or difficult about these engines.  One of the reasons I got my 51 was to teach my son the basics and there is nothing more basic than the 51, lol.

 

Then I threw him into the middle of the lake to teach him how to swim (got him a 2015 BMW 535 and he does the maintenance on it).

 

What I suspect is the real reason is that it is a rare, these days, engine that the shop may have no idea where to get parts and they do;t want to deal with the potential hassle.  Since you are an OTR trucker any chance you could drop it off somewhere?  I know the Model A guys have a listing of machine shops that cater to their stuff.  Got to be one of those shops near you that shouldn't be afraid to machine your stuff.   

 

 

[bamfordsgarage]

That is a tough situation. I’m new to your story… is the engine in the car and running now?  
 

If so and you landed a decent shop to do the rebuild, would you do the R & R yourself or prefer to drop off the car and pickup when done?

[Tom Skinner]

Librado65,

Since 1973 at the Chrysler Car Shows on Top of Eagle Rock Avenue West Orange New Jersey in the early 1970's where I went to Chrysler Cars Shows and Walter Percy Chrysler ran his first Cars up and down The Orange Mountains in the 1924 and 1925 test Drives from 112 Mechanic Street in Newark New Jersey and Elizabeth New Jersey, with the help of Fred Zeder, Carl Breer, and Qwen Skeleton, The Eagle Rock Avenue Mountain Climbs in West Orange New Jersey, there is nothing stopping you from doing a Ring Job on your Chrysler and fixing it yourself. YOU CAN DO THIS! Let no one or nothing tell you different.

You also need a set of feeler gauges I didn't mention earlier. As Sniper said this is simple stuff DO IT. Screw all the little Shi-t as-es that tell you different. It is simple mechanics. Take your time and do it right. The people you have been talking to are full of Sh-t. A Ring Job is a two day Cake Walk. I am 67 and could knock it out for you in one day.

These young mechanics are Nancy Boys. They couldn't tare the ass of a rag doll. Just pull up your Boot Straps and Knock it out.

Good Luck!

Tom Skinner

Huntersville,

North Carolina

[librado65]

Well the situation is I bought the car running and in good original condition several years ago. Then the original engine threw a rod, basically exploded and cracked. So a guy from one of the FB groups sold me another 230 engine. I took it to a shop (that is all about working on classic cars) and told them that before they install the engine, I wanted to know if engine needed an overhaul. They said not necessary and any smoke was due to old engine oil just burning. Well, several years later, car still smokes like a train. 

 

I would tinker on it but I just dont have time like I used to anymore and quite frankly I dont have the energy. I drive across the country 4 weeks at a time and only come home for a week. During that week, I try to catch up on family, friends, sleep, catch up on house work and chores. I also drive a company truck and haul Tanker so I cannot take the engine with me. 

 

Im just trying to find a reliable mechanic/shop that'll take on the job since I'm willing to pay for their work/service obviously. But man on man is it becoming hard for me. I would go ahead and do the v8 swap if need be, just to be able to drive the car again...but even that hasn't yielded me any results. 

 

Thanks for allowing me to vent. I just never thought I'd feel so sad about a car as if it were a person.

[soth122003]

librado65, 

I kinda feel your pain. I have COPD and a bad hip, which makes working heavier projects daunting. I am going to rewire my car, but I don't have the energy or flexabilty to do it myself. Trying to find a good shop to do it is next to impossible. Same with upholstry and other things that are easy (20 years ago) but time consuming. Since the electrics and mechanics are so easy on these old cars, and I know how to do them but no longer have the energy, I am thinking to hire an apprentice. Some one who can be my hands and body to work under my direction. They don't have to be skilled but should have a mechanical aptitude. The pay can be hourly or per job. Like your ring job maybe $200.00 for about 4-5 hours worth of work. or $20 an hour to rewire under the dash. A good source might be a friend who has a kid who needs a couple of bucks. Maybe a young mechanic at a shop who wants to make a few dollars on the side (Jiffy lube does not pay that well after all).

 

This thought just hit me, a Trade school has kids that pay to be there. Might be a good source for help. They also might do jobs like ring and valves to teach the students. My dad took wielding a long time ago to use his GI bill. and the school did jobs for people to help train and make money for the school. The rate was parts plus 20% for the jobs they did.

 

Just some ideas I'm kicking around while thinking outside the box. Maybe this will help maybe not. Just something to think about.

 

Joe Lee

Edited February 23 by soth122003

[9 foot box]

   I went back to your previous posts. Nov.2021. You stated that the exhaust smoke was light gray. That usually indicates a bad head gasket. Have you ever done a compression test? You have a tag of a rebuilt engine. If the head bolt torque wasn’t retorqued after the engine was ran up to operating temp and retorqued after cooling. It’s important that it’s done that way, to compress the gasket. That could be why you are having a problem. A new head gasket could be your solution.