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keithb7

Removing Thermostats?

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What was the thought process back in the day about removing thermostats in the summer?  I heard somewhere, that for some old Mopar owners this is what they did each spring. I assume the thought was the engine ran cooler? That's not the case though, correct? With the thermostat out, it actually takes the engine longer to warm up to operating temperature where it is most efficient.  Wouldn't running about with a cold engine, for a longer period of time, mean you're wasting more fuel? Contaminating and diluting the crankcase oil sooner?

 

I went into the rad and water pump of my '38 today. I found no thermostat.

 

 

 

 

 

 

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My Dad took the thermostat out of my Chevy II in the Summer when i was a kid in the 70s. He believed it would run better in the summer, he also replaced the coolant with pure water. Saying it would cool it better. No idea if it is true, Thermostats were often faulty in those days, i remember several failing. 

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Instead of changing to a 165 I'll just take out?....who knows....that misconceived idea continues to this day. 

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I don't know what sort of 'evidence' was used to assume that it was a good idea, but I know my Dad always did it on the old flat heads.  (I don't recall that he ever did on the first V8 he owned, even though it didn't have A/C.)  It was an opportunity to test the thermostat, and to give the engine a good flushing.

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I often question some of the things that were possibly common practice in days gone by.  Like what you just mentioned concerning thermostats, or my old man telling me my grandfather would build a small fire under the oil pan of their car in the winter to warm up the oil....not sure to this day if he was full of sh#@ or not.  I know my grandmother wasn't joking when she told me her alcoholic father would drop them off at church on Sundays (in the 1920s) and then go to the bar.  Then he wouldn't pick them up, they'd walk home.  Not everything that was done in the old days was right, that's for damn sure.  I'd never remove the thermostat from my 51 in any weather.

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2 minutes ago, Worden18 said:

I often question some of the things that were possibly common practice in days gone by.  Like what you just mentioned concerning thermostats, or my old man telling me my grandfather would build a small fire under the oil pan of their car in the winter to warm up the oil....not sure to this day if he was full of sh#@ or not.  I know my grandmother wasn't joking when she told me her alcoholic father would drop them off at church on Sundays (in the 1920s) and then go to the bar.  Then he wouldn't pick them up, they'd walk home.  Not everything that was done in the old days was right, that's for damn sure.  I'd never remove the thermostat from my 51 in any weather.

I wouldn't doubt someone throwing a pile of coals under there.

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Don't forget back in the day when a lot of these "habits" first started they used alcohol in the winter as an antifreeze and plain water in the summer as a coolant.  So who knows what that meant regarding thermostat operation.

 

Now days not only does not running a thermostat make it take longer to warm up effecting economy, but it also increases wear.

 

Sometimes the old ways need to be left to the old days. 

Edited by Sniper
I can't type or spell apparently

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I dug out my 1942 Dyke's manual to see if there was any mention of pulling thermostats in the summer.  There were good instructions printed. Every spring and every fall the cooling system was to be flushed out to remove rust and scale. (white scale is a result of using hard water in the system) Alcohol, or sometimes another type of anti-freeze, was added in the winter.  Alcohol would have been another expense I suppose, not needed in the summer. Cars often needed water topped off as it boiled and steamed off. I remember all the old service stations when I was a kid had air and water readily available.  For free!

 

There was no mention of removing thermostats in the summer months. I suppose many folks just did it because they didn't know any better. The spoken word is a very powerful communication method. The thermostat idea may have been just spoken word and passed along. If enough people did it, and talked about it, it must be the right thing to do? People did not have computers in their pocket to look things up. Still to this day, there are lots and lots of folks who can't tell you what a thermostat is. Open a modern car, some engines are encased in shields. The only serviceable piece is the twisty-cap-y-thingy that has the numbers "710" on it. In some ways the more things progress, the more things stay the same.

Edited by keithb7

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I always run a Tstat in my cars, but in the 1970's we used to replaced the 160 F(summer)  with a 180F or a 195F for the winters months, even put a piece of cardboard in front of the rad,,  and switch back to a 160F in the spring,,  check the cooling system and we kept the antifreeze every time, reused it & top it off with new liquid.  Also used the old ''Water pump lubricant'''

 

As for the fire or heat,   under the oil pan,, well it is still being done in the great white north, on Diesel engine,  if you had to shut the engine off for some reasons,, but usualy you leave it running 24/7 in the winter of course..lol.. 

I used a oil pan electric heater once on a diesel Jetta, warn oil, it did start like it was in the summer at -20c (-5F)

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When Germany made the mistake of rolling into the Soviet Union and old man winter hit they had to keep fires under their engines when they were shut off or they would never start.  The oil would almost go solid at winter temperatures.  Today, oils are better but block heaters are still a wise investment in colder areas, like Canada, lol.

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1 hour ago, Sniper said:

 Today, oils are better but block heaters are still a wise investment in colder areas, like Canada, lol.

 

I do not have block heater in any of my old Mopars............................................the block heater for them is my heated garage.😜

 

I have actually driven them all in pretty cold weather but they always go back in the heated garage upon return.

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Up here in Canada I've had block heaters, oil pan heaters, and battery blankets all plugged in at once before.  The snow as literally melting off the hood of the car when I came out in the morning. It was quite cold and car started up no problem! 😀 

 

I've seen magnetic electric block heaters. Also diesel/gas fired heaters with circulation pumps built in.  They can get a cooling system hot enough that the thermostat will open.

 

A tip: Ensure your clutch is pushed in for a little more starter juice when the oil is cold. A tranny in neutral still spins the countershaft assy through the thick tranny oil. This adds a load to an already burdened starting motor,

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there is no need to run a thermostat if you wish...but if you pull it, you need to install a restrictor plate that is equivalent to opening of the thermostat...this is to control the exchange rate of the water in and out of the block.....many folks overlook the total purpose of the t-stat

Edited by Plymouthy Adams

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In winter during cold spells, rather than using all the plug-ins, to save energy costs you might use one of these...

1496679358_AllstateHeater.thumb.jpg.b58880da4045bed1fd688888a1dad106.jpg

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3 hours ago, keithb7 said:

The only serviceable piece is the twisty-cap-y-thingy that has the numbers "710" on it. 

 

The "twisty-cap-y-thingy" on my truck doesn't have the numbers 710 on it. It has a picture of the thing that Genie comes out of. 

image.jpeg.cb8fa4a577a56c853dc7b169a7969353.jpeg 

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3 hours ago, Plymouthy Adams said:

there is no need to run a thermostat if you wish...but if you pull it, you need to install a restrictor plate that is equivalent to opening of the thermostat...this is to control the exchange rate of the water in and out of the block.....many folks overlook the total purpose of the t-stat

 

There was an article in Hot Rod magazine many years ago, that one should run with a thermostat all the time so as the coolant does not pass too fast through the radiator, for better cooling than running without a thermostat.....

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8 minutes ago, Bobb Horn said:

 

o

  3 hours ago, Plymouthy Adams said:

there is no need to run a thermostat if you wish...but if you pull it, you need to install a restrictor plate that is equivalent to opening of the thermostat...this is to control the exchange rate of the water in and out of the block.....many folks overlook the total purpose of the t-stat

 

There was an article in Hot Rod magazine many years ago, that one should run with a thermostat all the time so as the coolant does not pass too fast through the radiator, for better cooling than running without a thermostat.....

 
 

yes...and that is exactly why you can remove it if you wish but run a restrictor....please read all my entry...not just the NO NEED part......the full explanation is there....

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Look at it this way, the longer water is in the radiator to cool, the longer water is in the block to heat up.  Almost always, if there is a heat transfer issue with regards to high water flow, it is due to cavitation, which is probably what was going on with the Ford flathead mentioned.

 

 

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49 minutes ago, Sniper said:

Look at it this way, the longer water is in the radiator to cool, the longer water is in the block to heat up.  Almost always, if there is a heat transfer issue with regards to high water flow, it is due to cavitation, which is probably what was going on with the Ford flathead mentioned.

 

 

Agreed, the amount of heat energy lost through the radiator is the same no matter the speed since it's a recirculating system.  The net amount of time coolant is in the block or the radiator is the same no matter the speed.

 

Restrictors cause the pump to make a little pressure in the block...eliminating steam pockets (cavities) and thus keeping it from pushing coolant out the overflow due to that expansion.

 

 

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8 hours ago, Plymouthy Adams said:

 

your genie appears to be a drip......

I tell my wife that the picture shows it's supposed to leak some oil

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I’d like to ask 100 people under 30 what this symbol means.  Then break it down further. 100 men under 30. 100 women under 30. 
It would be interesting to see the results. 
 

I just asked my wife if she knew what this symbol represented. She got it right!  Mind you, 30 was a long time ago for both of us. 
 

Go ask your wife, son, daughter, nephew etc and report back!
 

 

88F21510-3412-4D9B-B60D-C654007C7E87.jpeg

Edited by keithb7

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My 23 yr old son got it right too. We’re doing something right in this household! Lol. 

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