New Black Friday Tires - One Inch Wider

[Bob Riding]

Well I've been putting off changing out my 16" Coker radials, and yesterday seemed a good time as Coker was having a 10% off sale and free shipping. I bought my current tires from Coker when they had an outlet in Fresno about 10 years ago (I thought). Turns out they are a bit older- I checked the date code (which Coker places on the inside of the tire BTW) and it is stamped  40 06, which means manufactured during the 2nd week in October 2006!  They looked fine- no obvious cracking, only minor spiderwebbing on the whitewall, but 17 years old is not as safe as I would want. 

I also increased the width from a 6.00R16 to a 7.00R16, thinking it might improve handling, especially at freeway speeds. Anyone else using 7" width radials?

[keithb7]

That date makes me a little nervous.  If Coker disclosed the tire age, good. If that info was withheld, I might make an inquiry with Coker. 
 

A quick online search revealed:

Edited November 28, 2023 by keithb7

[Ivan_B]

24 minutes ago, keithb7 said:

 If Coker disclosed the tire age, good.

I am pretty sure the date code on tires is mandatory for all manufacturers selling in the U.S. (and Canada probably has the same rules), after a certain year. I am still riding on old bias ply, no date code

[TodFitch]

1 hour ago, Ivan_B said:

I am pretty sure the date code on tires is mandatory for all manufacturers selling in the U.S. (and Canada probably has the same rules), after a certain year. I am still riding on old bias ply, no date code

When they were making the rules Coker Tire successfully lobbied to have an exception on the date code rule for collector car tires. So some collector car tires have a date code but not all do.

 

I didn’t believe that when I first heard it so I went searching on the government website for the actual rules and found the exception. Then I went looking for the explanation of how the rules were determined and found that Coker was the one behind it. Been a while so I don’t have the links but that information is probably still someplace on a government website.

[Ivan_B]

I did not know that. Okay, so maybe my tires are not as old as I expected, then ?

[Plymouthy Adams]

I clearly understand how a small date code on the backside of a reproduction WWW tire could truly affect the appearance of a mounted tire on an older car..not ..I have other comments but would not serve the forum at large as they seem to accept poor quality at high cost as the norm.  

[Bob Riding]

11 hours ago, TodFitch said:

When they were making the rules Coker Tire successfully lobbied to have an exception on the date code rule for collector car tires. So some collector car tires have a date code but not all do.

 

I didn’t believe that when I first heard it so I went searching on the government website for the actual rules and found the exception. Then I went looking for the explanation of how the rules were determined and found that Coker was the one behind it. Been a while so I don’t have the links but that information is probably still someplace on a government website.

Interesting tidbit. Wouldn't that work against Coker's intention to sell mores tires if they didn't have date codes? I'm always thinking less time has gone by than reality would suggest

[Bob Riding]

13 hours ago, keithb7 said:

That date makes me a little nervous.  If Coker disclosed the tire age, good. If that info was withheld, I might make an inquiry with Coker. 
 

A quick online search revealed:

This is what Goodyear says:

Tire Replacement – 6 Years in Service

While most tires will be replaced sooner, Goodyear recommends that any tire in service (meaning inflated and mounted on a rim of your vehicle, including your spare tire regardless of whether that tire is in contact with the roadway) 6 years or more be replaced even if such tire appears serviceable and even if it has not reached the legal treadwear limit.

[Plymouthy Adams]

DOT has no mandates.....only suggestions

 

Tire Age Limit Law

While there is no specific law, the U.S. Department of Transportation (DOT) recommends replacing passenger car and truck tires every 6 years, regardless of wear. However, they strongly advise that all tires, including spares, should be replaced after 10 years, as a precautionary measure for safety.

[soth122003]

After re-reading this thread, A lot of this tire talk seems like it boils down to age vs use vs cost. Most tires on everyday use cars have about 10-12 thousand miles a year. That to me seems to be what the DOT recommendations are aimed at with the 6 year replacement and strong advice at 10 year reguardless. 

 

Not to get off topic, I have an RV. I put about 1000 miles a year on it. It cost about $1500 at a minimum to change all 6 tires. It's kinda the same with our classics. Like Bob said in the 1st post the tires looked good but the were about 18 years old. My RV tires were 16 years old and only had 17k miles on them, but they were Michelins, a top of the line tire. When I replaced them I went with a cheaper brand because I knew I would age them out before I wore them out. The tires I put on my 48 P-15 were Nexus Steel belted radials because I knew I would age them out before i wore them out. They still look good and I take care of them but they are now about 10 years old and only have about 20k miles on them. Since I don't drive it like I stole it I will probably change them at the 15 year mark unless one goes flat, then it will be all of them.

 

I think a lot of the members here face the same conundrum. Put on the nice looking tires and then find out the years have gone by and the tires still look good. Then the question starts at the back of their mind, How much longer can i use them? If you use  your car as a daily driver locally at moderate speeds (below 50mph) vs long trippers (1000 miles +) only 2-4 times a year vs highway driving (freeway speeds) then add in the cost of changing all 4 tires and maybe the spare. If you have the money it's no problem, but if your on a budget or fixed income and it is your hobby car, the priorities vary by each individuals circumstance. (bills, new shoes for the kids, unexpected health care...etc...etc...ad infinum.)

 

I think the bottom line will boil down to the individuals risk factors and what they are comfortable with. But I will say when one tire goes flat or blows out, change them all.

 

Joe Lee

[Sniper]

Depends on how you use the car too.  Trailer queen that only drives on and off the trailer, who cares.  Daily driver?  Well you'll probably wear them out before you age them out.

 

If it's just you driving, versus the wife and kids, well I love them, sort of, lol.

[keithb7]

My concern is mainly around Coker selling brand new tires that are dated 2006.  I like to think I reset the date to 0 when I installed them. Aging typically begins at install date for me. 
 

If Coker told me “Hey we are having Black Friday sale on NOS tires. They are brand new, but manufactured in 2006. Price is 20% off”. I’d likely pass. Now, if they were 60% off that might be a risk I’d take! Lol. 

[Los_Control]

One thing I've noticed over the years .... bias ply tires often were used for trailer tires long after radials were the norm. They just seem to hold up longer to age when you have a small trailer that gets used a few times a year .... Takes longer for them to get the dry rotted sidewalls, even when they do start cracking on the sidewalls, they still good for a few more years for the occasional trip to the dump.

 

Another thing Ive noticed is the rubber gets hard as it ages. Performance tires have a speed rating on the sidewall ... they have a softer rubber compound that will really flex and grab the road. ... softer rubber wears out faster and you get less miles out of the tire for your $$

 

The average tire has a average rubber compound that is adequate for todays roads and driving/weather conditions. .... as they age though, the rubber gets harder.

They will not grip or grab the road like they use to ..... go into a panic stop and they may break into a slide losing braking power.

Go around a corner when it is raining, they may lose traction and send you into a spin. They just do not perform as well as they did when new.

 

I had a old 1960 Dodge 1/2 ton I use to drive to work. I was retreading Semi truck tires, we had a retail shop connected to our shop. I would just run free used tires on the truck. Someone would come in and buy a new set, send the old set to the junk pile ..... They were old but no cracking on the sidewall, legal tread .... I would run them.

There was a tricky double s curve near my house, every time it rained I got 1/2 way through the curves & I would go into a 180 spin. The tires while they looked good, they simply could no longer perform like originally designed. After 3 times spinning out on the corner, I put a different set of used tires on it and never spun out again.

 

Just my opinion, older tires may look fine, they may or may not explode on you .... they will not perform for you as you might expect or need.

[Bob Riding]

21 minutes ago, keithb7 said:

My concern is mainly around Coker selling brand new tires that are dated 2006.  I like to think I reset the date to 0 when I installed them. Aging typically begins at install date for me. 
 

If Coker told me “Hey we are having Black Friday sale on NOS tires. They are brand new, but manufactured in 2006. Price is 20% off”. I’d likely pass. Now, if they were 60% off that might be a risk I’d take! Lol. 

When I ordered the tires, I worked with one of their phone reps (who are actually in Chattanooga) and asked if I could get their latest batch - he contacted the warehouse with my special request. It will be interesting to see what I get! They should be here Friday- I'll report back to the Forum.

[Sam Buchanan]

51 minutes ago, keithb7 said:

My concern is mainly around Coker selling brand new tires that are dated 2006.  I like to think I reset the date to 0 when I installed them. Aging typically begins at install date for me. 
 

If Coker told me “Hey we are having Black Friday sale on NOS tires. They are brand new, but manufactured in 2006. Price is 20% off”. I’d likely pass. Now, if they were 60% off that might be a risk I’d take! Lol. 

 

If I understand Bob's original post, the 2006 tires were purchased many years ago in CA. He stated he thought it was about ten years ago but I suspect it was closer to 2006.   

 

Here is the quote from Bob's post:

 

"I bought my current tires from Coker when they had an outlet in Fresno about 10 years ago (I thought). Turns out they are a bit older- I checked the date code (which Coker places on the inside of the tire BTW) and it is stamped  40 06, which means manufactured during the 2nd week in October 2006! " 

 

Nobody has shown evidence that Coker is now selling new tires with a 2006 date code. We need to be fair and accurate. 

Edited November 28, 2023 by Sam Buchanan

[Bob Riding]

2 minutes ago, Sam Buchanan said:

 

If I understand Bob's original post, the 2006 tires were purchased many years ago in CA. He stated he thought it was about ten years ago but I suspect it was closer to 2006.   

 

Nobody has shown evidence that Coker is now selling new tires with a 2006 date code. We need to be fair and accurate. 

In buying parts, I sometimes get out ahead of my skis, and I suspect that I may have purchased them in 2008 and installed them in 2010 or so. I don't remember the 6 or 10 year rule back then, you just squirreled parts away until needed.

[Los_Control]

I certainly hope your new tires will be of current age. While I might expect Coker to have maybe 6 month - 1 year .... that would not bother me as they sell to a specialty crowd.

 

I think Keith misread .... it is your existing used tires that were born in 2006. .... My point of my long winded post, maybe your existing tires do look fine .... do not feel bad about replacing them. They will not perform well when you need them.

 

I have been doing a lot of driving the last couple weeks, have a BIL in a hospital 75 miles away in critical condition .... wife has been given full responsibility for his medical/estate decisions. ..... Lots of highway miles this month.

 

Last week a semi truck treated a intersection as a 4 way stop while I had a flashing yellow caution light .... I was 40 mph with no intention of stopping when he pulled out in front of me. I needed every bit of braking power I could get. I stopped in the middle of the intersection about 2-3 feet away from his rear axle ..... I almost spilled my beer!

 

I'm just saying it could have just as easily happened to you at 40 mph, if your old 2006 tires did not grab the road and went into a skid .... you would have hit the truck & spilled your beer 

 

Be happy you are replacing your tires .... keep the old ones around for spares or for rollers for another project .... just do not use them on something you drive.

[Ivan_B]

53 minutes ago, Sam Buchanan said:

Nobody has shown evidence that Coker is now selling new tires with a 2006 date code. We need to be fair and accurate.

That's right. If anyone did this, they would be out of business very soon. And not due to safety concerns or anything like that, no, but due to keeping unsold inventory for a long-long time. Tires are not wine or gourmet cheese, they don't become more valuable with time The longer the commodities sit unsold, the more value is lost, in this case, because the capital is not circulating and the surplus value is not being realized.

[p15-1948]

I started work for a blimp company in 1969.  Here is some data I remember about age from that time period.  OE could not be older than 24 months when shipped to OE clients (big 3).  Goodyear recommended not using tires after they reached 6 years old. 

 

I might be a little shaky on this part, after tires reached four years old, in our system, they were branded blem near the bead.  Newly manufactured tires could be branded blem if it was a cosmetic problem rather than an age issue (lots of white wall tires then).  I think the standard was a 10% discount to the customer for a blem tire.  I know most of the guys I worked with all ran blems. 

 

Tires with known minor structural issues were branded non-highway use only, or farm use only. I think these were sold at a 75% discount to the non-highway market.  There was a large dealer near us (a competitor of the blimp company) that sold farm use and non-highway tires to anyone.  You had to bring in rims and carry the tire/wheel assembly out the door, they would not mount these on cars.  I think you had to sign off that you know these were non-highway tires.

 

As tires neared five years old they would be sold to third party vendors at wholesale in very large lots.  Part of the pricing of these tires was based on how old they actually were.  A tire three months past five years old would be priced higher to the wholesaler than a tire that was six months past the five year barrier. 

 

Sorry for the long post.

 

Edited November 29, 2023 by p15-1948

[Ivan_B]

3 hours ago, p15-1948 said:

As tires neared five years old they would be sold to third party vendors at wholesale in very large lots.

Why did you have tires that were not sold, for so long? How did the company plan its annual production? Unless all of these were only 10% of the total product volume, or something like that, this sounds like a very inefficient and poorly-organized manufacturing enterprise ?

[soth122003]

9 hours ago, Sniper said:

If it's just you driving, versus the wife and kids, well I love them, sort of, lol.

Hey Sniper I love my wife too, but the 50K insurance policy....

Actually my wife hates riding in the P-15, she's like 5'1" and her feet don't quite make it to the floor, so every corner she slides across the seat back and forth.

Some one once asked me "What would you do if your wife left you or died?' I told them I'd starve to death. She takes real good care of me.

 

Joe Lee

[p15-1948]

7 hours ago, Ivan_B said:

Why did you have tires that were not sold, for so long? How did the company plan its annual production? Unless all of these were only 10% of the total product volume, or something like that, this sounds like a very inefficient and poorly-organized manufacturing enterprise ?

less than 1% of production totals

[Bob Riding]

The replacement tires showed up and I will be taking them down to a locally owned tire shop. For $110, they will demount, unmount? the old Cokers, and mount the new tires, tubes and valve stem grommets and balance all four wheels. 

The DOT date on the "new" tires is 15/22, or mid-April, 2022. 

[desoto1939]

two years ago i had 5 tires removed from the rims, installed 5 new tubes, balanced and mounted for my 1939 600x16 tires at my local PepBoys store. They charged my $17.00 for each tire. They installed the Goodyear Airwheel tire with the ribs on the outside sidewall and they where also whitewall tires.

 

Rich hartung

[Bob Riding]

Good to know. I will check them out.