Thinking about getting this 49 Special Deluxe

[JosephDR]

Hello everybody,

 

I am thinking about getting a Chevron blue '49 Plymouth Special Deluxe 4 door. It will be a daily driver for my daughter in high school. She loves it and wants this over anything available in this price range. She loves vintage bikes and cars.

 

Here is the link to the advertisement:

 

https://houston.craigslist.org/cto/d/magnolia-classic-car-plymouth-special/7348332042.html

 

Asking price is $4,000

 

Here is the ad:

"1949 plymouth for sale, partialy restored, motor is fresh rebuild, car is driveable and street legal with a little brake work, to many improvments to list here, must see and hear, price includes a seperate parts car also , so you realy get 2 complete cars, clean title for both, call for more details , cash only , no trades or other crap. Your chance to own a classic, call jimmy, show contact info
. NO TEXT, $4800 or best offer."

 

What do y'all think? I know from reading here that brakes are tricky. If I buy it I'm going to get scarebird front disk brakes and maybe a dual master cylinder. What are things that I need to look for and what are some of your concerns? 

 

I know it's missing the door card trim. I can ask about the vacuum wipers. Anything else? 

 

It looks to be a very good price, but I have not seen it yet in person. My daughter and I will be looking at it tomorrow. 

 

Is this car a P15? 

 

Thank you for your expertise and help!

Joseph 

Edited August 7, 2021 by JosephDR
added more questions

[Doug&Deb]

It’s not a P15. I believe P19 is the designation. It looks to be a good solid car. The brakes are finicky on these but homemade adjustment tools are fairly easy to make. I have a Scarebird kit on my 52 Coronet. I’m still using the original master cylinder. Your daughter has good taste and she’ll have the coolest car in the school parking lot.

[busycoupe]

I applaud your idea of resurecting a 49 Plymouth, but please do not give it to your daughter.  These cars were ok when they were built and everyone was driving the same type of car on poor roads and the usual speed driven around town was about 25 mph.  Today with normal around town speeds of 40 to 50 mph these cars are death traps.  They lack seat belts, crumple zones air bags, good suspension and brakes.  To buy and fix up a 49 Plymouth to daily driver condition will probably cost between $5000 and $10000.  For that money you can buy a road ready 10 to 15 yearold car that will serve your daughter much better.  

About 20 years ago my son, then about 20 yrs old, was riding with a friend in a nearly new Dodge Neon.  The driver zigged when he should have zagged and drove into an abuttment on an elevated road in Boston, Ma. The car was totalled, but thanks to the air bags both young men walked away from the wreck with only a few bruises. I shudder to think what may have happened if they had been in a 70 year oldcollector car.

Ok, I'll get off  my soap box now.

Edited August 7, 2021 by busycoupe

[garbagestate 44]

Looks nice. In the process of giving everything a good going over, I would get rid of the plastic fuel filter and route the fuel line a little closer to factory original. I went with a glass bowl type but anything is better than plastic.

[knuckleharley]

Just from appearances,I ain't buying the "freshly rebuilt engine".

 

I strongly suggest if you do buy it that you consider converting it over to power disc brakes up front,as well as power steering if a 16 year old girl is going to be driving it.

 

Not to mention 3 point shoulder harnesses up front,seat belts in the back,and radial tires all around.

 

A little bit of "safe" is worth more than all the "sorry" in the world.

[joecoozie]

Take a GOOD look at the rocker panels, floors, trunk floor and body mount brackets. These areas have a tendency to rot out.

My 1st daily driver was a 49 Plymouth 2-door sedan way back in 1974.

 

Also, from the stain on the front carpet, by the gas pedal, it looks like the cowl vent is leaking so really inspect those floors.

[Loren]

I had a two door in the 1970s.

It was trouble free. My Dad told me it would last forever as long as you never drove over 55 mph.

It lasted as long as I had it.

$4,000 doesn't seem too out of line.

Mine was only $150 in 1970....I got my money back a couple of years later.

[keithb7]

As cool as it is, and I don’t want to be a Debbie-Downer, I agree with the sentiment that it may not be a good idea for a young, new driver.  
 

Is there a guardian mechanic in the home to inspect the car, often? These cars need a fair amount maintenance. A fairly competent person on the tools goes a long way here too. Is there an experienced person who’ll spot car trouble on the horizon?  A decent troubleshooting mentor maybe? To help keep ownership expenses down.  Does the potential young new owner have any interest in the mechanical workings of an old car? A desire to learn?

 

These points to consider can make the experience better. Or lack of, quite bad. A $2500 modern used import car  could really go a long ways to make your life at home, a whole lot simpler. 
 

Just an opinion. 
 

 

Edited August 8, 2021 by keithb7

[RobertKB]

I agree with others. Not a great car for a newbie driver. Maybe buy it and you and your daughter can work on it. That will tell if she seriously likes and wants it. Meantime buy a decent used newer/safer car for your daughter to get some driving experience with. I have two grandsons approaching driving age and I would never let them drive one of my old cars by themselves until they are more experienced. They say they don’t build them like they used to…….and I say it’s a good thing from a safety perspective. 

Edited August 8, 2021 by RobertKB

[Bryan G]

In recent years I've owned a 49 Packard and a 49 Chrysler; both needed a lot of TLC and both had the same exact backstory: they were a good running/driving/looking car that was bought by a loving father for their teenage kid. In both cases it didn't work out and the car got parked. In both cases, by the time I got hold of it, the car had slid downhill from neglect and it took a lot of work to get close to where it was beforehand.

 

I like the idea of trying to swing 2 vehicles, one modern (can be something cheap, like a 10 year old Kia) and then this. That first year or two of driving are tough enough, judging by various family and friends (including myself.) I wasn't too rough on the body of the old Impala I started with, though I did add some dents & scrapes; constantly broke down, though. One sister totaled her first car (and nearly didn't survive) while the other really put her little car through the wringer. Just in my little rural high school class there were 2 cars totaled one year, both on the same curve.

 

That said, I love the Plymouth and if she really is committed to it, maybe you can make it work. It could be a fantastic experience for both of you and could change her life forever (in a positive way.)

[JosephDR]

Thank you all so much for your replies. My kids and I think it's a cool car and we like to get our hands dirty wrenching on cars. In 2015, I resto modded my high school ride, a 1964 VW Beetle. We had fun working on it and bringing it back to life. It is my daily driver. 

 

My daughter will be of driving age in one year. So I was thinking we would get the '49 road worthy and safe in that time frame.  

 

But I am thinking maybe y'all are right. It would probably not be good for her as her first car. Safety issues and reliability are my main concern. Even with my newly restored bug, I had little hiccups that kept the car grounded for a day or few. I wouldn't want her to go out to the school parking lot and find that she can't pull out of there due to something breaking down. 

 

We're still going to go look at the car. But, I doubt that I will buy it now that I see it in this way. 

 

For the past few days I have been looking and learning on this forum and I gotta say, you all are an amazing group of people. Very knowledgeable, helpful and kind. Thank you for your encouragement and advice. 

 

I'll keep you posted.

 

 

Edited August 8, 2021 by JosephDR
added pictures

[Dan Hiebert]

Make it and keep it reliable and safe.  As mentioned, as long as there is a "home mechanic" to putter with the car and teach your daughter how to keep it on the road, it's not a far fetched notion for it to be her first car and daily driver.  Make her do most, if not all the work on it.  If she is not willing to do the work, don't get it.  Our daughter's first car and high school daily driver was a '63 Ford Falcon.  She did most of the work on it, knew its (and her) limitations, and drove it appropriately.  Only problems she had was jealousy from other students, which I anticipated, therefore we didn't worry about exterior cosmetics until she was out of HS, which was good because it got keyed in the HS parking lot a few times.  You know your daughter and regional driving issues better than any of us ever will.  Teaching her the responsibility of self reliance (which she will need with an old daily driver) is priceless.  And it still may not work out, but hey, you'll still have that '49 in the family. 

[Sniper]

To be contrary, my 51 Plymouth will be my 16 yo son's ride.  We put in seat belts and worked over the important stuff.  Is it perfect?  Nope, but it is fun.  Since I live in a small town far away from the big city all the driving is around town.  Not worried about not being able to stop in time, or crumple zones or any of the other things other's worry about. 

[knuckleharley]

1 hour ago, Sniper said:

To be contrary, my 51  Helwill be my 16 yo son's ride.  We put in seat belts and worked over the important stuff.  Is it perfect?  Nope, but it is fun.  Since I live in a small town far away from the big city all the driving is around town.  Not worried about not being able to stop in time, or crumple zones or any of the other things other's worry about. 

Excellent,and overlooked point.

 

Whether or not an old car is an approproiate driver for a teenage girl depends on the teenage girl,and on WHERE she will be driving it. It would be  a great car for a teenage girl in a small rural town without a whole lot of traffic and full of people who mostly know her,but a horrible choice if you lived somewhere like Boston.

 

Hell,*I* wouldn't even want to drive an old car in Boston. An APC or a tank with a 50 cal maybe,but not an old car.

 

As the real estate people keep screaming,"It's all about location,location,LOCATION,dammit!".

 

Edited August 8, 2021 by knuckleharley

[Sniper]

A bit ago we had a guy here wanting to daily drive his older car in the DFW area.  I was nervous about that myself.  So, yes, where you are driving can make a difference.  We'll probably add discs here soon and a dual circuit master cylinder. 

[knuckleharley]

1 minute ago, Sniper said:

A bit ago we had a guy here wanting to daily drive his older car in the DFW area.  I was nervous about that myself.  So, yes, where you are driving can make a difference.  We'll probably add discs here soon and a dual circuit master cylinder. 

I am at the age where I PREFER cars as original as possible within reason (ain't paying  grand for a steering wheel!),but we all have to bow to reason and sanity,and common sense DEMANDS saftery upgrades like modern brakes on any car driven in city traffic. It not only protects you and the other drivers,it protects the car.

 

BTW,I feel the same way about radial tires.

[Sniper]

Just now, knuckleharley said:

BTW,I feel the same way about radial tires.

Well, I am in the process of fitting P255/50ZR17's ultra high performance all season radials in the back.  Doesn't matter how good your brakes are if the tires are so narrow that they just lock up and slide.  Haven't decided on the fronts yet.

[greg g]

Looks like the Cobb Brothers have been messing with the electrics.  Looks like a squirrels nest on the fire wall.  Looks like a Cobb Job from here. That aside and based on remarks you can probably handle that if another redo is needed. 

 

Several studies over the years point to distracted driving as the cause of most accidents involving inexperienced drivers, especially youthful inexperienced drivers.  Now a days with cell phones, texting, in car karaoke, and other distractions, driving a car that is so far out of the technology and safety envelopes makes me question the situation.  A strict no riders, no cell phone policy would be a minimum condition for use for a good long time if I were making this decision.  

[keithb7]

4 hours ago, Dan Hiebert said:

 Make her do most, if not all the work on it.  If she is not willing to do the work, don't get it.  Our daughter's first car and high school daily driver was a '63 Ford Falcon.  She did most of the work on it, knew its (and her) limitations, and drove it appropriately  Teaching her the responsibility of self reliance (which she will need with an old daily driver) is priceless.  . 

 

Your comments really ring true with me. I beat a similar drum around here. I have been for years. My sons, mechanics they aren't but if they want to own a car and drive it? A mechanic you will become. Or at least a home hack, as I label myself. I will be over their shoulder guiding. They will do it. I won't unless special circumstances.

 

Kids working on brakes...Driving and rolling to stop later, they get it. It all sinks in and comes together. How important is it now to the driver to repair the brakes right? Have the brakes performing as best they can. Take the time to educate them so they understand the workings of the brake system.  The steering, the suspension, ect..

 

 

[allbizz49]

You can drive an old car every day, I do. It's really not that big of a deal. Make sure it's mechanically up to snuff and keep her in the slow lane. She'll be fine. Me personally, i don't care for 4 doors but if she likes it, go for it. Rusty hope kit for the front and a new rear axle will take care of the finicky Lockheeds. 

[JosephDR]

Thanks for the replies, y'all. 

 

Update on the situation: My daughter and I went to see it and it needs more work put into it than we had anticipated.

 

The floors were rusted out, but surprisingly the body mounts were in good shape. The engine bay was in great condition. All the doors, hood and trunk opened and shut very well. Gaps were great. Fulton visor in the car. He had lots of old manuals, receipts, and maintenance records. There's so much about the car I liked but there was quite a bit more work to get it on the road. It needed more than brakes. I saw the driveshaft on the rear seat! 

 

The seller asked if I wanted to hear it run. I said sure! He told me he was going to get gas to pour it down the carb. Oh boy! 

 

My daughter was the first to let me know this might be too much for her to handle. I agreed and so did the guy selling it. 

 

Oh, and it's not Chevron Blue. The original color is Kitchener Green, as all the door jams were that color. 

[allbizz49]

That's too bad about the condition of the car. The right one will come up, just have to be patient. Always worth waiting for the right one. Good luck with finding one, it will happen.

[Booger]

Thats a good project car for even the most skilled in here. See if she can parrallel park it. I would want my daughter to drive a marshmellow car

[Bryan G]

On 8/8/2021 at 10:41 AM, greg g said:

Several studies over the years point to distracted driving as the cause of most accidents involving inexperienced drivers, especially youthful inexperienced drivers.  

One take on this is that it's hard to be distracted yourself while driving a car like that Plymouth; it keeps you too busy!

 

There seems to be a healthy supply of decent running, or close to running, post-war 4door Plymouths. Keep those eyes peeled!

[John Reddie]

On 8/8/2021 at 10:11 AM, knuckleharley said:

Hell,*I* wouldn't even want to drive an old car in Boston. An APC or a tank with a 50 cal maybe,but not an old car.

As a life long Massachusetts resident and have driven in Boston, I must say I totally agree with this. I do not need to go to Boston very often but when I do, the train is a blessing. 

John R