Tips on how to flush the oil on a 218 6

[OUTFXD]

Old news.  Found metal in the oil. 

 

Guy suggested that I flush the engine with Karosene Before pulling the oil pan. 

 

Got new Oil pan gaskets but it occures to me that the filler dumps straight to the Oil pan so Nothing would be washed out of... anything else.

 

Buddy suggested flushing from the Oil Filter Housing.   Sounded good, at least better than just dumping it into the oil pan.

 

Figured I would ask the experts.  Any suggestions on how to flush the Oil galleys/Anything with oil in it without running the engine?

[OUTFXD]

Is there a way, perhaps.  to turn the oil pump remotely?  Circulate the oil without turning the engine?  Would Diesel work better than Karosene?

[kencombs]

The oil pump is driven by a gear that is meshed with the camshaft.  So, it cannot turn without the cam moving.  The nature of that sort of gear only allows the cam to be the driver.

 

Flushing the oil passages seems to me to be of little value.  The vast majority of the 'stuff' will fall out of suspension in the pan, the only place the oil isn't flowing.  

 

Kerosene will have a greater solvent effect, but diesel is probably good enough.

 

Pulling the pan and doing a manual scrape and flush is much more effective.

[Sniper]

Well, the old school kerosene flush usually involved some oil some kerosene and idling the engine for some time.  Usually 1 qt of kerosene added to the old oil adn running for a half hour.

 

I don't recommend that though, unless it's a real beater engine needing resurrection.

 

 

[Los_Control]

12 minutes ago, Sniper said:

I don't recommend that though, unless it's a real beater engine needing resurrection.

 

Really interesting conversation.

I would suggest ATF to fix it.

Others suggest Kerosene.

Another suggest diesel fuel.

 

Yeah .......

 

[OUTFXD]

I am planning at least three flushes.   first two with Diesel/Karosene,  Pull the oil pan and Breakclean the tar out of everything. Add oil  and new filter Run the engine for a short period.

 

Flush oil & replace filter,  run the engine, Check the oil. Rinse and repeat until the oil appears reasonably clean.  run about 500 miles and replace oil with synthetic and a fresh filter.

 

All this is assuming things go alright.   at this point the engine blows no smoke and turns good oil pressure so I am HOPING that I caught it in time.

[Los_Control]

I always found ATF to be a thin lubricant & lubricated while it cleaned.

 

I assume diesel fuel & kerosene, simply a product I want to use for cleaning.

I certainly would not add either product to my oil while hoping to clean a engine  while driving.

 

Just saying, whoever is suggesting to add Diesel fluid to a engine oil needs clarification.

[OUTFXD]

I've used ATF as well.  From de-mucking transes to removing the oxidization from the fake wood paneling on a Pinto wagon (no kidding). 

 

I think it would be a bit expensive for flushing out the engine.  going to need 2-3 gallons.

[Eneto-55]

I have flushed out an engine with used ATF - It had sat & settled for a long time, then I also either filtered it or just poured off of the top.  I had first drained the oil, and the filter, then put the old filter back on (I think - it was many years back, like around 15 years ago).  I idled the engine for 3 minutes - timed.  I also had my hand right by the ignition key the whole time, in case I heard anything at all that was slightly abnormal.  Then I drained the ATF, which was now very black, changed the filter, and put in fresh oil.  Before that the oil quickly turned black after an oil change, but it stayed clean looking for a long time after that.  Since then I've heard of using diesel, and actually revving the engine or driving it, but I wouldn't dare do that myself.  (That was one of the vehicles that I should have left on the used car lot.  But I needed a PU, and didn't have the cash for a better one.  I say that, but I got a lot of years out of that Chevy S-10.)

[kencombs]

Actually, #2 diesel is a fairly good lube, the higher the sulphur content the better it works as a lube.  It is the only source of lube for a lot of injector pumps, that was the major concern when the limits were applied..   I don't think I would ever operate an engine under load with it as the sole source of lubrication, but wouldn't hesitate to add a quart to 4 of oil and run at idle.  

 

I just don't see a need to do that if the pan is pulled to clean it out.  Stuff that is stuck in the valve chamber, oil passages, timing cover etc, isn't going hurt anything, ...until it's jarred loose by a flush.  Then it moves to the pan, and gets picked up by the oil pump.  With a bypass filter system (or non) it then goes first to the bearings.

[OUTFXD]

To clear things up.  I am only planning to flush with Karosene/Diesel.   not run it.  Not Mix it with oil and run it. 

 

Just wash out all the pesky particles I can before dropping the oil pan and cleaning out everything.

 

Just trying to get everything as clean as possible.

[chris 48 P15]

i would pull the pan first to clean out then if you want.  do the motor flush

i don't think flushing without running will do anything

the pan holds years of sludge and may loosen with flush chemicals if ran without cleaning pan first.

also if you use detergent oils this ill flush and lube the engine.  pan must be cleaned first

[Sniper]

the question becomes, regardless of how you do the flush, is what are you going to do with the kerosene when you are done??

 

 

[Booger]

My co worker at my local service station would do a yearly oil change flush with 4 qts oil and 1 qt kerosene. (we sold white gas too in bulk)

fill, run for 5 mins, and then drain. Fill again with fresh oil. Seemed to have good results. The only trouble was oil was so clean couldnt read it on the dipstick. If you suspect years of sludge build up, drop the pan and clean before hand

[Bryan]

11 hours ago, Booger said:

My co worker at my local service station would do a yearly oil change flush with 4 qts oil and 1 qt kerosene. (we sold white gas too in bulk)

fill, run for 5 mins, and then drain. Fill again with fresh oil. Seemed to have good results. The only trouble was oil was so clean couldnt read it on the dipstick. If you suspect years of sludge build up, drop the pan and clean before hand

That's how I got mine to knocking in the mid 90s. I didn't pull the pan though.   Should definitely pull the pan and clean. I found a LOT of sludge in the valve area, may want to take covers off and clean that out. Also in the bypass oil filter cannister, a LOT of sludge.  Don't know how much would be in the pump itself.

[DJK]

My concern would be, where did the metal come from?????

[Dodgeb4ya]

4 hours ago, DJK said:

My concern would be, where did the metal come from?????

Winner!

[OUTFXD]

Flushed twice then dropped the oil pan.  Still a bunch of sludge in the bottom of the oil pan along with some alarmingly large chunks.  Noticed the gasket that bridges to left and right sides on the back of the oil pan was about 1/3 missing.

 

Began cleaning out the oil pan with mineral spirits and realized the large chunks where bits of cork from the missing part of the gasket.

 

Cleaned the block with Breakclean. Pistons look new. Cylinder walls look good. No play in the connecting rod ends.

 

There is scoring on the inside of the oil pan .  looks like one of the connecting rods let loose and creased the oil pan. 

 

my theory at this point is the bad fuel pump diluted the oil until one of the connecting rods went.  The then owners pulled the engine and did a rebuild.  they replaced the engine WITH the bad fuel pump (Not realizing it was the issue).  and replaced the oil pan without cleaning it.

 

May be true, may be totally off base.  but its the only explanation I could come up with that fits the facts.

[Sam Buchanan]

I sure do like the fuel pump on my P15.   

 

[OUTFXD]

After mission report.   Flushed with Kerosene twice.   the first time it came out deep black.  the second kind of foggy.

 

Removed the Oil pan.  a little sludge left in the bottom and in the corners where the baffles prevent good flow. Cleaned it real good.

 

Breakcleaned the tar out of the inside of the motor. No play on the bearings. cylinders looks good. Pistons look NEW.

 

Put it all back together.  and filled it with cheap-o 10-30

 

Solenoid still clicks. Starter STILL drags.

 

But she runs like she has a purpose. Much more throttle response.

 

Interestingly the oil pressure dropped from 60+psi constantly  to 42-50psi depending on load.

 

carburator stays full of fuel.

Edited July 21, 2022 by OUTFXD

[SteveR]

I have a 1937 Plymouth and my starter is foot operated. I manually engage the starter gear to the flywheel So I am a bit confused. Do you have a solenoid on the starter that engages the starter gear to the flywheel or are you calling the relay on the inner fender the Solenoid?

[DJK]

17 hours ago, Sam Buchanan said:

I sure do like the fuel pump on my P15.   

 

Looks like the one on my P23!!!!

[OUTFXD]

9 hours ago, SteveR said:

I have a 1937 Plymouth and my starter is foot operated. I manually engage the starter gear to the flywheel So I am a bit confused. Do you have a solenoid on the starter that engages the starter gear to the flywheel or are you calling the relay on the inner fender the Solenoid?

The relay on the Inner fender.  There is no solenoid on the starter.

[SteveR]

10 hours ago, OUTFXD said:

The relay on the Inner fender.  There is no solenoid on the starter.

So the relay is clicking correct? It sounds like a voltage/amperage problem to the coil of the relay. Check for a poor ground connection or too small gauge of wires and your voltage underload.