Cleaning underside - about to lift body

[RobertKB]

Glad it worked out and that it turned out safely! ?

[Bryan]

Got the motor in the garage.  Had a slight mishap and rode the see saw.  Didn't get hurt or damage anything. 

 

Also, oil pan had a small hole in it looks from rust. Pan was dry and caked inside, maybe most of it dried up.  Going back out to look for any number on crank (if it was turned).  Crank doesn't appear rusty, just caked in dried oil.

[Rodney_Hamon]

Boy. When a man wants an engine...he gets one.  No matter what. Bravo!  Glad to see it in the shop.  

[keithb7]

Oh boy. Quite a corroded mess. I had my fingers crossed for something a bit better looking. Must have been out there in the forest for many decades.  I'd be looking around for more engine options. If you are patient they are out there. I have had many options for used engines cross my path over the past 4 years.

[nonstop]

Too bad you are so far away… I have a freshly machined crank and I think one that needs machining…. Not feasible to ship!

Edited August 7, 2022 by nonstop

[Veemoney]

Should clean up, don't throw in the towel yet

Edited August 7, 2022 by Veemoney

[Bryan]

4 hours ago, keithb7 said:

Oh boy. Quite a corroded mess. I had my fingers crossed for something a bit better looking. Must have been out there in the forest for many decades.  I'd be looking around for more engine options. If you are patient they are out there. I have had many options for used engines cross my path over the past 4 years.

We're away for a while. When I get back I'll measure the journals.  I think that one main is really ground down. Ridge is so high you can see it from 5 ft away. I'm going to start a motor parts warehouse. ?

[keithb7]

I do have a crank for a 25” long 4 1/16” stroke Mopar FH engine.  Of little use to you from way over here though. 

[Bryan]

Back from vacation. Removed Fluid Drive and timing/crank gears. Removed all manifold bolts but manifolds won't come off. Don't want to crack this one like the last.

 

Think the Fluid Drive is toast.  The clutch plate turning feels like it has gravel inside. Plate wobbles.  Took the transmission out while car was in the woods. Thought I had the angle right pulling it out using transmission stand.  Not sure. Given the condition of the motor no telling. FD might have already been like that.

[Sam Buchanan]

Those photos make one wonder if the oil was ever changed in that engine............

[kencombs]

1 hour ago, Sam Buchanan said:

Those photos make one wonder if the oil was ever changed in that engine............

That used to be a common look in the 60s when a lot of oil was of the paraffin based variety and most cars on the road had no PCV system.   Road draft a ventilation just doesn't work a low speeds.  Condensation, short trips with cool engines Pennzoil of the day.   I've seen Y-block fords (famous for low oil flow to the valve train) whose rocker arms were making impressions in the sludge on the valve covers.To ice the cake, oil changes may not have been frequent either. 

 

Really common on the typical 'cream puff', the low mileage, driven on on Sundays to church kind. 

 

OTOH, my Grandad bought a new 55 Ford, in about 60 Dad tore it down and did an overhaul.  It had well over 150K on it, but had been driven on a long daily commute, all highway miles.   Same oils but highway speeds, always at good operating temp and oil changed regularly.  Clean as a pin inside, and took std size rings and bearings.  Timing chain must have had at least an inch of play though.

 

 

Edited August 16, 2022 by kencombs

[Sniper]

That is definitely one of the better things about today's oils, paraffin isn't an issue.  My core 230 I am building is clean inside, not sure about it's history though.

[Los_Control]

Think it was around 1980 I bought a 1972 Ford 2 door Grand Torino. Sweet car, baby blue with a white vinyl top.

Had a 6 cyl engine and it sounded terrible. Lifters clacking .... The engine looked just like the photos above when I removed the valve cover.

As a kid working at the Union 76 gas station I paid less then $200 for it.

 

Just saying running a few oil changes through it adding 20% ATF to the oil. I drove it a few hundred miles .... I kept pulling the valve cover to check progress .... within 6 or 8 weeks that engine looked & ran like new & sold the car for $600.

 

As @Snipersays, paraffin was a issue back in the day.

Back in the day it could be cleaned up .... been sitting in the woods oil changes would not help it today.

[Bryan]

Crankshaft # 2 & 3 mains have the ridge in the middle on one side. One of the rods (forgot #) looked weird, grainy texture. Looks like they run it stopped up with sludge.  Worked from 8:30 tl 4pm..wore out. Will clean the garage up tomorrow and measure the crank, take better pics.

 

 

[Bryan]

On 7/3/2022 at 9:02 AM, Bryan said:

 

The engine machine shop referred me to the guy who turns crankshafts, boy he was a character.  I told him about my crank, the engine type and that I thought I had warped it.  He said no you didn't.  You're not racing it with 13 CR are you?  Then don't worry about it, probably like that since 48.  He was borderline rude. Waste of time, etc. even saying I must worry when I run over a pothole.  He asked the right questions, deck flat, did piston heights change progressively?, etc.. but acted like I was a waste of his time.  

[kencombs]

1 hour ago, Bryan said:

The engine machine shop referred me to the guy who turns crankshafts, boy he was a character.  I told him about my crank, the engine type and that I thought I had warped it.  He said no you didn't.  You're not racing it with 13 CR are you?  Then don't worry about it, probably like that since 48.  He was borderline rude. Waste of time, etc. even saying I must worry when I run over a pothole.  He asked the right questions, deck flat, did piston heights change progressively?, etc.. but acted like I was a waste of his time.  

Pay attention to the message, not the messenger.   Lots of really knowledgeable people have poor people skills.  I decided years ago separate the delivery from the content and learn from the best I could find, not the friendliest.  some of the best advice I've received came from the least pleasant sources.

[47 dodge 1.5 ton]

 He was most likely verifying in his mind that the crank was not the issue. 

[Bryan]

What a day. Yesterday I cut grass to relax. Today's goal was to remove the pistons from the "woods car" block, and put the block and all spare parts in the old shed.

 

As in normal mechanic work, one freaking piston had to be stubborn.  Others were a little difficult, but one was extreme.

 

Would not budge, so I finally took a very large coal chisel and broke the aluminum out around the piston pin, removed the rod, then was using a large brass punch underneath the crown. Was not stuck on the ridge at the top of the block, was at the bottom.   Got to the oil rings and broke the aluminum around them. 

 

Nope, wouldn't move. I finally got my drill and drilled several holes in a circle underneath the piston crown.  Then I knocked the middle of the crown out with a punch. Hoping to weaken it and relieve pressure on the rings. Tapped more on the remainder of the crown and the piston slowly came out.

 

I tossed the rod for that cylinder. Banged it so much it had to be bent.

 

Then I loaded the block on my dolly and pushed/pulled it to the shed. In soft sand.   Did the same for the fluid drive, oil pan, head etc.   Cleaned the garage up some and took off the trash to the dump.

 

I am worn out.  Did an 8 am to 3pm day.   Can't hardly get around I'm so tired.

[Bryan]

Cut more grass today and cleaned all the tools up.  Took the pistons off the rods.  5 & 6 were spinning the bearings in the lower rod ends. 5 looked grainy and worn like the journal.   Found the end cap for #3 that I beat out. Seems the bearing was spinning in lower #3 also.

 

Checked the rest of the rods, appear to be straight.  So I have spare 1, 2 & 4 rods.

[Bryan]

On 8/17/2022 at 5:10 PM, Bryan said:

Crankshaft # 2 & 3 mains have the ridge in the middle on one side. One of the rods (forgot #) looked weird, grainy texture. Looks like they run it stopped up with sludge.  Worked from 8:30 tl 4pm..wore out. Will clean the garage up tomorrow and measure the crank, take better pics.

 

 

After today's work, it's noted that the crudded up engine from the Dodge in the woods had the #2 & 3 mains wore out.   Same mains with the smaller holes from the oil galleries. 

[Bryan]

Finally got the master cylinder off. Everything removed from under the car. Started using paint scrapers to get off the loose stuff and grease/dirt.  Hate using sanding wheels on a grinder first and having it fling crap all over.

 

Seems like the frame is in better shape than it looked, just surface rust.  Also floor bottoms aren't too bad.

 

Some kind of weird thick coating on the leaf springs. Scraped it off, loose in places.

 

[Sniper]

That stuff on the leafs is probably fossilized grease

[Bryan]

2 hours ago, Sniper said:

That stuff on the leafs is probably fossilized grease

It was strange. Looked like a mixture of mud & grease, but very hard. Didn't know whether it was some applied undercoating protection or just accumulated.   I might re-coat them in grease when I'm finished.

[DonaldSmith]

It may have been grease, oozed out from between the spring leaves.

 

My rear springs squeaked twenty year ago when I got the car.  The Shop Manual showed a sheet lead wrapping on the spring leaves, with a grease fitting.  Too complicated and too rare.   bought PVC interlayers from a speed shop - no more squeak.   

[Los_Control]

Undercoating is not something I deal with in my neck of the woods.

While many people go to great lengths to undercoat vehicles in the snow belt.

 

I know of a person that uses bar oil for a chainsaw. They thin it down with kerosene then spray the whole undercarriage of a car for protection. The kerosene evaporates & nothing left but oil

 

I'm thinking the grease on the leaf springs may have been from a loose Hog. When the Hog was caught & smoked up for bacon, the fat was melted down & used on the springs for lubrication. Common practice in 1950's

 

Just a guess