Thermostat Advice 180 instead of 160 degree?

[PT81PlymouthPickup]

After reading a bunch (and getting more confused),  I"m considering replacing my 160 stat with a 180 degree thinking it is likely better for my engine and might give me a little more warmth from the heater?

 

"Vintage Power Wagons" sell an NOS Mopar 180 degree stat that looks like the original type. VPW part #CC1407937 for $20. There's a note on the bottom of the page stating that in some cases a 1/32 hole should be drilled in the top plunger to allow some circulation before the stat opens and to vent air better? Anyone have any experience with this? Seems like a good deal if it fits properly?

 

[Plymouthy Adams]

I never install any thermostat without the jiggle button that I do not drill the burping hole....

[lostviking]

Isn't there a conversion to a modern thermostat? I thought I saw a thread on here doing just that.

[Plymouthy Adams]

yes there is...if that is what you wish to do......quick search should net not only part numbers but also a picture.

[Plymouthy Adams]

believe this is the new retrofit....

 

Thermostat - Standard - 160F THM 55 | Buy Online - NAPA Auto Parts (napaonline.com)

[lostviking]

35 minutes ago, Plymouthy Adams said:

believe this is the new retrofit....

 

Thermostat - Standard - 160F THM 55 | Buy Online - NAPA Auto Parts (napaonline.com)

Does that fit the 46 thermostat housing? 

[Plymouthy Adams]

did you cross reference this at all......they are also available in 180 degree...be proactive a bit.....

[Jerry Roberts]

[Worden18]

Try the VPW 180.  160 is too cool for decent heat.  My truck has never overheated with its 180 thermostat even in the hottest weather.  And I'm grateful for the heat now that the weather is cold 

[PT81PlymouthPickup]

11 hours ago, Worden18 said:

Try the VPW 180.  160 is too cool for decent heat.  My truck has never overheated with its 180 thermostat even in the hottest weather.  And I'm grateful for the heat now that the weather is cold 

Yeah! I think that's what I'll do. I'm hoping it doesn't require any adaptation? Not that I'm against adapting a modern stat, but if I can find one that fits the housing properly, I'd rather go that route. I was hoping someone else here installed the VPW part #CC1407937 with success?

[Worden18]

3 hours ago, PT81PlymouthPickup said:

Yeah! I think that's what I'll do. I'm hoping it doesn't require any adaptation? Not that I'm against adapting a modern stat, but if I can find one that fits the housing properly, I'd rather go that route. I was hoping someone else here installed the VPW part #CC1407937 with success?

The previous owner did a lot of the work on my truck.  Radiator flush, thermostat, etc.  So I don't know what installing the VPW one would entail.  Someone will chime in.  

[JBNeal]

additional information - parts manual interchange

[lostviking]

23 hours ago, Plymouthy Adams said:

did you cross reference this at all......they are also available in 180 degree...be proactive a bit.....

Is that directed at me? If so I did use the what it fits section on the website...all it said was no it doesn't fit a 46.

[Plymouthy Adams]

it was a single application listing for sure...that is however not saying it was only a single application.....plug this into a search engine and you get your full application....odds are this guy bought it for his 46 and thus just listed it as such as he also did not connect the dots either limiting his own buying field.  This is what I mean in being proactive and that is not meant in a derogative manner either....if handed/get/find a lead...run with it....

[lostviking]

None taken. I'm still learning about this 70+ year old stuff. The oldest I've worked on before was late 60's muscle cars.

 

Now that I've done a bit more reading, I guess I know that I have a external bypass thermostat (?). That hose at the front being the bypass line.

 

I should flush my cooling system anyway so I'll take a look at what is in there now and change to a 180 if necessary.

[Young Ed]

8 minutes ago, lostviking said:

None taken. I'm still learning about this 70+ year old stuff. The oldest I've worked on before was late 60's muscle cars.

 

Now that I've done a bit more reading, I guess I know that I have a external bypass thermostat (?). That hose at the front being the bypass line.

 

I should flush my cooling system anyway so I'll take a look at what is in there now and change to a 180 if necessary.

Go to Napa and order that thm55. I think thm155 is the 180 version but that's just off the top of my head. Rock auto doesn't show them under 47 truck but 47 dodge car will get you multiple options for 160 and 180

[greg g]

Installing a 180 degree thermostat will not assure your car will run down the road at 180 degrees.  The temp rating on the stat is when it begins to open to allow coolant to circulate to the radiator.  Plus  when you factor in the heater core, and 30 degree temperatures at 50 mph, your 180 Stat might not ever open or fully open.  Some where I read that the heater core can contribute nearly 40 percent of the cooling ability of the system in cold ambient when flowing at full open valve.  So if you are driving around in 20 degree temp waiting for the coolant temp to open the radiator, on short trips, it might not happen

 

 I believe mine is a 160, my car runs pretty consistent 170.  Heater puts out plenty of hot air.  Driven in comfort at Temps in the mid 20s  with the valve wide open and the fan on medium.

 

I do remember my dad ran a piece of old carpet which covered about half of the radiator. He made it like a Roman shade so it could be rolled up or down as Temps dictated, with a string and dowel set up. His 49 dodge wayfarer was always toasty inside.  My mother had a low tolerance for cold places.

[PT81PlymouthPickup]

4 hours ago, greg g said:

Installing a 180 degree thermostat will not assure your car will run down the road at 180 degrees.  The temp rating on the stat is when it begins to open to allow coolant to circulate to the radiator.  Plus  when you factor in the heater core, and 30 degree temperatures at 50 mph, your 180 Stat might not ever open or fully open.  Some where I read that the heater core can contribute nearly 40 percent of the cooling ability of the system in cold ambient when flowing at full open valve.  So if you are driving around in 20 degree temp waiting for the coolant temp to open the radiator, on short trips, it might not happen

 

 I believe mine is a 160, my car runs pretty consistent 170.  Heater puts out plenty of hot air.  Driven in comfort at Temps in the mid 20s  with the valve wide open and the fan on medium.

 

I do remember my dad ran a piece of old carpet which covered about half of the radiator. He made it like a Roman shade so it could be rolled up or down as Temps dictated, with a string and dowel set up. His 49 dodge wayfarer was always toasty inside.  My mother had a low tolerance for cold places.

This thermostat stuff gets kinda confusing for what seems like should be a simple thing! Lols!  I'm getting a headache! Anyhow, I remember some of the old cars that came to my dad's repair shop in the winter having radiators blocked with cardboard and such. Not so sophisticated as your dad's setup. I also remember my dad telling me that wasn't a good practice, because people would forget to take it out. Then on a warmer day could be overheating. I recently took my 39 truck on a couple hour cruise. The indicated engine temp was right at 160. The morning temp. was in the high 30s. It wasn't "toasty" at all in the cab. Geez! Maybe it's my blood circulation that's the issue? Lols! Anyhow, my thinking is; it might take a bit longer to open, but after that happens the stat should regulate the temp to it's rating. Seems logical what you are saying about extremely cold days. There also seems to be a few guys on here that believe running our engines a bit warmer is better for longevity?

[greg g]

To toss in another aspect back in the  days before before permanent anti freeze, you would drain half the coolant then put in alcohol to keep it from freezing up.  I believe lower temp stats were suggested to keep the alcohol from prematurely evaporating.

 

Dad always put 2 trouble lamps in after the car was parked inthe garage.  One with a hundred watt bulb went in next to the battery, and a75 watt beside the float bowl. And a moving blanket covered the hood to keep the warm air in.  I don't know if they were effective, but I don't remember days when it failed to start and get him to work.

 

Then the neighbor turned him on to block heaters.  He also bought a heated dip stick that went into mom's Rambler.

 

https://www.tractorsupply.com/tsc/product/kats-engine-heaters-dip-stick-heater-191932?cm_mmc=feed-_-GoogleShopping-_-Product-_-191932&gclid=EAIaIQobChMI7r_DyeC-9AIVkb7ICh19VQdTEAQYAiABEgICX_D_BwE

[TodFitch]

1 minute ago, greg g said:

To toss in another aspect back in the  days before before permanent anti freeze, you would drain half the coolant then put in alcohol to keep it from freezing up.  I believe lower temp stats were suggested to keep the alcohol from prematurely evaporating. . .

I have wondered a bit about this. The “Instruction Book” (i.e. owners manual) that came with my car when it was new in 1933 lists ethylene glycol anti-freeze and gives suggested concentrations for various temperatures.

 

My father was born in 1926 so he was 6 years old when my '33 was built, far too young to drive or own a car. So I think tales about alcohol based anti-freeze solutions must be from my grandfathers' generation (one born in 1896 the other in 1898) rather than from my (and I assume your) father’s generation.

 

Or maybe the alcohol based anti-freeze was so much cheaper that there were people who put up with its limitations long after ethylene glycol was available and recommended. (To be fair, the 1946-54 Plymouth Factory Service Manual still mentioned alcohol based anti-freeze solutions so they were still around 20 years after my '33 was built.)

[JBNeal]

the link I posted listed only the 180°F thermostats as I am a firm believer that running a hotter flathead assists in removing moisture from the crankcase to prevent sludge formation.  As 20th century internal combustion engines evolved, cooling systems became pressurized with 180° and 195° thermostats to reduce sludge formation.  There's nothing wrong with going the 160° route, but this technology has been around for decades, so why not use it to head off a problem before it starts?

[Young Ed]

54 minutes ago, JBNeal said:

the link I posted listed only the 180°F thermostats as I am a firm believer that running a hotter flathead assists in removing moisture from the crankcase to prevent sludge formation.  As 20th century internal combustion engines evolved, cooling systems became pressurized with 180° and 195° thermostats to reduce sludge formation.  There's nothing wrong with going the 160° route, but this technology has been around for decades, so why not use it to head off a problem before it starts?

I would agree if other upgrades are done to get the system pressurized. My stuff is still stock no pressure so I run the 160s. 

[JBNeal]

To clarify, I am advocating the use of the 180°F thermostat, but pressurized systems were not used on pre-war flatheads, W-, B- or C-series flatheads and would require updating the radiator and possibly the optional heater core.

[PT81PlymouthPickup]

I believe the only advantage of pressurized systems was to further raise the boiling point of the coolant. A 50/50 ethylene glycol / water mix would boil around 227 degrees at atmospheric pressure. The same 50/50 mix would not boil until 252 degrees at 10psi on the system. I agree our systems were not designed to be pressurized. I doubt it would be wise to try that? A 20 degree thermostat increase is still amply below the below the boiling point. I do agree running our old engines at slightly higher operating temperature is likely to be better at keeping the engine cleaner, especially if a pcv system has been added. Less likely to build up moisture in the crankcase. Another thing my dad used to remind me, was to never go over the 50/50 mix. UN-reduced ethylene glycol can pass through gaskets due to it's lubricity and cause leaks.

[TodFitch]

48 minutes ago, PT81PlymouthPickup said:

I believe the only advantage of pressurized systems was to further raise the boiling point of the coolant. . .

The bigger the temperature difference between the coolant and the ambient air, the smaller the radiator has to be to transfer the heat energy. By going to a pressurized system to get a higher boiling point on the coolant they could put a smaller, cheaper, radiator into the car. Or, given the era, they could put a bigger V8 engine in the car without having to put a bigger radiator.