Newbie with my first project car.

[DC_Maidens]

Hello everyone. I am both new to this Forum and a new owner of a 1937/38 Dodge Sedan 2-door (Canadian built).

 

Before I start asking questions that have been asked/answered a million times; What are some great threads, books, websites, etc. to read first?

 

 

Background:

This is my first vintage car build. Prior to that I've worked on '80's and up, but only mechanical repairs and maintenance. So this is the car I'll be cutting my teeth on in terms of restoration/modification.

 

The Dodge has either a 201 or 218 flathead-6 in it. The engine and transmission are seized, and the engine is missing a lot of small bolt on parts. The fenders and running boards are in rough but repairable shape. The rest of the car (and floor!) are in really great shape. Just a few rust spots but nothing major. Missing the drivers side head light, passenger side tail light and glove box. Front windshield needs to be replaced. No seats or interior panels - also means no rodents! I do have seats to install though. All the usual stuff is, of course, to be replaced. The grill and ornaments were removed to prevent theft and are in my shop.

 

I just bought a 251 flathead-6 from a late '50's Dodge truck with a 3-speed manual gearbox. The engine was rebuilt but has sat for 10 years and is seized, I am in the process of getting it to move. This engine has all the parts though and it was $100 CAD. A deal I couldn't refuse.

[keithb7]

Welcome to the best place in the universe for vintage flathead Mopars!

 

I like your car, as I also own 2 1938 Canadian built Mopars. Where are you located?

 

Books, I can recommend a few that I own:

The original Canadian shop manual for your year. Covers Dodge, Desoto, Plymouth and Chrysler.

A 8th edition Motors Manual is a great supplement.

Dykes Automotive Encyclopedia. To learn all the foundational stuff about these old cars. Pick one printed in about 1942.

Chrysler Corp of Canada  Parts List. I have the 1938 edition

 

I run my own You Tube Channel featuring repairs and maintenance on my old Mopars. Might be some info here that interests you.

Seen here:   https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCVoBq2i7wl4w0W4JB6cAMjg

 

1938 Dodge specs in my manual shows it would have had a 218. To confirm, 

measure how long the block is in your car now. 23" it could be a 201 ci. 25" long would be a Canadian 218.  Your newly acquired 251 is 25" long.

If you have a 23", putting in a 25" will take some extra modifications. We can talk about that if needed.

 

You should know the Canadian built 218 has a 25" long block. The American 218 is a 23" long block. The two engines are very different and many internal parts are not interchangeable.

 

 

Edited December 23, 2022 by keithb7

[sidevalvepete]

Welcome aboard from down under. I too have a soft spot for these era mopars. I endorse Keith's advice on the books. They aren't hard to acquire as they are traded often on the various online platforms. Keith's videos are also outstanding. Courtesy of the forum you will be able to find various sources of parts for the things you need. Sometimes takes a while but with your choice of project I think you will be able to track down anything you need. I did the same over a long period of time. Can be very satisfying and the journey is a lot of fun. Good luck and keep us up to date how you are doing. ?

[SteveR]

Welcome to the group. I am sure we are all interested in seeing your progression. Take lots of photos and let us know how you're getting on.

[RonJ]

Welcome to the group from another Newbie and Canadian.

Members here have been very helpful as I slip deeper into the rabbit hole,

 

[MarcDeSoto]

The Chrysler mechanic filmstrips are excellent things to watch, or you can download the digitized booklets.  You can find them at MyMopar.com.  

 

https://mymopar.com/chrysler-master-tech-service-conference-library/

[Los_Control]

21 hours ago, DC_Maidens said:

I just bought a 251 flathead-6 from a late '50's Dodge truck with a 3-speed manual gearbox. The engine was rebuilt but has sat for 10 years and is seized, I am in the process of getting it to move. This engine has all the parts though and it was $100 CAD. A deal I couldn't refuse.

Great looking project, welcome to mopar world.

 

A couple thoughts, you do not list your location, but you say the car is Canadian built.

Seems Canadian vehicles had their own rules about engines, most were 25" blocks? If I had a Canadian car, I would want to learn more about which engines were used.

 

I think the 251 would be a very good candidate for a transplant.

I would first thing, pull the head on it to see why it is seized. Check the condition of the cylinders. A motor improperly stored can have many issues.

If the engine in the car is missing the carburetor or air cleaner ..... can be real tough on the internal parts of the engine.

A gasket set is cheap & you will want it around anyways.

 

 

I am not 100% sure on the transmissions, Late 50's Dodge truck 3spd would be a column shift. Is possible you may be able to use the top from the car transmission and convert the truck transmission to a floor shift. You could with the older transmissions, not sure if that changed in late 50's.

 

Good luck and enjoy the process.

 

[DC_Maidens]

On 12/23/2022 at 10:07 AM, keithb7 said:

Welcome to the best place in the universe for vintage flathead Mopars!

 

I like your car, as I also own 2 1938 Canadian built Mopars. Where are you located?

 

Books, I can recommend a few that I own:

The original Canadian shop manual for your year. Covers Dodge, Desoto, Plymouth and Chrysler.

A 8th edition Motors Manual is a great supplement.

Dykes Automotive Encyclopedia. To learn all the foundational stuff about these old cars. Pick one printed in about 1942.

Chrysler Corp of Canada  Parts List. I have the 1938 edition

 

I run my own You Tube Channel featuring repairs and maintenance on my old Mopars. Might be some info here that interests you.

Seen here:   https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCVoBq2i7wl4w0W4JB6cAMjg

 

1938 Dodge specs in my manual shows it would have had a 218. To confirm, 

measure how long the block is in your car now. 23" it could be a 201 ci. 25" long would be a Canadian 218.  Your newly acquired 251 is 25" long.

If you have a 23", putting in a 25" will take some extra modifications. We can talk about that if needed.

 

You should know the Canadian built 218 has a 25" long block. The American 218 is a 23" long block. The two engines are very different and many internal parts are not interchangeable.

 

 

Thank you. I will track down those books and check out your channel. I measured the block in the car and it's 23". My first goal is to get the motor running. The engine in the car unfortunately was damaged by a previous owner and requires many parts. When I get to the point of installing the new motor I will definitely seek out information from you.

Makes me happy to hear many of you have had success with this Forum. I am looking forward to chatting with all of you and sharing my build. For those asking I am just outside of Winnipeg, Mb.

 

First Christmas then to the car.

Have a Merry Christmas everyone and thank you for the warm welcomes!!

[DC_Maidens]

15 hours ago, MarcDeSoto said:

The Chrysler mechanic filmstrips are excellent things to watch, or you can download the digitized booklets.  You can find them at MyMopar.com.  

 

https://mymopar.com/chrysler-master-tech-service-conference-library/

 

Informative and fun videos

[DC_Maidens]

7 hours ago, Los_Control said:

Great looking project, welcome to mopar world.

 

A couple thoughts, you do not list your location, but you say the car is Canadian built.

Seems Canadian vehicles had their own rules about engines, most were 25" blocks? If I had a Canadian car, I would want to learn more about which engines were used.

 

I think the 251 would be a very good candidate for a transplant.

I would first thing, pull the head on it to see why it is seized. Check the condition of the cylinders. A motor improperly stored can have many issues.

If the engine in the car is missing the carburetor or air cleaner ..... can be real tough on the internal parts of the engine.

A gasket set is cheap & you will want it around anyways.

 

 

I am not 100% sure on the transmissions, Late 50's Dodge truck 3spd would be a column shift. Is possible you may be able to use the top from the car transmission and convert the truck transmission to a floor shift. You could with the older transmissions, not sure if that changed in late 50's.

 

Good luck and enjoy the process.

 

 

The transmission with the 251 is a floor shifter... it has a second lever which I'm assuming is high low?? I'll pull the head as you suggested, I'd like to see how things look.

[SteveR]

2 hours ago, DC_Maidens said:

For those asking I am just outside of Winnipeg,

Wow I use to be a neighbor of yours. I'm from Minnesota.

Here in England, many people ask where Im from so I have them guess. In the 25 years I have been here, only 4 have said America. The rest say Canada. I even had a guy say he was really good at tracing accents and also guessed Canada. I usually respond with, "Have you ever heard of Winnipeg"? most have and then I tell them. I come from a little place just outside of there called, America".

 

I look forward to your rebuild and Have a Merry Christmas!

[keithb7]

Just outside Winnipeg. Very cool. I'm guessing if you keep your eyes peeled on Facebook Marketplace, Kijiji and Craigslist, you'll have plenty of opportunities to acquire a nice collection of used parts. Out there on the lone prairie I tend to think folks had room to just park them when they died. Easier to just lay it out back until some time in the future. It cost too much to haul it so many miles to town to the steel recycler.

 

I suspect the truck transmissions would be geared quite low to accommodate the expected larger payload. Keep your eyes peeled for a nice 3 speed floor shift manual.  My '38 stock 3 speed has no problem with the 236 ci 25" block in front of it. OD would be a very nice feature with your 251 ci engine turning it. Very nice. Keep a sharp eye!

 

A little background on the car year. I believe '37 stock tranny would have have a tall lever in the floor enter. To pull-on and activate the park brake. The '38 year used a pistol grip park brake lever up under the dash. It pulled a cable to activate the park brake. What does your Dodge have currently?

If your headlights are mounted to the inner aprons of the fenders, it should be a '38. I think this is what yours has. Hard to be 100% sure with the snow there. 

 

 

Edited December 24, 2022 by keithb7

[Happy 46R]

Hello and welcome,

I like your project and great to see that most, if not all , the glass is there. I may have access to some parts up here by Edmonton so keep in touch. One of the great things that helps with my projects is using the Q & A option at the top of the page. The technical, links and downloads and resources all have great information and will often give you everything you wanted without asking the question. Stay in touch. Merry Christmas and looking forward to some great pictures and features.

Dave

[DC_Maidens]

2 hours ago, SteveR said:

Wow I use to be a neighbor of yours. I'm from Minnesota.

Here in England, many people ask where Im from so I have them guess. In the 25 years I have been here, only 4 have said America. The rest say Canada. I even had a guy say he was really good at tracing accents and also guessed Canada. I usually respond with, "Have you ever heard of Winnipeg"? most have and then I tell them. I come from a little place just outside of there called, America".

 

I look forward to your rebuild and Have a Merry Christmas!

 

That's too funny. I enjoy traveling to Minnesota. Minneapolis is one of my favorites. Red Cow and Uptown!! I've been to the St. Paul Beer Fest a few times - always a great time. 

[Marcel Backs]

Welcome to the site and merry Xmas! M

[SteveR]

10 hours ago, keithb7 said:

I believe '37 stock tranny would have have a tall lever in the floor enter. To pull-on and activate the park brake.

Yep thats correct. To the right of the shift lever is the hand brake. It is released by a button on the top

 

Merry Christmas!

[DC_Maidens]

On 12/24/2022 at 4:16 PM, keithb7 said:

Just outside Winnipeg. Very cool. I'm guessing if you keep your eyes peeled on Facebook Marketplace, Kijiji and Craigslist, you'll have plenty of opportunities to acquire a nice collection of used parts. Out there on the lone prairie I tend to think folks had room to just park them when they died. Easier to just lay it out back until some time in the future. It cost too much to haul it so many miles to town to the steel recycler.

 

There are a surprising number of cars out in back fields. The race is on, to some degree, as the farms are being inherited or sold, a lot of the old cars are being auctioned off, sold, or scrapped. Sad to see what ends up at the recycler. 

 

On 12/24/2022 at 4:16 PM, keithb7 said:

A little background on the car year. I believe '37 stock tranny would have have a tall lever in the floor enter. To pull-on and activate the park brake. The '38 year used a pistol grip park brake lever up under the dash. It pulled a cable to activate the park brake. What does your Dodge have currently?

If your headlights are mounted to the inner aprons of the fenders, it should be a '38. I think this is what yours has. Hard to be 100% sure with the snow there. 

I just looked again and don't see a hand lever... hmm might be a '38?? I'll have a better look once I drag the car into the garage.

Edited December 28, 2022 by DC_Maidens

[bartenderfloyd]

Awesome car!  Welcome!

[DC_Maidens]

The engine and transmission is from a 1958 Dodge truck.

 

Can anyone identify the transmission? The only number I can find is C-88373.

What's the redish-orange thing attached to the transmission?

[Merle Coggins]

It looks like a 4 speed trans (NP 420?) with a PTO mounted. However I find it odd that it has the trans mounted park brake handle if it is out of a ‘58 truck. Trucks moved to under dash mounted park brake handles in 1950. 

[Young Ed]

On 12/24/2022 at 6:29 PM, DC_Maidens said:

 

That's too funny. I enjoy traveling to Minnesota. Minneapolis is one of my favorites. Red Cow and Uptown!! I've been to the St. Paul Beer Fest a few times - always a great time. 

I'm in the twin cities let me know next time you're down we can chat Mopars 

 

[DC_Maidens]

3 hours ago, Young Ed said:

I'm in the twin cities let me know next time you're down we can chat Mopars 

 

Sounds like a great idea. I'll let you know when I am heading down.

 

3 hours ago, Merle Coggins said:

It looks like a 4 speed trans (NP 420?) with a PTO mounted. However I find it odd that it has the trans mounted park brake handle if it is out of a ‘58 truck. Trucks moved to under dash mounted park brake handles in 1950. 

The gentlemen I bought it from was elderly and perhaps not as sharp as he once was. Maybe he misremembered where the engine and transmission came from, or the transmission was swapped. The code for the engine matches the dates he told me, but the date stamped on the transmission is '49. 

 

Do you know if it's possible to remove the PTO, and will this transmission work in the '37 sedan with RWD? I am assuming the transmission likely came out of a 4x4.

 

Thanks,

[DC_Maidens]

On 12/23/2022 at 10:07 AM, keithb7 said:

I run my own You Tube Channel featuring repairs and maintenance on my old Mopars. Might be some info here that interests you.

Seen here:   https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCVoBq2i7wl4w0W4JB6cAMjg

Funny thing, I found your YouTube channel before I registered with this group. I watched many of your videos; very informative and well made videos!!

I've also been watching Flathead Terry.

[keithb7]

For me, the large bell housing raises concerns about fitment in a '37 sedan. The Tranny looks physically larger as well. More robust for heavier payload? Was the truck tranny a 4 speed? The stock 37 was a 3 speed. The tunnel around the tranny and firewall may be smaller in a sedan versus a truck. Fitment might be a real issue.

 

For comparison here is my 38 sedan tranny. Very similar to a '37 except for the park brake lever.

 

[keithb7]

With shifter seen here: