S10 Frame Swap

[MarkAubuchon]

After a long consideration, countless hours and a lot money spent Im going in a different direction with my 1950 1/2 ton.  Since my long term vision is to pull my vintage travel trailer, a modified 50 would probably do it, but perhaps not as comfortable as I would like.  Tough part is that its already almost complete, so now I am starting over and will be selling the old chassis complete or part it out. I bought a 1998 S10, the conversion kit from Code504, ordered a 318 with modifications, A518.  Taking the frame to the sandblaster next week, then the conversion begins.  Will say code504 has everything covered on what needs to be done.   I will keep you posted

[Fibonachu]

That looks like a solid concept.

 

I wonder why you have to use the 2wd frame with 4wd axles.  I will have to look at the frames some more.

[Old CWO]

It sounds like you will have a very nicely updated truck when finished. I applaud keeping a Mopar powerplant.

 

Question - why 318 instead of 360?  Not criticizing, just curious as conventional wisdom would be that the torque of the 360 is better for towing.  

[Radarsonwheels]

I just towed a u-haul 12’ two axle open trailer to get a motorcycle an hour away with my 1986 ramcharger. I rebuilt the 318 engine last year with an rv cam, small headers, aluminum intake, & edelbrock 650. Sort of a home brewed tow package. 

 

It did fine but I was definitely the guy doing 55-60 on the 70mph turnpike and man did that truck feel like a sports car after I dropped off the trailer. 

 

Trying to say- another vote for a 360

[kencombs]

Yep, HP does make a difference.  I have a 97 F150 w/4.6.  Bought new and towed a lot with it. Tow package but that year 4.6 is only 210 HP.  I pulled a uhaul 5x12 enclosed from Tulsa to Phoenix with it.  With cruise set at 65, it would shift all the way down to 2nd gear in places if left to do so.  In more normal situations it does OK, but definitely struggles with over 4k back there. 

 

OTOH, I have a 13 Tundra.  384horses of towing majesty!  4.11 rear, 6 speeds, two OD gears, headlights that can be readjusted from the drivers seat to allow for load, engine oil cooler etc.  I loaded a Chevy Cruze on my trailer this week.  Towed 40some miles.  Never noticed any slow acceleration are braking lack.

 

[Fibonachu]

What transmission are you planning to use?

[MarkAubuchon]

with S10 conversion you use the 4 wheel drive rear end because its wider, also on the front you can change the spindles or add spacers to get the right width.

 

318 vs 360,  we already have the short block, going to add the RV cam, headers and head work  . I ve pulled the camper with my f150 5.4 does fine, Im not a 70 mph guy when hauling. I'm good with 60, also I only plan to pull the trailer in the Midwest no more Rocky Mountains.     Im taking the S10 frame to the sandblaster next Monday.  

[ggdad1951]

Above post edited to remove any concept of a parts offer.  Parts offers need to be in the "classified" section and kept off the forum.

[Old CWO]

3 hours ago, MarkAubuchon said:

318 vs 360,  we already have the short block, going to add the RV cam, headers and head work  . I ve pulled the camper with my f150 5.4 does fine, Im not a 70 mph guy when hauling. I'm good with 60, also I only plan to pull the trailer in the Midwest no more Rocky Mountains.     Im taking the S10 frame to the sandblaster next Monday.  

 

Sounds smart to me, using serviceable stuff already in inventory is always a time and money saver.  I interpreted your original post as to mean you were buying an engine not on hand, hence the question.  

 

 I'm  sure a slightly warmed up 318 with an OD trans and appropriate rear end gears will more than get the job done. Might not drink as much fuel as the bigger brother when not towing so that's a plus.

 

Looking forward to seeing pictures of the progress.  I bet the truck will ride, handle and stop a lot nicer than stock with the S10 front suspension - my understanding is that it's essentially GM G body parts.  

[Fargone]

This is a cool project idea, I'll be following you.  I was on Code 504 website and I'd be curious if they ever considered making a conversion package so you could use an original flathead 6 (I will be contacting them). I've got a lot invested in my engine build and tranny swap. If I could drop that into a modern and lowered chassis I'd really be intrigued. Good luck and keep us posted please.

[Old CWO]

On 9/27/2019 at 9:25 AM, MarkAubuchon said:

with S10 conversion you use the 4 wheel drive rear end because its wider, also on the front you can change the spindles or add spacers to get the right width.

 

I wonder if one could also make the S10 4x4 chassis work with that Code 504 kit.  

 

I think a B or C series Mopar 4x4 with some skinny bias ply mud tires would be a pretty cool rig too.

 

 

[falconvan]

Sounds like a great plan. 318s are great engines; their biggest problem was that the pistons height was so low to the deck. Hot Rod did a build on one several years back and by machining the deck to get a zero deck height, adding a better cam, factory 5.2 Magnum heads, and an aluminum intake, they made over 400hp.

 

https://www.hotrod.com/articles/mopp-0409-318-engine-build/

Edited September 30, 2019 by falconvan

[MarkAubuchon]

update,  S10 frame has been stripped, sent to the blaster, black epoxy primed.  Have started and almost completed installing all of the new brackets. Will say its pretty cool how they have figured it all out. installed finger tight to get the overall picture.  Its easy to see now why you will need the wider rear end and either new upper and lower a Arms, I went with the spacers.  Abandoned the 318 motor, missing too many of the brackets.  Bought a magnum 360 and transmission out of a 97 3500 tradesman van. Having the motor rebuilt, will then install motor and transmission, mount the cab and front fenders for fit.  While waiting on the motor I am going to rebuild the s10 front end.  Pictures will be coming soon.

[wayfarer]

Is the new trans a 46 RH or 46 RE ?

[MarkAubuchon]

Don't know, whats the difference

[Adam H P15 D30]

Probably an RE, takes a computer

[Plymouthy Adams]

97 is an OBDII and RE transmission....at this time there is no 'real' support in custom harnesses for this protocol and the builder will have to split and create his own harness for retrofit applications.

[MarkAubuchon]

Sounds Right, the builder said not a big problem   keep you posted

[Radarsonwheels]

Congrats on the late model drivetrain

[Adam H P15 D30]

If not, you could always find an early 90's 518 that is a 1 or 2 wire hook up.

[MarkAubuchon]

That transmission is on the wish list as well.  For now I have plenty to keep me busy. Officially moved from mock up to proper placement, drilling and bolting on the pieces. Then I rebuild the S10 Front end.  I imagine that I will need to replace the front springs to something that can support the weight of the v8.  More to come

[CO54]

Pics?

[MarkAubuchon]

still working on the pictures.. Able to get a s10 4wd rear end, disc brakes and 372 gears. pulled the original out and slid it in. Finished up bolting all of the cab and bed brackets on.  Pretty straight forward. Now I plan on rebuilding the front end, adding heavier springs to support the v8 vs the 4 cylinder.  They offer a frame mounted pedal and master cylinder set up. that's next on the wish list. will pull the rearend apart and check bearings and replace the seals. also sending the leaf springs out for new bushings.  Truck will be all new when finished.  I promise pictures are coming.  Whats really neat is you don't get all greasy assembling.

[greg g]

The v 8 might be lighter than the six. You might want to load the chassis with facsimile weight and check your ride height before looking for  different length coils.

 

According to a couple sources, the 360 weighs 620/625.  Add the trans and the weight may be less or very close to the same as the six with flywheel, clutch and trans.  I believe conventional wisdom is the flathead six and trans weighed 725or so.

Edited November 4, 2019 by greg g

[Old CWO]

50 minutes ago, greg g said:

The v 8 might be lighter than the six. You might want to load the chassis with facsimile weight and check your ride height before looking for  different length coils.

 

According to a couple sources, the 360 weighs 620/625.  Add the trans and the weight may be less or very close to the same as the six with flywheel, clutch and trans.  I believe conventional wisdom is the flathead six and trans weighed 725or so.

 

That's all true, but...

 

The new front  suspension was holding up  GM 4 cyl or perhaps a 4.3 V6 and half of a mini truck.  He's working to make an S10 front suspension hold up the V8 and vintage Dodge.  Probably going to need something stronger up front if you don't want it riding really low.

 

Many SBC S10 conversions have been done so I am sure the right coil spring part #s are well established by the GM small truck enthusiast crowd.