Oil With Zinc

[austinsailor]

I'm not trying to revive the argument as to whether or not zinc is important in our cars or not, we've beat that to death. But if you believe more zinc is a good thing you might be interested in this.

Rotella removed most of the zinc in their current oil, which is CJ-XX.

The older version, which was replaced some years ago, was CF-XX. CF had the full dose of zinc. Guess what? They still make it. Some of the older diesels still in use still need it. It's not common and you might have to have your distributor order it, but it's available.

I just bought another drum to last me a few years. I bought my last one about 3 years ago at about $450 a drum, or $8.15 a gallon. It's gone up, about $10 a gallon now, but still cheaper than Wally World or other places. And far cheaper than good oil plus an additive.

I'm guessing you can also get it in 5 gallons, although I didn't check on that.

Again, you'll have to decide if zinc matters for your use, but here's an option to get good quality oil with zinc at a reasonable price.

Gene

[Merle Coggins]

I use Amsoil in everything I own. So my truck gets their AMO Premium Protection oil. It has a zinc additive and comes in 10W-40 (which I use) and 20W-50. They also have Z-Rod oil which has even more zinc in it and is marketed for the higher performance flat tappet engines. Z-Rod is available in 10W-30 and 20W-50.

 

List price on the AMO 10W-40 is $10.10/qt and the ARO 20W-50 is $10.20/qt. Z-Rod 10W-30 is $9.80/qt, and the 20W-50 is $10.20/qt. However, if you become a Prefered Customer you can get it at Dealer Net, or $7.75, $7.85, $7.55, or $7.85/qt respectively.

 

I've attached the data sheet on the Premium Protection oil. The sheet for the Z-Rod was too big, so here's the link to it. https://www.amsoil.com/lit/databulletins/g2883.pdf

 

Amsoil AMO.pdf

[austinsailor]

It's good to have options. At about $10 a. Gallon, vs. $30 to $40 I'll stick with Rotella, mine are normal service engines. If I end up with a high performance engine I'll probably investigate the high end stuff.

Gene

[supervert]

me, personaly i wont put diesel oil in anything but my diesels. to much detergents. thats like putting seafoam in the engine.

i run mobile one full synthetic in all of my roller motors and edlebrocks (torco) dino oil in my non roller gasers.

i listend to Lake Speed jr and Vic Edlebrock talk about oils on the Adam Corolla show. both guys pretty much said the same things about oils and were verry intresting to listen to. they both said that the worst thing that you can do is change brand "X" to brand "Y" every oil change and the best thing is to stick with the same oil every time and NEVER put in any additives of any kind.

[supervert]

http://www.adamcarolla.com/CarCastBlog/2012/07/synthetic-oil-with-lake-speed-jr-audi-r8/

 

http://www.adamcarolla.com/CarCastBlog/2012/08/carcast-vic-and-christi-edelbrock/

[Dodgeb4ya]

I agree with supervert on mixing oils. I never mix and match oils once I rebuild an engine. Swtching back and forth to save a buck or ten on oil is bad practice IMO .

[54Illinois]

I agree with supervert on mixing oils. I never mix and match oils once I rebuild an engine. Swtching back and forth to save a buck or ten on oil is bad practice IMO .

I have a rebuilt engine in my 99 Astro cargo.  After the second conventional oil change, to seat the rings, I will run Quaker State 5w-30 full synthetic.  It was on sale at Menards a while back with rebate.  I figured it saves me one oil change a year.

 

Using the same oil does make sense, but I have never done it...

[Don Coatney]

As long as we are talking oil lets talk oil change frequency. How long do you go between changes? Do you use a calander or an odometer? Do you do it at home or let someone else do it? How do you dispose of the waste oil?

 

The Autozone commercials I hear on the radio claim that your car will run better if you buy there oil that is on sale  now. What a bunch of crap.

[Merle Coggins]

In the Ol' Dodge I change the oil once a year. But I don't put more than a few thousand miles on it per year. In my previous daily driver I changed the oil every 25,000 miles with Amsoil's top line oil. My current daily driver just got it's first oil change at 10,000, when the oil life monitor informed me it was due. I'll keep with this schedule on this truck using Amsoil OE oil.

 

My waste oil gets dumped into our waste oil drum at work, which is sold to a local place that burns in to heat their shop.

[TodFitch]

As long as we are talking oil lets talk oil change frequency. How long do you go between changes? Do you use a calander or an odometer? Do you do it at home or let someone else do it? How do you dispose of the waste oil?

 

The Autozone commercials I hear on the radio claim that your car will run better if you buy there oil that is on sale  now. What a bunch of crap.

1. Yearly or every 2,000 depending on how much I drive it in the year.

2. At home. All I'd expect a modern oil change or repair garage shop to do to my car is break something.

3. My city has curbside pick up of used oil and filters. Just put it out on the curb along with the normal bins for trash and recyclables and it dissappears.

4. I generally buy my oil at Bob's Auto Supply. Not because they are cheaper, but because they are very helpful when I need to get parts for the old car.

[suntennis]

Valvoline VR-1 Racing Oil does have what they call high zink content. This sells for around $5.00 a quart and is not a synthetic oil.

Oil change periods is a good question since 60 years ago it was at 1000 miles with limited filtering and today with some oils it could be more than 5000 miles with full flow filtering. With my old filter setup, I change the oil around 2000 miles and drive the car all year.

[greg g]

Cars always run much better after an oil change, they get better fuel mileage and the tire shine lasts longer also.  The interior brightens up and most of the scratches disappear, especially if you use the well known national brands with the super whipzific additive package.  You know today's high revving engines depend on specifically formulated lubricants, especially as they loaf along the highway in 8th gear at 1800 rpms per 75 MPH.

 

Has any one worn out a camshaft using low zinc oils????

[supervert]

Cars always run much better after an oil change, they get better fuel mileage and the tire shine lasts longer also.  The interior brightens up and most of the scratches disappear, especially if you use the well known national brands with the super whipzific additive package.  You know today's high revving engines depend on specifically formulated lubricants, especially as they loaf along the highway in 8th gear at 1800 rpms per 75 MPH.

 

Has any one worn out a camshaft using low zinc oils????

i had a cam go bad in a 460 motor, i dont know if it was caused to low zinc though. it had almost 300k on the tiker

[supervert]

on all of my roller cars with the syn oil, i change them at 10k and on my plymouth that gets driven daily, it gets changed about every other month. (speedo wasnt working) but im going to put in a hourmeter to keep track of oil changes. on my diesel i change it at 5k. and all of my used oil get burnt as fuel in my tractors. right out of the pan and into the tank. i used to have a filter system when i had a idi ford to drive, but my powerstroke has injectors that wont put up with the high viscostiy oil.

[thrashingcows]

On my old cars, that are garaged, I change oil once a year...in the spring/summer after sitting and not driving most of the winter.  My daily driver, 1st gen cummins diesel, I change every 6 months. April 1st, and Oct 1st.  I have never been picky on oils, and never had any major problems. Usually buy the Wally world Supertech oil in the 5 gal pail.  Just re-branded name brand oil.  I do use a zinc additive though.

[55 Fargo]

On my old cars, that are garaged, I change oil once a year...in the spring/summer after sitting and not driving most of the winter.  My daily driver, 1st gen cummins diesel, I change every 6 months. April 1st, and Oct 1st.  I have never been picky on oils, and never had any major problems. Usually buy the Wally world Supertech oil in the 5 gal pail.  Just re-branded name brand oil.  I do use a zinc additive though.

just be aware that Wal Mart Supertech is re-refined oil, not saying that's bad, just a fact...

[Scruffy49]

Only cam we've ever flattened was a 22RE Toyota running Mobil1 full synthetic. Lisa drove it from Rosemark TN to Spanaway WA when we moved west in 2001. She drove her 95 Outback from Buckley WA to Rosemark TN when we moved back in 2011, w/o having to add any oil. I drove my 69 D100 pulling a horse trailer, had to add oil a couple times.

 

My daily driver Ranger gets new oil when the stuff in it is too dark to see through. The old oil is used to top off my 69 318 powered truck. Lisa's car gets the oil changed by mileage, old oil used in the 69.

 

The motorcycles get changed when the clutches start to either grab or slip. Old oil saved for the 69.

 

Everything on our place gets whatever is on sale or Rotella.

 

The 49 had Pennzoil in it its entire working life. There is so much paraffin in the block that I'd have to put the engine in the burn pile to get it cleaned out. The 230 donor engine was run with "cheap crap" and there isn't a bit of sludge in the valve area, looks factory fresh.

[wayfarer]

I agree with greg g and thrashincows.

 

The oil subject seems to be a never ending theme. I'll add my 2¢

Flat tappet lifters, either hyd or solid, require the lubricity provided by zinc and phosphorus. No more, and no less complicated than that. Will they, do they and can they survive without alot of zinc. No doubt.

Diesel service oil?  Oil rated for diesel is slightly different than oil rated for gas service since the diesel rigs are considered severe duty. But, last I checked, diesel engines still used bearing inserts of 'similar' design to gas engines inserts, and still require that the oil provide the cushion, lubrication and cooling to protect the various components that need oil to survive....just like a gas engine.
My wifes Durango has had a steady diet of the same 15-40 that goes into my 5.9 Cummins and at 145K it still runs fine. My flat tappet engines get oil with zinc or a zinc additive and I'm not a brand snob.
My experience says poor maintenance and short driving cycles (not up to temp) cause most oil related problems. You get to define 'poor' maintenance.
 

[ptwothree]

So... has anyone witnessed, or heard of a Mopar flathead 6 cam going flat, or any other wear caused directly by the lack of zinc or lack of any other additive ??

[Plymouthy Adams]

how would you attribute it to lack of zinc..except to say during break in period...? 

Even then an number of contributing factor could be the prob...improper lube and or improper break in or both or heck, what if the cam was ground and not properly hardened to begin with...

Edited April 6, 2013 by Plymouthy Adams

[ptwothree]

The linkage of lack of zinc vs. lobe wear might be.  I have not seen it for myself and I don't remember anyone with a flatty replacing a cam because of it. I have heard of this happening but usually on engines running higher valve spring pressures or being stressed in some way.  Remember when people went crazy when they took the lead out of gas?

 

I agree that camshafts fail for all kinds of reasons, but the lack of,or a decreased amount of zinc is not worth worrying about......

[Don Coatney]

I have not. High reving V-8 engines are another story.

 

So... has anyone witnessed, or heard of a Mopar flathead 6 cam going flat, or any other wear caused directly by the lack of zinc or lack of any other additive ??

[Plymouthy Adams]

you be surprised at the number of folks and many shops included that will install a high lift cam and immediately use the high tension springs on break in resulting in break down instead...most want to eliminate the extra step of breaking in with stock street springs and going back and changing the springs after breaking in the cam and putting a few miles on it first..my friend paid for 3 cams to be installed by a so called speed shop before doing it the way I suggested..shop told him the makers of the cam never hardened the lobes.....but if that were the case..why did he charge for new cams instead of getting the wiped cam warranted?  yes we know the answer

[wayfarer]

Depending on the cam manufacturer, the type and amount of 'hardening' varies a great deal. Reground cams do not get any hardening treatment but they will (or should) get a Parkerizing bath...That is the 'black' coating cams have and it is a sacrificial coating for the initial startup.

Some folks will argue that any zinc in the oil will somehow bond to the cam lobe surface and act as an anti-wear element.  I dunno, if the zinc bonds to the cam lobe then it would also bond to everything else and eventually we would find some build-up...wouldn't we?

 

Subjects like this are almost as bad as political issues.

[Plymouthy Adams]

build of dissimilar metal will cause guald