Pinion seal trick

[JSabah]

Is there a trick to installing a new pinion seal?  I carefully marked the nut/shaft orientation, removed the nut and pinion ( with a puller) and got the old seal out ( probably the most difficult part so far). Then I carefully installed the new seal with a block of wood and a hammer. When I went to install the pinion, I mangled the seal as I later found when I took it apart again as it started leaking immediately after filling. Below is the orientation of the seal. Did I put it in backwards? Should I have soaked it in oil (I didn’t cause I don’t think it is a leather seal - looks like felt and rubber)? Greased it? Any advice is appreciated. I’ll be ordering a replacement tomorrow ?. 

 

 

[JSabah]

Here is the side of the seal that faced the rear

[Merle Coggins]

From what I can see you have the correct orientation. Have you tried to slip the seal over the pinion flange/drive yolk to be sure it fits properly?

How was the first seal damaged? I would certainly lube up the new seal before installing the drive yolk. Also, when driving the seal into the housing be careful that the spring doesn't pop out from behind the rubber lip. That would also make the seal not seal properly against the yolk.

[LazyK]

using a block of wood you most likely damaged/dis-formed the center. when I installed mine i used a large socket that fit the diameter of the seal.

your first photo is the correct orientation, raised center out. I also found that soaking in oi land placing the yoke on the seal over night, made the final yoke installation easier

[Silverdome]

Are there any burrs or sharp edges on your yoke that might be damaging your seal at the time of installation?

[Plymouthy Adams]

also, no matter how many seals you install, look very close at the yoke itself, if there is damage there or a wear groove....look to sleeve this unit.  Sleeves are available at a very small cost compared to trying to locate an undamaged used yoke or NOS....beauty of this yoke is that there are no pressure under use and this surface

[JSabah]

Thanks for all the help here.  upon inspection, I may have slightly deformed the ridge of the seal with my wood block.  I did drill a hole in the block to accommodate the shaft and apply even pressure, but i did that only after I had some difficulty.  New seal is ordered and I'll get a better way of installing it.  Also, as I mentioned, I did not soak as I thought you only did that with leather seals, buy I will now do so AND I'll let it sit overnight on the yoke.  I had checked the fit and inspected the pinion/yoke - all good there.  Again, thanks for the advice.  I'm sure it will all be helpful next time around.

[Tom Skinner]

I had to Sleeve my Yolk. They Groove, and make things very un-groovy L.O.L.

[JSabah]

Turns out you guys had some good advice ... second time's a charm.  New seal in and holding.  Soaked in oil for a day, then put it on the yoke for a day.  Still seemed very tight to get in so I removed the seal, put 2 layers of thin electrical tape on the yoke and re installed the seal for about 15 min.  that seemed to make the difference.  In the future, maybe I would jack the rear end up so that the pinion could turn as getting the yoke on with a twisting motion may have also been helpful (my lift is the drive on type). There was no need to sleeve in my case (80k miles)

[Sam Buchanan]

1 hour ago, JSabah said:

(my lift is the drive on type). There was no need to sleeve in my case (80k miles)

 

Ok.......no need to rub it in for us jackstand bums.......    ?

 

Thank you for the tips, I have a pinion seal on the bench waiting for "my mechanic" to gather enough gumption to JACK UP THE CAR and replace the seal. ?

Since my car has fewer miles than yours I'm hoping a sleeve won't be needed.

Edited September 5, 2019 by Sam Buchanan

[Los_Control]

Box of dreams and wishes ... pull the pinion and visually inspect it.

 

I do give extra cred to unicorns though.

[Sam Buchanan]

13 minutes ago, Los_Control said:

Box of dreams and wishes ... pull the pinion and visually inspect it.

 

I do give extra cred to unicorns though.

 

Uhhhhhh......we're talking about sleeving the drive pinion flange (yoke).....the drive pinion stays put.

 

Or maybe I misunderstood your post....the unicorn thing kinda lost me....... 

Edited September 5, 2019 by Sam Buchanan

[Los_Control]

3 minutes ago, Sam Buchanan said:

 

Uhhhhhh......we're talking about sleeving the drive pinion flange (yoke).....the drive pinion stays put.

 

Or maybe I misunderstood your post....the unicorn thing kinda lost me....... 

I only mean, the only way is to pull it and visually inspect it.

Low miles means you have a great chance of it not being  worn out.

But because of age and storage, you just have no real idea until you inspect the part.

Too many options of why it could be bad.

 

One example, was a old moonshine car, went through creeks ... sat with water in the system.

Just saying, nothing is standard on these old cars.

 

Without looking at it, we are just guessing and hoping.

[Sam Buchanan]

3 minutes ago, Los_Control said:

I only mean, the only way is to pull it and visually inspect it.

Low miles means you have a great chance of it not being  worn out.

But because of age and storage, you just have no real idea until you inspect the part.

Too many options of why it could be bad.

 

One example, was a old moonshine car, went through creeks ... sat with water in the system.

Just saying, nothing is standard on these old cars.

 

Without looking at it, we are just guessing and hoping.

 

The yoke has to be pulled to replace the seal.......

[Loren]

I had to sleeve my yoke as well. It's a fairly easy process actually. I bead blasted the yoke to get it clean then put it in the freezer to shrink it a little. That step proved pointless as the sleeves are so thin the temperature difference disappears too quickly to be useful. Installation is simple, you hammer it on with a cup that comes with the sleeve that pushes against the flanged end. Then I buffed the end with a Scotchbrite wheel to reduce the burr.

The seals are pretty old timey with the felt dust barrier. The felt serves only to keep dust out not lube oil in.

I am certain there are better seals that would fit. Nobody uses that system anymore.

I have the pumpkin out of the car  for bearing replacement, so I am going to use a different procedure than you would for an in car seal replacement.

After all the adjustments to the bearings are made, I'll take the pinion out, put the front bearing & oil slinger in, then press in the seal and finally the yoke. To keep the slinger from wondering a little grease will hold it. The pinion will go in last. Lots of trial fits first.

I would use a modern seal if I had to do this under the car. The originals are way too fussy and too easy to damage.

I got my  SKF "Speedi Sleeve" from NAPA for $48. 

[Loren]

I've come to the conclusion that the original style pinion seal is not a seal at all.

It's a cruel hoax perpetrated on the poor hobbyist!

I am putting together a spare differential (with an alternate ratio) for my Suburban.

OMG!

This is the nastiest seal I've ever tried to install! Pinion seals should not be that hard to install.

Modern stuff with silicone outer rims are designed to go in with a little more than thumb pressure.

There is no way you can get an original in while on your back under the car.

Yet that is exactly how most pinion seals are changed.

So after a frustrating failure I went to my local NAPA looking for a modern seal.

The counterman was in no mood to re-engineer a 67 year old Plymouth so what I got was the listed seal for my car.

The outer edge has the dry sealant coating and there is no felt dust seal.

It's tap-in to fit in the housing and a reasonable thumb push fit for the yoke.

You could easily install this seal while on your back under the car....if you could get the old out!

The NAPA part number 18880 price $20 so for $70 (with the "Speedi Sleeve") you can be assured of a leak free differential and you won't be frustrated.

[jgreg53]

I used the pinion nut and an impact driver to get the seal in place

[chrysler1941]

On 9/19/2019 at 1:18 PM, Loren said:

I had to sleeve my yoke as well. It's a fairly easy process actually. I bead blasted the yoke to get it clean then put it in the freezer to shrink it a little. That step proved pointless as the sleeves are so thin the temperature difference disappears too quickly to be useful. Installation is simple, you hammer it on with a cup that comes with the sleeve that pushes against the flanged end. Then I buffed the end with a Scotchbrite wheel to reduce the burr.

The seals are pretty old timey with the felt dust barrier. The felt serves only to keep dust out not lube oil in.

I am certain there are better seals that would fit. Nobody uses that system anymore.

I have the pumpkin out of the car  for bearing replacement, so I am going to use a different procedure than you would for an in car seal replacement.

After all the adjustments to the bearings are made, I'll take the pinion out, put the front bearing & oil slinger in, then press in the seal and finally the yoke. To keep the slinger from wondering a little grease will hold it. The pinion will go in last. Lots of trial fits first.

I would use a modern seal if I had to do this under the car. The originals are way too fussy and too easy to damage.

I got my  SKF "Speedi Sleeve" from NAPA for $48. 

 

 

Speedi Sleeve # please  ?

[Loren]

I sourced mine from NAPA P/N 99186

The manufacturer is SKF (I think I recall Federal Mogul invented them and the metallurgy involved)

The size range (if I read the box correctly is 1.866 to 1.872