Charging Issues.

[SpitfireM37]

New to the forum here.   I have a 53 M37 with a 265 spitfire engine.  It had been a fun project.  It wasn't charging so I got the 12v generator rebuilt. I may need to change the regulator because it's still doesn't seem to be charging.  The multimeter shows 12.3 steady at the battery.  Any other ideas? 

[greg g]

Did you switch from 6v pos ground to 12 v neg?  Did you polorize the generator?  It entails removing and putting wires together at the regulator to let the gen know which polarity it is working with.

http://www.texaspowerwagon.com/polarize.htm

Hope that helps.

Edited September 12, 2017 by greg g

[Dodgeb4ya]

Get an original OEM regulator..........No aftermarket chinese junk.

Whoopsee..............See above post.... 12 volt? not stock!

Edited September 12, 2017 by Dodgeb4ya

[Young Ed]

8 hours ago, Dodgeb4ya said:

Get an original OEM regulator..........No aftermarket chinese junk.

Whoopsee..............See above post.... 12 volt? not stock!

would that have been 24v when new?

[Merle Coggins]

I don't know what it would have been originally. I've seen 6V, 12V, and 24V stuff listed for earlier Power Wagons and M37's. Either way, if the generator has been rebuilt by a reputable company, and it still won't charge the battery, I would suspect a faulty regulator or a disconnect in the main power wire. Is there 12 volts at the B or BATT terminal on the regulator? Is there 12 volts at the Armature terminal at the generator? Current from the battery must go through the Ammeter to the Voltage Regulator. When the Generator begins to output current the Circuit Breaker contacts on the Regulator close and connect the battery to the generator.

Merle

[mlozier76]

What are you showing from the F terminal on the regulator?  That should be the Field terminal, which goes to the field winding on the Generator, which produces the excitation voltage to produce generating voltage.  Make sure your grounds are all good, I had a Chevy this weekend that somehow the ground strap bolt had come loose and was only producing 1/2 the time.  Also, not sure if the newer rigs are like the chevy, but it only charges at higher RPM's, not idling, which may be because of the way the field circuit is grounded via the regulator, as explained in Greg G's post above and the hyperlink to "texaspowerwagon.com" .  My 48 Dodge on the other hand charges either way. 

Edited September 12, 2017 by mlozier76

[SpitfireM37]

First thanks for the replys. Not sure why I didn't post it on the truck forum..I must have had two tabs going.  

I am about to go out and check on what was posted. 

As for the engine, who knows what it came out of.  The code is impossible to make out.  

 

[SpitfireM37]

Well...went from uncertain to worse.  I was checking voltage and it was steady but still not seeming to charge.  I cut off the motor and the generator spun backwards for 15 seconds and stopped.  I unhooked and rehooked the battery  to polarize and I got a spark.  Truck hasn't started since.  I just get a little spark from the negative battery terminal.

I took off the cover and two jumpers where attached to the left screw.  I put them back while trouble shooting.

 

 

Edited September 13, 2017 by SpitfireM37

[SpitfireM37]

Below is the generator.  12 volt.   On a separate note, while checking voltage, I noticed the coil was putting out 7 volts.  

Edited September 13, 2017 by SpitfireM37

[The Oil Soup]

If the coil has a ballast resistor attached to it, that would drop the voltage.

[greg g]

The coil is getting 7 volts not producing it.  That should be correct through resisted feed from a 12 volt battery. Where do those wires go?  Look to me like grounds.  The Regulator shouldn't have any thing to do with starting running the engine.  Does this vehicle have a ignition key position that engages the starter, a separate starter button or a foot actuated starter?

 

Edited September 13, 2017 by greg g

[SpitfireM37]

RGR regarding the resistor on the coil.  

As for the starter..cleaned a ground and got it to turn over but the battery is dead.  Have it on the charger.  

I called a old tractor mechanic regarding the generator.  I think I will be set and will post results.  Thanks all.  

 

[DonaldSmith]

Is the old tractor mechanic an old man who works on tractors, or a man who works on old tractors, or both?  (I'm guessing both.)

[rallyace]

You should see at least 13 volts while charging, 14 or 15 is not abnormal with a generator charging system. My immediate guesses are improperly polarized generator or bad voltage regulator. Do you have an ammeter on the dash? If so it should show a decent amount of charge immediately after starting the engine.

 

[MackTheFinger]

Some people don't like the looks of them but one-wire alternators have solved a lot of charging problems.

[pflaming]

It takes three items to start and run an engine: fuel, spark, and air.  Nothing has been said about air. Do you have an air problem? 

Edited September 15, 2017 by pflaming

[Young Ed]

On 9/15/2017 at 8:07 AM, pflaming said:

It takes three items to start and run an engine: fuel, spark, and air.  Nothing has been said about air. Do you have an air problem? 

only after a couple bean burritos!

[Don Coatney]

34 minutes ago, Young Ed said:

only after a couple bean burritos!

New information? I used to think three things were required to start an engine fuel, spark delivered at the correct time, and compression. Now I see two bean burritos can be substituted for compression? I am really confused about the silly air comment.  

[DJ194950]

The bean burrito gas= fuel,gas and compression! Only need the spark! 

DJ

[pflaming]

So if not air, then what is being compressed. So then I guess one could put a tight piece of stretch wrap over the top of the carb and the  engine would start? 

[SpitfireM37]

Well the no start was from the battery. It was a brand new battery from interstate.  Put a doner battery until I get there to replace.

Still no charge though.  I suspect my anemeter on the dash is broken.  

I cleaned all my grounds and polerized like I was instructed.  

When I testested the battery terminal on the regulator, it was reading 40v.  I don't even know how that is possible so I am second guessing my eyes now.

The plan to pull the generator and have my guy check again and buy a new regulator. 

I wouldn't be opposed to a one wire alternator if it came to that.  I'm going to research brackets.

Edited September 17, 2017 by SpitfireM37

[Pauls_Plymouth]

12.3 volts at the  battery is not charging the . battery. Rev the engine up to 1700 rpm & charging voltage should be 12.6 or better. Electricity is like water, you need more flow (charge) at generator to get more than 12.3 at the battery. 12.3 volts is just the same as water at sea level, not doing much. I put a 6 volt Optima battery in my 51 Plymouth, what a difference - don't need to change to 12 volt. good luck.

[greg g]

The voltage regulator senses the state of battery charge.  If you put a fully charged battery into your truck after you started and ran it up to temp with one battery, put the fully charged one in and the engine started again without using much starter, the regulator will sense a nearly completely charged battery, and adjust the charge rate accordingly to replace the energy used by the quick start.  On the amp gauge this might show as a neutral to very slightly positive charge, as the generator will basically idling, providing just enough juice to power the ignition circuit.

 

[SpitfireM37]

Taking the generator backup my alternator guy.  

In the mean time..does any one have any experience with this bracket? 

http://www.vintageautogarage.com/Autolite-Generator-to-alternator-bracket-p/bktatl.htm

 

 

[Pauls_Plymouth]

No experience with this bracket, but it looks like it bolts up to the original bracket in place of the generator. The smaller spaced part looks like it will hold an altenator.