three speed to four speed swap

[pflaming]

A month ago a person from the Bay area saw my B3B truck in the driveway, stopped by and wanted to know if I would sell it. I showed him what I had and he seemed VERY interested. He said he would return in a month. SURE THING? Well today he shows up! He learned how to drive in a truck like mine and has been looking for one for some time. He's coming back tomorrow for further discussion. He asked if a I could put a four speed transmission in. I've been searching the forum and see no definitive answer. I know one can go in but does it take a different bell housing.   I still do not know I would sell it, but money talks.  

[Desotodav]

I'm surprised Paul as I thought that you had promised your daughter the truck.

It might be worthwhile telling the prospective new owner that he wouldn't gain any advantage by installing a 4 speed transmission as the top gear ratios are the same between 3 and 4 speed.

[Young Ed]

He'd gain a floor shift which is enough for some. The bellhousing is the same casting but drilled differently based on 3spd or 4spd. 

[pflaming]

I'm surprised Paul as I thought that you had promised your daughter the truck. Yes I have, so I am contacting her to determine her current interest. If she still wants it, it's hers. 

Ed: Since I will be pulling the engine anyway, my reading indicates that the drilling is not a rocket science project. I did inform him the top three gears were the same, but he said, I learned on a floor shift, I want a floor shift. Since he is in San Bruno, the low/low may be nice for a parade or even slow driving. 

To sell this to him, will take a bit of tinkering. So. . . the price would have to be an emotional one on his part and that can happen. San Bruno is not a low rent district. His back yard are the hills of that area where he runs 5 - 10 miles regularly. The Hillsboro area is nearby. 

As a different /  final note: who has patterns for the pressed paper interior? or who has the better kit? 

[pflaming]

On the transmission swap, got an answer. Four holes need to be drilled in the clutch housing, drive line will require length change, and on the column shifting mechanism will need to be removed. 

There are some fairly nice trucks in the LA area for reasonable prices. Cash always lowers the price. I am going to show him what is available in LA area. 

[ggdad1951]

he. might. paint. it!  

[pflaming]

ggdad, what is crazy about this is that he likes the finish!  To buy this truck will take a LOT of money. Those who are not partial to original patina finishes may not understand, but fads tend to be exclusionary thus pricey and this patina is NOT usual. Maybe should put "Fire Insurance Salesman" on the doors.  

[55 Fargo]

Money talks, bull $hit walks.

If he hands you the greenbacks, then you know he likes fire damage sales.....

[Dodgeb4ya]

Get a hefty non refundable deposit before you do anything serious with this guy...as it is the patina edition you know!

Edited November 17, 2016 by Dodgeb4ya

[pflaming]

We had a long productive visit. We went for a ride, he drove as well. No decision, but he wants first dibs after I get it ready to keep or sell. I showed him similar trucks in the LA area which were priced in the 9,000 - 10,000 range which were no nicer than mine. So I will let those truck prices do their work.  I will NOT swap in a four speed for him or anyone. Too much work for what is gained, in my opinion. If I wanted to pull a small trailer house or boat, then super low would be nice on a boat ramp. But I am working on a way to put a fishing device on a small drone, fly that out over the water, drop the hook and let the fish bite! 

[MarkAubuchon]

fyi, if your going to change the transmission in your truck, go ahead and put in a T5.   Langdon sells all the parts, even the transmission.  That's what I am doing in my 50. and yes granddad its back on the project list.  Planning a summer road trip to visit my son in Montanna

[Dennis46PU]

2 hours ago, MarkAubuchon said:

fyi, if your going to change the transmission in your truck, go ahead and put in a T5.   Langdon sells all the parts, even the transmission.  That's what I am doing in my 50. and yes granddad its back on the project list.  Planning a summer road trip to visit my son in Montanna

Is this something new they started doing?  I have seen his kit online and only for a truck, but haven't read he is selling the transmission also.

[Jeff Balazs]

11 hours ago, pflaming said:

ggdad, what is crazy about this is that he likes the finish!  To buy this truck will take a LOT of money. Those who are not partial to original patina finishes may not understand, but fads tend to be exclusionary thus pricey and this patina is NOT usual. Maybe should put "Fire Insurance Salesman" on the doors.  

Paul just because the grass law passed doesn't mean you personally have to smoke it all. Next you will be telling us he likes the smell of your truck in the morning........

[55 Fargo]

2 hours ago, MarkAubuchon said:

fyi, if your going to change the transmission in your truck, go ahead and put in a T5.   Langdon sells all the parts, even the transmission.  That's what I am doing in my 50. and yes granddad its back on the project list.  Planning a summer road trip to visit my son in Montanna

Or an even another great Mopar trans the A833 overdrive, with a very simple adapter plate.

With a T5 NWC trans, you better know the gear spread as some are ridiculously low, making 1st gear useless like a granny 4 spd.

[Young Ed]

9 minutes ago, Rockwood said:

Or an even another great Mopar trans the A833 overdrive, with a very simple adapter plate.

With a T5 NWC trans, you better know the gear spread as some are ridiculously low, making 1st gear useless like a granny 4 spd.

A very simple adapter plate that costs 5 times as much as the T5 kit which doesn't even require a plate. 4 new holes in the bellhousing and away you go. 

[55 Fargo]

Just now, Young Ed said:

A very simple adapter plate that costs 5 times as much as the T5 kit which doesn't even require a plate. 4 new holes in the bellhousing and away you go. 

Well $140 ( adapter plate) and no holes to drill, no clutch disc to create for the GM spline, I dunno you still need to do a driveshaft, swap in another rearend.

So yah install the trans, with the plate, driveshaft and diff, not a whole lot different.

The gear spread is nice with the A833, the  B&W T5 NWC has some very low geared types, so first is almost as useless as the bull low on the 4sp. The gear spread on that trans has some to be desired too. I think it might work well with my 3.23 diff, but a 3.73 or 3.90 no so much. A friend of mine has a NWC T5 in his 32 Chrysler with a 250 and a 3.90 rearend, he starts off in 2nd gear a lot.

Now his seemed to be okay too, but whenever anyone ever mentions a T5 trans to those who have not undertaken this swap, or who may not be real familiar with the trans, I offer another solution if anyone is interested.

I have no financial interest in the AoK A833 adapter, just for the record.

The A833 is a very rugged trans, and the T5 can handle what our engines can dish out.

At the end of the day so many spout about a T5 swap, but most don't do it, in my case, with my current 3.23 gears, have no immediate plans, but when I do swap in my A833 I have the adapter plate, but will be looking for another rear end, as the overdrive and 3.23 will have my setup outta steam too easily.

Have you installed your T5 yet, and how is it going if you have?

[Young Ed]

1 minute ago, Rockwood said:

Well $140 ( adapter plate) and no holes to drill, no clutch disc to create for the GM spline, I dunno you still need to do a driveshaft, swap in another rearend.

So yah install the trans, with the plate, driveshaft and diff, not a whole lot different.

The gear spread is nice with the A833, the  B&W T5 NWC has some very low geared types, so first is almost as useless as the bull low on the 4sp. The gear spread on that trans has some to be desired too. I think it might work well with my 3.23 diff, but a 3.73 or 3.90 no so much. A friend of mine has a NWC T5 in his 32 Chrysler with a 250 and a 3.90 rearend, he starts off in 2nd gear a lot.

Now his seemed to be okay too, but whenever anyone ever mentions a T5 trans to those who have not undertaken this swap, or who may not be real familiar with the trans, I offer another solution if anyone is interested.

I have no financial interest in the AoK A833 adapter, just for the record.

The A833 is a very rugged trans, and the T5 can handle what our engines can dish out.

At the end of the day so many spout about a T5 swap, but most don't do it, in my case, with my current 3.23 gears, have no immediate plans, but when I do swap in my A833 I have the adapter plate, but will be looking for another rear end, as the overdrive and 3.23 will have my setup outta steam too easily.

Have you installed your T5 yet, and how is it going if you have?

Chassis is ready so I'm getting closer but its not installed yet. I will also say at $140 its not 5 times the price only about 2.5....  I also just used the GM clutch disk no creation involved. 

[Frank's 49]

Just an observation.  The way this topic started, it seemed the buyer wanted a four-speed so that he could have a floor shift.  My B1B, which was built in 48, has a 3-speed floor shift, from the factory.  I think he could probably find the floor shift parts/transmission from a 48 or 49, and it would be a bolt-in.  

 

Mike 

 

[Plymouthy Adams]

as I read it..the lack of the floor shift was the deal breaker..to cost to change could not get recouped and the man obviously has no intentions of doing anything himself to get what he wants outside of writing the check...this is from first page second paragraph of the TIre Kickers Guide to Jerking around Sellers.

[jmooner3]

Hey guys, sounds like you're the tranny guys I need to talk to- just for clarity I have a 49 B1B that had a bad desoto motor in it, since pulled it and got a 50 B1D parts truck.  I was told the 50 three on the tree will not fit in the 49 because the fire wall is different.  I see the 50 1Ton's column mount uses a thru fire wall ebrake and the 49 1/2 ton had a floor shift 3 speed and thru floor ebrake integrated to the trans... I'm fine with either tranny, seems the three speed floor trans that was in the 49 would be easiest (no firewall welding)...the question is will the floor shift that was on the B1B engine mate up to the 230 from the 1 ton? I was thinking I would pull the 50 pedals and all and drop it in the 49. If the 3 speed mates I'd just toss that in. If all that makes sense, will the drive shaft fit or will I need to shorten it?

Thanks!!!

Jay

[Merle Coggins]

I believe your '49's trans should bolt right up and work fine. Then you can keep the floor park brake lever too.

Merle

[Young Ed]

I think you can use whichever trans you want. Does your 50 1ton parts truck really have a column shifted 3 spd?? Seems like a 1ton would have a floor shift 4 speed. 

[Merle Coggins]

The 4 speed was an option for all light truck models. (1/2 - 1 Ton) The 3 speed was the standard setup, and with the B2 series it would have been a column shift.

[jmooner3]

Thanks guys! Don't mean to hijack a good post but maybe there's others needing to know next steps too...Now I just need to roll the 50 parts truck through the snow to the pole barn to pull that engine.  Yea we got some snow up here in VT. Happy Thanksgiving ;-).  Merle, whats the right approach to pull the engine.  I was thinking pull the drive shaft, unbolt the trans, take the two bolts out at front engine mount bracket at frame and the two top bolts from back mounts so the engine and pedals come out as one...That's how I pulled the original from the 49 years ago - memory is not what it used to be...  Are there any other tricks to be aware of?

[Merle Coggins]

When I pulled the engine in my truck the front clip was removed, and it makes things easier. But you may get away with just pulling off the hood and removing the   radiator. I pulled the trans and the pedals, and lifted the engine out with the bell housing attached. You have to work the bellhousing around the steering box, but it's possible.

Others have pulled the engine and left the bellhousing in the truck. But to do this you'll likely have to also drop out the clutch and flywheel.