Electronic Ignition

[D81938]

I have a 38 Dodge Brothers  217.8, flat head with Autolite distributor .  Just purchased Pertronix 6volt Pos. Grnd  kit with Coil.  Any experienced previous installers, please respond.. T.Y. VERY MUCH!!

Edited June 30 by D81938

[DJ194950]

Still on 6 v. setup and Pertronix parts also or changed to 12 V. setup through out?

 

I have done  12 volt pertronix changes two of which were on Mopar flat sixes.  No experience with the 6 v, versions.

 

No problems at all with the 12 v. kits!  Others have had other experiences, but. . . they were all 6 v. systems I believe.?

 

Some differences on kits depending on the distributor you use.

 

DJ

[andyd]

Installed a HEI electronic dissy on the 41 Plymouth I had, it had been converted to 12 volts with the original 201 engine before i got the car......the electronic install was straightforward the best thing I did when I had the car, instant starts, smoother running thoroughly recomend this conversion.

[Doug&Deb]

Be aware that some of us have had problems with Pertronix. I installed one on my 52 Coronet and it worked three times and burned up. They refunded my money quickly but I’ve stuck with points since then. The older units work great but quality seems to have slipped recently.

[rockingjd]

I have had trouble with Pertronix in the past 2 or 3 years both with a 12V and a 6V conversion. A farm tractor I converted more that 10 maybe 15 years ago has been fine. 

 

[maok]

I've done the 6volt Pertronix on my '37 MC Dodge (218), though I did have a 6volt alternator. 

[Sniper]

I have the stuff needed to convert my original distributor to electronic using factory parts.  Just need to do it

 

https://www.jalopyjournal.com/forum/threads/mopar-flathead-6-distributor-upgrade-48-desoto.653565/

 

[Adam H P15 D30]

5 hours ago, Sniper said:

I have the stuff needed to convert my original distributor to electronic using factory parts.  Just need to do it

 

https://www.jalopyjournal.com/forum/threads/mopar-flathead-6-distributor-upgrade-48-desoto.653565/

 

I did that more than 6 years ago using a GM ignition module and it has been trouble free but you must have 12v.  Petronix, not so trouble free...

[desoto1939]

I have a 39 Desoto that still runs the original stock 6v system and still uses the old points and condenser setup for the past 35 years and the car is 84 years old and still goes down the road smoothly at 50-55 mph.

 

I only use Autolite electrical components becasue they were the factory installed parts.  The good old quality parts make a difference instead of the Chinese junk!

 

Rich Hartung

Desoto1939@aol.com 

[Sniper]

3 hours ago, desoto1939 said:

I only use Autolite electrical components becasue they were the factory installed parts. 

 

Those aren't being made anymore and when they run out of NOS you are SOL.

[maok]

I've never had an issue with a pertronix install, I've installed several in the last 5/6 years.

[Booger]

Pertronix conversions have had their issues in the past, as the above will attest to I guess the only way to find out is to do it

[desoto1939]

1 hour ago, Sniper said:

 

Those aren't being made anymore and when they run out of NOS you are SOL.

Yes I am well aware of that fact. So this is why I have over the years collected several NOS Autolite IGS3004A breaker plates that are complete, NOS rotors, Condensers that I have tested distributor caps, AutoliteA9 sparkplugs, vacuum advance units, several IGS4102C complete Distributors and one is even NOS and other items that will keep my car running down the road.

 

So when your Pentonix system craps out on you in the middle of nowhere how are you going to fixit. With spare points,condensor, rotor,cap and plugs I can get the car running again.

 

I am not knocking Pentronic's but the tried and true old points sytsems still provide good service t these older cars. Also from 1939-48 the chrysler products used the same parts so there still be aviable and also parts from Echlin, Blue Streak, Standard and several other manufacturers. But I prefer Autolite as my first choice.

 

Rich Hartung 

Edited July 2 by desoto1939

[Sniper]

I never said anything about going with Pertronix, I wouldn't recommend them.  The stuff I recommended is OEM stuff, made by the same people you mentioned.  Without the issue of vanishing sources (for now anyway) nor wear.  It essentially mimics the Mopar electronic ignition system of the 70's, pre lean burn.  Yes, it needs 12v though.

[Doug&Deb]

I certainly hope Pertronix got it together. Their product used to be first rate and I always want small companies to succeed. Unfortunately once I have a bad experience with something I’m hesitant to give it a second chance.

[Sniper]

I think they got bought out some while back and production got cheapened out after the purchase.  You can buy a similar kit for a 488 Dodge from Rockauto.  No idea s to the quality of that kit though.  WVE 1A4219

 

 

https://wellsve.com/parts-search/?partNumber=1A4219

[maok]

On 7/3/2024 at 9:33 AM, desoto1939 said:

Yes I am well aware of that fact. So this is why I have over the years collected several NOS Autolite IGS3004A breaker plates that are complete, NOS rotors, Condensers that I have tested distributor caps, AutoliteA9 sparkplugs, vacuum advance units, several IGS4102C complete Distributors and one is even NOS and other items that will keep my car running down the road.

 

So when your Pentonix system craps out on you in the middle of nowhere how are you going to fixit. With spare points,condensor, rotor,cap and plugs I can get the car running again.

 

I am not knocking Pentronic's but the tried and true old points sytsems still provide good service t these older cars. Also from 1939-48 the chrysler products used the same parts so there still be aviable and also parts from Echlin, Blue Streak, Standard and several other manufacturers. But I prefer Autolite as my first choice.

 

Rich Hartung 

 

With time your condensers are going to degenerate, if they haven't already.

 

Imo, most likely the early failures for pertronix installs are caused by the installer.

[Sniper]

3 hours ago, maok said:

Imo, most likely the early failures for pertronix installs are caused by the installer.

 

While I won't disagree that no matter how idiot proof one tries to make something a better idiot will come along and mess it up, but installing a Pertronix is almost idiot proof.

[maok]

Yep, I agree - almost idiot proof. Most likely the mismatch of the coil is what is causing the issues. And for some, the coil is a mysterious device.

Edited July 23 by maok

[Sniper]

That's because they think they know better without really knowing what' going on.  If they ran the suggested coil, or at least verified the coil they want to run meets spec they would be ok.  But no, they know better, lol. 

 

I can be a bit, lol, pendantic sometimes but really if the people that built it say to do something, I am doing that unless I have a real good and researched reason why I am doing different.

[D81938]

Thanks 4 the input everybody. I did buy the kit and flame thrower Coil  w/ correct ohms required 4 that unit.  I don't like cutting corners. U can't save money and do the job correctly!  I enjoy driving my old vehicles and working on them. And plan on doing so as long as I can! T.Y. 

[Loren]

Good ignition and carburetors have been issues since the beginning of the automobile.

Charles Kettering gave us the point type ignition back in the 2nd decade of the 20th century.

Back in the 1960s we started to get something new the Capacitor Discharge ignition.

I had a friend who was tired of his buddies coming around and idly picking things up only to drop them or put them out of the order he had them in. So he get some old electronic capacitors and charged them up then sprinkled his shop with them. Soon it became well known that you shouldn't touch anything in his shop because you could get BIT.

The way the Kettering system works is when the points close current builds a magnetic field in the coil and when they open the field collapses and a spark is sent out the secondary winding of the coil.

The way the capacitive discharge system works is the circuitry charges a capacitor and the points give the circuitry a signal to discharge the capacitor which sends its charge to the coil which now acts as a step up transformer. The points only act as a signal generator and do not carry the load of the magnetic field, thus they last much longer.

So the CD Ignition is really the answer to poor ignition performance.

If you have a car converted to 12 volts you could build yourself an HEI set up ( it's not that hard ).

But what if you don't want to convert?

Well you can try a Pertronix which many have and they are not that happy with them.

Or you could go on a treasure hunt and find the best CDI from way back which was the Delta Mark Ten.

I went that route because I like treasure hunts and having stuff nobody else has.

I even found a guy who can repair them!

One of the advances of the "B" model was a switch on the end of the box which switches the unit back to Kettering ignition, but they never made them in 6 volt. So when mine crapped out on me ( corrosion - I live on the coast ) and I didn't have any tools to move the wires back. I determined to find something with a switch.

Turns out the son of the inventor has a cottage industry making an advanced 6 volt CDI. He hand builds them to order and they have a three position switch on the top. CDI-OFF-Points. He also makes a 12 volt version. Not cheap but about what Langdon got for his HEI distributor. Fred Winterburn is his name and he's in Canada. If you google Capacitive Discharge Ignition he comes up with a lot of material.

So if you have a friend with a syncrograph ( aka distributor tester ) you can get your distributor set super accurate then reinstall it, time it and install Fred Winterburn's ignition box and you are good to good for as long as the rubbing block on the points last.

Anyway that's what I have done.

And if you really want something unusual go on your treasure hunt for a set of Jet Ignition Spark Plugs. ( aka Jet Flame Injectors ) Really hard to find but worth it. Last made in 1965.