Old trucks with old front ends & old grease

[Los_Control]

I have my truck up on jack stands, playing with the front end a bit, all is cleaned, painted new shocks ordered.

I am really pleased with the free play in the steering box, ya need a little but not too much. I have no plans to try and adjust at this point.

I cant find any looseness in any tie rod end .... I think the front end was in good shape when parked, also had new brake drums on it so some signs of maintenance.

 

What bothers me, While on jack stands, grab a tire and rotate the front steering from one side to the other, it moves freely with no effort, but there is a slight roughness. Like a rumble or a little bump  bump  bump while the front steering is moving back and forth.

 

My first thought is to grease everything, and see if it goes away .... I kinda suspect it may be in the gear box?

I have been very hesitant to just add new grease on top of the 30 year old, existing grease.

Also wonder if there is a good way to flush out the existing lubricant in the steering box with it installed?

 

Just curious what others might do at this stage for a driver and not a full restoration

Do I just grease it and drive it, replace later as needed?

 

Just wondering if there is a better way to do a little extra work now, and get longer life out of original parts.

[1949 Wraith]

I thought the steering boxes took 90 weight gear oil. If there is grease in your steering box I thought that was an old farm fix for a leaking steering box.

 

Have you checked the level in your steering box?

[kencombs]

I think I'd start by disconnecting the  linkages and isolate the roughness.  Could be in the spindles or gearbox.  Then fix the cause.  Of course the first step would be filling the steering with the right lube and greasing everything.  That may fix it, if not on to diagnostics.

[Los_Control]

11 minutes ago, 1949 Wraith said:

I thought the steering boxes took 90 weight gear oil. If there is grease in your steering box I thought that was an old farm fix for a leaking steering box.

 

Have you checked the level in your steering box?

Oil level is fine, about 1/2" below fill cap and no visible leaks ..... Seems awfully  thin though for 90 weight, Think maybe a turkey baster and hose and can suck out as much as I can and refill with fresh oil.

 

Grease I am concerned with all the zirk fittings and grease points where normal maintenance you would use your grease gun.

Where the old grease is pushed out of the boots, is hard as a rock .... I just assume the old grease inside the boots is just as hard.

I think it is very possible it is just rough old grease I am feeling while rotating the wheel back and forth.

 

Thinking maybe try a heat gun and warm the old grease up, then pump fresh grease in and push the old out? .... I kinda doubt the old grease will soften, may be worth a try.

 

Maybe I am just over thinking it and should just start pumping grease into all the zirks and see what happens.

Why I wonder what others have done with a truck that has been sitting for over a decade.

 

[JBNeal]

I opted to go with John Deere corn head grease on my steering gearbox overhaul, and it smoothed out a little of the rough feel in the steering wheel.  Another possible source of roughness is the bearing behind the steering wheel itself.  I greased that bearing as well, and it really smoothed out...I used a yellow heavy wheel bearing grease on that bearing so it wouldn't flow out too easily.

 

As for the old grease in a truck that's been parked outside for years, I ran into a few issues.  Some of the old zerk fittings were rusted so that the ball valve was stuck closed.  Others I could get that ball unstuck with a small pick, but then the internal spring could not re-seat the ball, so the grease just oozed out.  So I went through and replaced all suspension and steering zerk fittings...easier said than done.  I had to work them loose, didn't have a torch back then so I used elbow grease and a ton of patience.  A few broke off, but a spiral screw extractor worked them out.  Once the old zerk was out, I used twist drill bits to auger out the old dry grease, compressed air to blow out any other residue.  New zerks + grease to fill, about 100 miles of test drives on bouncy roads to exercise the suspension with about 500# in the bed to get more bounce, and I hit each zerk until I saw fresh grease forced out.  That worked well on several trucks, suspension and steering have worked smoothly for years afterwards.  Eventually,  I learned that I need to replace all of the spring eye bushings as they are visibly worn, probably from lack of adequate lubrication.  But that's a chore for another day

[Los_Control]

16 minutes ago, JBNeal said:

Another possible source of roughness is the bearing behind the steering wheel itself.  I greased that bearing as well, and it really smoothed out...I used a yellow heavy wheel bearing grease on that bearing so it wouldn't flow out too easily.

I was wondering about this area, not sure if going to find a bushing or a bearing, but a very possible place for the roughness.

I need to replace my steering wheel anyways, I know cracks can be repaired, I must have 200 cracks and not worth fixing. Original wheel, I bet the only grease there came from the factory in 1949.

 

That is a great idea on replacing the zirks, I figured would end up replacing a few of them. By removing all of them, I can work a wire into them and poke around, auger, spray some brake clean maybe, use the vacuum and compressed air ... just get what I can. Then add fresh grease. I would at least feel better knowing I tried to do something.

Like with the gear box, I wont get 100% of the oil out, but will be much better then it is now. And think I will stay with oil. I can at least suck it back out and change it ... corn head not so much.

 

 

[Tooljunkie]

I read about lithium grease in the  steering box. Thats what i used. 
ad far as front end, heat and good grease to flush out the old stuff. Mine was full of rusty brown goo, and it took a lot to get them flushed out. I use a high quality extreme pressure grease that is water resistant. Not the cheap runny stuff the speedy lube places use. 
i get the roughness also, but feel nothing unusual at the  steering wheel. 

[Los_Control]

Thought would do a quick update.

So far the zirk fittings are very easy to remove.

I did find the upper king pin on passenger side, I had to poke with wire, clean and spray and clean some more. It would not take grease. Sadly that kingpin has a very small amount of play. 3-5 thousands. Never did check again after greasing it. I do not think that fitting had been getting grease during normal maintenance. The existing grease was all dried up in it.

For this one issue, has been well worth the effort to pull out all the zirk's.

 

With that said, all the other joints I have pulled out the zirks and poked with a wire, and the grease inside seems quite usable, I bought 10 new zirks and so far replace 3 or 4.

I do have the roughness isolated to the bearing under the steering wheel. I can hear the rough sound coming from the cab and it is synchronized with what I feel with my hands.

So far cant get the horn button to pop off, soaked it with wd-40 over night, can push down and rotate left and right, just not pop out ... maybe today.

[JBNeal]

additional information - horn button assembly

[Tooljunkie]

Mine came right off, press down and turn clockwise if i recall. 

[Los_Control]

I did get it, I think the trick was to drag the bench seat out of the bed and put it in the cab and sit down and get comfortable. Then work it back and forth.

And it just popped out .... looks like it is the first time has ever been removed.

 

Now is the time to evaluate pulling the wheel ... I do not have proper puller for it. I think I will run a classified want add looking for a wheel in better condition ... technically I can still use this one and repair the cracks, it just wont look as good as it did when new.

So I need to research the forum and look for the best puller for the job, then search for the tool.

 

For now I have some pb oil on it soaking.

[ggdad1951]

26 minutes ago, Los_Control said:

I did get it, I think the trick was to drag the bench seat out of the bed and put it in the cab and sit down and get comfortable. Then work it back and forth.

And it just popped out .... looks like it is the first time has ever been removed.

 

Now is the time to evaluate pulling the wheel ... I do not have proper puller for it. I think I will run a classified want add looking for a wheel in better condition ... technically I can still use this one and repair the cracks, it just wont look as good as it did when new.

So I need to research the forum and look for the best puller for the job, then search for the tool.

 

For now I have some pb oil on it soaking.

 

 

I made my own tool with plywood, 2X4's and ready rod, not elegant, but worked well!

[Los_Control]

6 minutes ago, ggdad1951 said:

I made my own tool with plywood, 2X4's and ready rod, not elegant, but worked well!

I like that idea, I may be able to do that myself. Over the years I have seen many photos from various members on how they pulled their wheel.

 

The only puller I have today, is a modern day steering wheel puller, just not wide enough to work.

Same time, I need to buy a puller for the rear drums to do brakes. I wonder if I could buy a puller like this, somehow add plywood and use it to pull my wheel.

The idea is it would be double duty and easier to cough up the coin to purchase it 

https://www.ebay.com/itm/Vtg-OTC-827-4-Heavy-Duty-Hub-Puller-Owatonna-Tool-Co-Made-in-USA-Tool/392699414214?hash=item5b6eb586c6:g:GqMAAOSwTm1eUnN7

 

Either way, I think this is the puller I need for the rear drums, can anybody confirm this? Last time I checked ebay, there  was nothing available that I thought would work ... maybe I should grab this one?

[Plymouthy Adams]

I am working a small engine that does not have any description or photograph on the style or technique to remove the crank shaft pulley....It is hollow inside with a slight bell shape and super close to the aluminum timing chain cover at the rear...NO threaded holes for the puller to use bolts...am not fond of putting puller to v's of the belt...will prove to be interesting if nothing else...nothing on the internet for the year make and engine model...

[Los_Control]

Just now, Plymouthy Adams said:

will prove to be interesting if nothing else

My first thought is to use 2 pieces of plate or plywood with a center hole, couple straps to tie it together. Then some all thread through the straps on each side.

Stupid little photo but you get the idea.

This gets me behind the wheel, now I need to come up with something for the top. I think I can use plywood and 2x4.

For PA pulley, may need to make something from steel plate.

[Plymouthy Adams]

I have a large press plate that is similar to the pic you show that will probably be the first thing in my hands to review for application on this pulley...

 

good luck with the steering wheel...for the record, is the metal boss one that could withstand a drill and tap process to utilize the standard pullers often used here...?  just throwing that out....

[Los_Control]

CO54 just gave me a really good idea of using a bearing spliter. I think something like this may be the professional way to go.

And the kit seems to have the puller to go with it.

He said he used it and worked for him to pull his wheel off. Offered to loan it to me and return it, I thank him but will not borrow tools.

Still I think I may have parts laying around to make something like this ... not pretty but maybe will work.

 

[Los_Control]

19 minutes ago, Plymouthy Adams said:

for the record, is the metal boss one that could withstand a drill and tap process to utilize the standard pullers

I would have to first pull it to tell if that would work ... I wonder what others think? I have no idea how thick the metal would be, if it could be drilled and tapped.

[Plymouthy Adams]

I ask this as on the average most all other steering wheels are set up in this fashion...tapped holes for the puller...

[Los_Control]

7 minutes ago, Plymouthy Adams said:

I ask this as on the average most all other steering wheels are set up in this fashion...tapped holes for the puller...

I just went and checked, basically the area where you would drill is about 1.5" in diameter. I drilled a hole outside of that and is pure bakelite .. no steel.

So if you drilled 2,  7/16" holes in the 1.5" metal for the puller ... they would be to close together for the puller. And would remove to much metal.

 

Want to say this is a poor design, but possible to have proper spear action from the steering column, you need a steering wheel that can break away properly?

[JBNeal]

I used a variation of the H-bar and a bearing splitter, with a custom wood spacer between the bearing splitter and the wheel spokes to spread the load out instead of focusing the load onto the bottom of the wheel...this kept the bottom of the bakelite intact.  Definitely leave the nut on the shaft to keep the shaft from mushrooming out, just need to back the nut off one or two turns so that the wheel hub pops loose on the shaft.

 

additional information - custom steering wheel puller using bearing splitter

additional information - H-bar steering wheel puller using bearing splitter

additional information - steering wheel puller cautionary tale

[Dodgeb4ya]

Using a bearing splitter and 2 jaw...

[Tooljunkie]

15 hours ago, Los_Control said:

I like that idea, I may be able to do that myself. Over the years I have seen many photos from various members on how they pulled their wheel.

 

The only puller I have today, is a modern day steering wheel puller, just not wide enough to work.

Same time, I need to buy a puller for the rear drums to do brakes. I wonder if I could buy a puller like this, somehow add plywood and use it to pull my wheel.

The idea is it would be double duty and easier to cough up the coin to purchase it 

https://www.ebay.com/itm/Vtg-OTC-827-4-Heavy-Duty-Hub-Puller-Owatonna-Tool-Co-Made-in-USA-Tool/392699414214?hash=item5b6eb586c6:g:GqMAAOSwTm1eUnN7

 

Either way, I think this is the puller I need for the rear drums, can anybody confirm this? Last time I checked ebay, there  was nothing available that I thought would work ... maybe I should grab this one?

I have one, it will remove rear drums. 
 

as far as steering wheel goes, i loosened the nut, stacked a couple similar nuts inside the Deep socket, and 

whacked on it with a Hammer while pulling up on the wheel. 
it had the seat in and i also used my legs to push up on wheel. Blocks for under my feet. Suprisingly it wasnt all that stuck. 

[ggdad1951]

17 hours ago, Los_Control said:

My first thought is to use 2 pieces of plate or plywood with a center hole, couple straps to tie it together. Then some all thread through the straps on each side.

Stupid little photo but you get the idea.

This gets me behind the wheel, now I need to come up with something for the top. I think I can use plywood and 2x4.

For PA pulley, may need to make something from steel plate.

 

Kinda what I did, but I used 4 pieces of ply screwed together overlapping 2 layers for strength.  Then a 2X4 across that with 2 ready rods for tension and a bolt thru the center.  Worked on 4 different steering wheels and cost me $0.

[Los_Control]

7 hours ago, Dodgeb4ya said:

Using a bearing splitter and 2 jaw..

That is pro all the way, if I had a nice car that is the way I would want to do it.

Same time would have to buy each tool and how often this old carpenter would use them again is questionable.

 

13 minutes ago, ggdad1951 said:

Kinda what I did, but I used 4 pieces of ply screwed together overlapping 2 layers for strength.  Then a 2X4 across that with 2 ready rods

I went to the hardware store yesterday, bought 3' of angle iron and all thread, (ready rod) I figure to make something out of it today.

I needed the angle iron anyways to make the rear mounting bracket for the new Tanks gas tank. So use it as a puller then re-use it as a bracket.