New to the forum, Here's my dilemma

[Dspongberg]

Hello Everyone, I recently pulled my grandpa's old Plymouth out of the barn and have been giving it the attention it deserves. He bought it "restored" in 1999-2001 ( he can't remember exactly what year haha). The paint and interior look phenomenal but the engine and drivetrain are original and untouched. It runs and drives but after about 30-45 mins of normal driving it stalls abruptly and just won't stay running. I let it sit for 10 mins and then it fires right up and can make it home. My best guess is that it is vapor locking but I don't know too much about these cars, hence why I joined this forum.

What are some suggestions? I have read about heatshields, risers, and heatwrap. What works the best?

One more question should I install a fuel filter before the mechanical fuel pump or before the carb? I We don't get the best gas around these parts so I want to make sure im not sucking water and dirt into the carb/engine.

 

Thanks in advance and here's some picture of the car.

 

 

 

 

 

[Plymouthy Adams]

check to see if you are stalling due to overheating of the ignition coil....very common occurrence

[Ranger]

Sounds serious. Probably can't be saved. Better sell it to me. (Just kidding) looks like a great car to drive, show and have fun with. How long was it setting. My first thought is fuel. Is there a blocked  fuel filter somewhere? I would certainly add a filter. Is the gas old? Been setting in a rusty tank? Chunk of gunk plugging the line or the fuel pump? That's where I'd start. 

[jeffsunzeri]

Before you go out buying coils and new gas tanks, determine whether you are losing spark or fuel when it dies.

Take it out for a drive and as soon as it quits, check for spark with a spark testing device or just pull a plug wire and hold it near the plug to see if there's spark while your assistant cranks the engine over.

 

If there's spark, then check for fuel. Release the fuel line at the carb and see if you are getting gas to the carb while faithful assistant cranks it over. Of course, be safe and have a container handy for the gas to go into so as not to create a fire hazard.

 

Once you figure out whether its fire or fuel, you're halfway there. If it's no spark, it's likely a failing condenser.

 

 

[knuckleharley]

1 hour ago, Dspongberg said:

Hello Everyone, I recently pulled my grandpa's old Plymouth out of the barn and have been giving it the attention it deserves. He bought it "restored" in 1999-2001 ( he can't remember exactly what year haha). The paint and interior look phenomenal but the engine and drivetrain are original and untouched. It runs and drives but after about 30-45 mins of normal driving it stalls abruptly and just won't stay running. I let it sit for 10 mins and then it fires right up and can make it home. My best guess is that it is vapor locking but I don't know too much about these cars, hence why I joined this forum.

What are some suggestions? I have read about heatshields, risers, and heatwrap. What works the best?

One more question should I install a fuel filter before the mechanical fuel pump or before the carb? I We don't get the best gas around these parts so I want to make sure im not sucking water and dirt into the carb/engine.

 

Thanks in advance and here's some picture of the car.

 

 

 

 

 

I think the first thing I would do would be to take the gas tank off and clean it,and visually inspect it for rust inside. Blow out the gas lines with compressed air after unhooking it at the fuel pump,and install a new ETHANOL rated fuel filger before the pump

 

You MIGHT be running a mixute of stale gas from when it was parked,and new gas that you have added.

 

If that doesn't solve the problem,look at the coil.

[Dspongberg]

Thanks Guys, I'll be pulling the carb apart tonight to make a shield and put new gaskets in, and while I'm doing that I'll check the coil and fuel lines. It had no gas in it when I first got it running as it had been sitting for 20+ years. I wouldn't doubt that there is debris in the lines/carb. I pulled the top off the carb off the last time it stalled on me and the bowl level seemed very low compared to normal so it my be the pump maybe? 

[John Norlien]

I had a similar symptoms with my '54 that ended up being fuel pump.

[knuckleharley]

20 minutes ago, Dspongberg said:

Thanks Guys, I'll be pulling the carb apart tonight to make a shield and put new gaskets in, and while I'm doing that I'll check the coil and fuel lines. It had no gas in it when I first got it running as it had been sitting for 20+ years. I wouldn't doubt that there is debris in the lines/carb. I pulled the top off the carb off the last time it stalled on me and the bowl level seemed very low compared to normal so it my be the pump maybe? 

If the gas tank sat empty for 20 years you are going to find it is full of rust,and chances are you are going to have to replace it.

[Dartgame]

I agree w Jeffsunzeri - figure out why it dies first. It maybe fuel or ignition. Fuel tank is actually pretty easy to check. Pull the 3” rubber plug out of the trunk floor and remove the sender. You can then examine inside the tank w/o removing it. And by the way the car is beautiful - I hope mine ends up as nice, at least that’s the plan !

Edited July 17, 2018 by Dartgame

[greg g]

Remove the rubber hose on the inlet side of the fuel pump. Introduce some low pressure compressed air through the line to the tank. Listen for bubbles at the gas cap. There is an oillite filter at the pick up in the tank.  Also assure you have the correct gas cap.  I believe you cap should be vented.  This allows air into the tank to replace the gas that's pumped out.  Take it out and run about 15 miles, shut it off, remove the gas cap.  If it sucks in a bunch of air, that could be your problem, especially if as you say you can run 30 minutes before it shuts down..  Also looks like you have a slight fuel leak at the carb inlet or from the gasket around the float bowl.  Clean it up, see if you can snug stuff down a bit.  Be gentle do not over tighten.  In fact you might want to loosen all the screws holding the top of the carb on then re tighten them in a star pattern, doing a couple go rounds, till equally tight.

[greg g]

Forgot the rubber inlet hose, they can look fine on the outside but be rotten on the inside.  They can be sucked closed by the fuel pimp.

[DrDoctor]

   If you do pull a sparkplug wire to check for spark by holding it near the top of the plug, or near the engine block, DON’T use your bare hand!!! If the coil, and the condenser, are OK, you’ll very likely get a severe shock when the engine’s cranked. So severe that you may wind up being able to see in the dark without illumination . . . . So, be very cautious, and use fibre pliers, or insulated ones.

   By the way, the car looks VERY nice. Enjoy your new project. Warmest regards . . .

[DonaldSmith]

Aw, why did you have to go telling him about the shock from the plug wire?   You ruined a perfect initiation to the club.  

 

Seriously, thanks for passing on an occult bit of knowledge which some of us had found out the hard way.

[Don Coatney]

I would think a doctor would be familiar with the universal urine conductivity test. 

 

War games 1983.....

[knuckleharley]

2 hours ago, greg g said:

Remove the rubber hose on the inlet side of the fuel pump. Introduce some low pressure compressed air through the line to the tank. Listen for bubbles at the gas cap. There is an oillite filter at the pick up in the tank.  Also assure you have the correct gas cap.  I believe you cap should be vented.  This allows air into the tank to replace the gas that's pumped out.  Take it out and run about 15 miles, shut it off, remove the gas cap.  If it sucks in a bunch of air, that could be your problem, especially if as you say you can run 30 minutes before it shuts down..  Also looks like you have a slight fuel leak at the carb inlet or from the gasket around the float bowl.  Clean it up, see if you can snug stuff down a bit.  Be gentle do not over tighten.  In fact you might want to loosen all the screws holding the top of the carb on then re tighten them in a star pattern, doing a couple go rounds, till equally tight.

Good save on the fuel cap not being vented. I had that problem once with a Harley,and it almost drove me nuts before I figured it out.

[Dspongberg]

Oh I know the tank is vented as the cap does not deal in the slightest. The knowledge coming from the forum is some of the best responses I've had from a forum in years. 

As for the holding the spark plug wire I know it works ;) I did it once when I was a kid and learned immediately not to do that without gloves haha. 

 

I'll check the sender and the lines coming from the tank when I clean the carb. 

[JerseyHarold]

Your car looks great!  I'm a little biased because I have one, too.

 

Another thing to try is put some ice (in a plastic bag) on the ignition coil when the engine dies.  If the car starts after cooling the coil, that's your issue.  I also found that a Ford  fuel filter with one end threaded and the other with a hose fitting (try 1970-ish six-cylinder Ford products) screws right into the fuel pump.  You can then run a short piece of rubber fuel line hose between the metal fuel line under the radiator and the new filter.  You'll eliminate the braided fuel line that way, which can be another source of woe.

[Pete]

Looking at the picture of your engine it appears the fuel line to the carb is running awfully close to the exhaust manifold. Moving it further away may resolve any vapor lock problem.

 

Pete

 

 

[soth122003]

Seems everyone already covered the basics of the problems it could be, so I reply about the fuel filters, I have 2 on my 48 P-15 SD. One plastic one at the tank to catch crud from the tank, and a race style at the carb (that I can take apart and clean) to catch any crud from the lines. Your fuel pump also has a brass screen in it that acts as a filter as well.

 

Joe

[mmcdowel]

Took my Meadowbrook out of storage in exactly that same condition and it did exactly the same thing.  I replaced the fuel pump and the coil (back then I didn't know about this site to ask any questions) and it was fixed.  Still don't know which of them was the culprit, but I'm not taking them back off to figure it out.  Amazing info and tech help out there on this site, plus people to encourage you when  you need it.  Sometimes old cars can be frustrating, but worth it.  

 

[Greg51T&CWagon]

I had this problem on my old truck that had sat for 20 years. I thought I had it all fixed until late at night coming home on the turnpike with a semi behind me the engine cut out, the semi driver was wide awake and helped me by staying behind me with his flashers on (there was no shoulder) till i got it started again and was able to get home..

Replace the entire fuel line from the tank to the carb, rebuild the carb, add the two filters mentioned above and have the tank professionally cleaned.

 

[linus6948]

My d24 coupe sat for 18yrs and I pulled it out of the garage drained out all the stale fuel, then filled it with new gas and a new battery and it started right up. I drove it around the property for 3 weeks in July and then one hot day in August I took it out of the garage and parked it out of the way and that hot afternoon I went to start it and it started and ran a minute or so and then died like it had been strangled.

The introduction of the new gas with 10% ethanol and the August heat had turned the once hard old "lacquer" layer that  old gas tanks seem to all have into a liquid "tar-like" emulsion that was drawn thru my entire fuel system. I removed the tank for cleaning and it was too thin on the top from rusting to save. I replaced it with a new tank, replaced the fuel lines, fuel pump and cleaned and rebuilt the carb and she was as good as new.

[knuckleharley]

This is so common these days  that replacing the gas tanks is almost automatic. The last old car I bought was being started by using a can under the hood. I didn't even bother messing with the gas tank,and when I pulled it to replace it with the reproduction tank,the old tank had a rust hole in the stop I could stick my fist through.

 

I just assume anymore that I am going to have to replace the gas tank,lines,filters,and fuel pump,and rebuild the carb before leaving the yard with any old car I buy that has been sitting. I use the new copper/nickel brake line as a gas line so I don't have to worry about rust inside the gas line.

 

Same with the water pump in one that has been sitting for years. It might not leak now,but it IS going to start leaking in a hundred miles or so,and it's a LOT cheaper to replace it at home in your garage than it is to have it hauled home on a rollback and then fix it.

 

Stuff like this is now in the category of operating expenses. If you want to drive the car,you are going to have to replace this stuff.