OT home energy upgrades

[Brent B3B]

just a reminder if you are thinking about replacing your water heater do it soon. the new regulations go into effect 4-15-15 in the US. effecting the size (slightly larger), possible connection and cost. one or two hundred more each! that is money that could be spent on you car or truck!

 

type in to a search engine " new water heater regulations 2015".....   

[TodFitch]

It could make a difference based on how much hot water you use, whether you have natural gas to heat it with or electricity. It might be cheaper over the life of the water heater to get a more efficient one even if the out of pocket cost is higher. You might want to pencil it out as to which way puts more cash in your pocket (or your old vehicle) in the long run.

[Young Ed]

I did ours just over a year ago and the gas company via rebate paid the difference plus about $20 for the upgrade to the more efficient model.

[Brent B3B]

It could make a difference based on how much hot water you use, whether you have natural gas to heat it with or electricity. It might be cheaper over the life of the water heater to get a more efficient one even if the out of pocket cost is higher. You might want to pencil it out as to which way puts more cash in your pocket (or your old vehicle) in the long run.

from what I have seen, you really gain noticeable efficiency on tanks 55 gallon and larger and for those homes where space is an issue like manufactured homes the sizing could be an issue...... 

 

I did ours just over a year ago and the gas company via rebate paid the difference plus about $20 for the upgrade to the more efficient model.

nice, you are ahead of the game, my guess is the rebates will disappear soon if they haven't already.

[Plymouthy Adams]

I hate to think that going this way will leave the homeowner who wants to have a system that is not dependent on the electric company even when using gas will be out in the COLD as they say...nothing sacred these days...even peace of mind is government dictated

[Ulu]

Basically we'll pay more for a smaller one that fits, or buy a bigger one that costs even more.

 

I've wanted to put aux. tankless heaters in my kitchen and master bath, as they are far from my tank.

 

It takes too long to get hot water when you just want to wash the hands. That's my greatest efficiency issue now.

[Young Ed]

Basically we'll pay more for a smaller one that fits, or buy a bigger one that costs even more.

 

I've wanted to put aux. tankless heaters in my kitchen and master bath, as they are far from my tank.

 

It takes too long to get hot water when you just want to wash the hands. That's my greatest efficiency issue now.

 

Have you investigated a recirculating system?

[Ulu]

Have you investigated a recirculating system?

 

We have one at work. I think they're better in cold climates. I dunno but they eventually ended up putting in Insta-Hot tankless heaters at every sink.

[Ulu]

BTW, I've finished re-lighting my garage.

 

I went from 320 watts of regular old 4' florescent tubes to 960 watts of modern cool LED can lights, which only draw 168 watts.

 

3x the light for half the power.

 

Now that's an energy upgrade. 

 

I've replaced almost all the lights in our house with LEDs now too.

 

Even my aquarium lamps.

[DJ194950]

Ca. Gov. Jerry Brown likes your kind!

 

Now if you will just crush that old gas guzzler, air polluter of yours and get electric vehicle!

 

DJ

[Plymouthy Adams]

the day I go electric is the day I am confined to a hov-around

[Ulu]

I have no problem with electric vehicles, in their place.

My place is not that place.

[DJ194950]

I have no problem with electric vehicles, in their place.

My place is not that place.

[Ulu]

Hey, here's the can lights I put up in the garage.  I put 6 in cans and hung 2 more LEDs from the fans on simple aluminum brackets I made.

 

 

 

 

I also put up this exhaust fan to cut down on the fumes.

 

I was going to rent a panel lift, but I decided that I'd try to rush the work, so then I figured that I'd just buy one for about $190 with tax. But it comes in a kit you have to assemble with 30 little bolts.

 

I decided then that I was just going to build one myself, and I made this attachment for my old engine hoist, all made from junk I had laying around, and it works great. It only has 4 bolts and 3 u-bolts.

 

 

 

Basically I used a ladder and the leg assembly from a folding table, and I made a couple struts from light conduit.

 

The upper hinge attachment was a trick, as I didn't want to drill any holes in the ladder. Everything there is just wired together. The hinge is 2 shaped wood blocks, with short 3/4" ID tubes u-bolted to them. The tubes slip over a long all-thread, bolted through the end of the boom. The wood blocks are then just wired to the ladder (as is the folding leg.)  I wired the brace so the leg won't fold.

 

Here I'm testing it with a 4x8 sheet of plywood & it works like a dream, except that the old jack is dripping at the pump. I've got some teflon packing to stuff under the globe nut, which may quell the drip.

 

Tomorrow I start the sheetrock.

[Don Coatney]

Hope that exhaust fan has a low sone rating so you do not go deaf. I have never seen a bathroom exhaust fan that does a good job of removing steam or stink from a bathroom. Hope that one does a good job with the fumes in your garage.

[Ulu]

It's for minimal conditions only. I also have the 2 ceiling fans and a big door. Ventilating the garage is no problem, but keeping it cool/warm is the big deal.

 

Sooo..I sprung for some R-30 insulation and I bought exterior grade drywall too (which for some reason is purple instead of green now.)

 

I had to put gear oil in the jack, and it still drips, hence the diaper and catch-can, but otherwise the whole thing worked well.

 

I got 8 panels & 4 big bales of insulation up, and the panels are all let in to the corner braces, lights, and hangers, and all insulated. I did have help loading the truck, but otherwise I was able to hang panels alone no problem. I did use styrofoam shims & blocks taped to the ladder to level things & get extra clearance around obstructions etc.

 

 

 

 

 

I'm out of panels and the garage is a mess, but the Mancave PC is up in emergency operating mode.

 

 

 

[Plymouthy Adams]

_{I see you did not stagger your butt cuts..reckon it is purple so they can sell even more primer...lol}

[Ulu]

This is my first time hanging sheetrock, so everything is an adventure. That one spot won't be staggered, because I didn't want to put in extra framing.

 

There's a dutch gable with a special set of trusses and jacks above the area I've paneled, so the framing is a bit odd above the panels. The rest of the room is almost all 24"o.c. trusses, so the joints are easily staggered.

 

I probably should have blocked all the joints, but none of the ceiling joints are blocked in the whole house. Had I blocked the joints, I could have cut out those corner braces, too, but I'm just going to plaster them with a bit of metal lath.

 

I bought tape & mud & a nice set of stainless drywall knives today. New tools are always fun, even if they're for a job I'm certain I will never never never wish to do again in my lifetime.

 

The actual paneling will continue next weekend.

[P15-D24]

Have you investigated a recirculating system?

FYI we just added one during our recent kitchen & bath remodel. Works great, worse case is 5-10 seconds for hot water in the upstairs shower farthest from the water heater. Use to take minutes. 

[Young Ed]

FYI we just added one during our recent kitchen & bath remodel. Works great, worse case is 5-10 seconds for hot water in the upstairs shower farthest from the water heater. Use to take minutes. 

Do you feel the extra electricity for the pump is outweighed by the water and water heater savings?

[Plymouthy Adams]

Like Ed, the cost of constantly heating the water as it cools during the pumping process would run cost a bit higher..well insulated pipe may be a great benefit but still even at that you do have a parasitic loss.  The hydronic heating system I have here at the house  has built in provisions for an external recirc hot water  exchanger plate.

[Ulu]

I remember the whole base at Duluth (and Baudette, both very cold weather stations)  had hydronic heating , but from a central plant. There were insulated water pipes overhead everywhere.

 

That system makes great sense for a big installation. Nobody out here puts them on a house. (Well maybe 1/10,000 do. Maybe.)

 

Hell, it was almost 90F yesterday. Why am I thinking about heating?  

[Don Coatney]

When I worked as a plumbing pro at a big box store a customer came in and wanted a water heater pump that produces instant hot water as seen on TV. I showed him the pumps we had and I ask him if he had already installed the required recirculating plumbing required to make this system work. He got a deer in headlights look on his face. Not a clue. Once I explained how such a system works he left never to be seen again. I could have kept my mouth shut and sold him a pump but it was not the right thing to do.

[TodFitch]

When I worked as a plumbing pro at a big box store a customer came in and wanted a water heater pump that produces instant hot water as seen on TV. I showed him the pumps we had and I ask him if he had already installed the required recirculating plumbing required to make this system work. He got a deer in headlights look on his face. Not a clue. Once I explained how such a system works he left never to be seen again. I could have kept my mouth shut and sold him a pump but it was not the right thing to do.

There are some setups that put the pump between the hot and cold water supply lines under the sink. When you press a button on the vanity it pumps from the hot supply to the cold supply until the hot water side comes up to temperature. No extra return line needed but you do need power which may not be available under a bathroom vanity without some rewiring.

[P15-D24]

Do you feel the extra electricity for the pump is outweighed by the water and water heater savings?

Absolutely for the water savings. With the drought in CA water is getting very expensive. Locally they are bringing the mothballed desal plant back online and it will add about $30 to the monthly water bill next year.  The pump is actually quite small, 16th HP if I remember correctly. Plus it is both timer and temp controlled. So it comes on a 5 am and when it reaches the desired temp shuts off. About 10 am the timer circuit shuts off.  Then we run a similar cycle starting around 4 pm into the evening. So when the timer is "on" it only runs until the until the return line reaches the desired temp then shuts off until the temp declines. Our remodel was down to the studs so all new lines were run (PEK) and fully insulated for the entire run on all lines. We have a gas water heater (plus just replaced out 30 yr furnace with a 96% unit) so our gas bills are low, I.E. $62 for Feb.   Plus we added a a 8.4 Kv solar array so power use is not an issue. Based on the numbers we are already seeing we be getting free power plus a credit back from SoCal Edison every year!