39 dodge d10 clutch issues

[Sniper]

1 hour ago, kouseneric39 said:

I'm also going to add 1/4 to 3/8s of length to the threaded side to allow me to adjust the clutch properly.

 

It did not need that added length when the car was new and all was well.  Which tells use if you need it now something is wrong. 

 

Do not forget the bushings inside the torque shaft yours look worn out.  That is probably adding to your adjustment issues.

[kouseneric39]

Just dropped of the clutch adjustment rod at the machine shop to just be straightened and the linkage to be filled and redrilled also ordering tourque bushings

[Sam Buchanan]

9 minutes ago, kouseneric39 said:

Just dropped of the clutch adjustment rod at the machine shop to just be straightened and the linkage to be filled and redrilled also ordering tourque bushings

 

It will be interesting to see when you reassemble everything if that slight bend is there for a reason...................perhaps the release lever and pedal arm are slightly offset.......

Edited April 15 by Sam Buchanan

[kouseneric39]

Just got my service manual and found the tolerance of clutch pedal play.that is 1 and 1/16 something to go by for reassemble.

I also took a good amount of time to emery paper the spine on the input shaft just incase the clutch may have been binding at all.

[soth122003]

59 minutes ago, kouseneric39 said:

Just got my service manual and found the tolerance of clutch pedal play.that is 1 and 1/16 something to go by for reassemble.

That's for when everything is back together and you've filled and drilled the holes that were egged and replaced the torque shaft bushings and basically put everything back to factory specs, When the clutch pedal is pushed it should move approximately 1 1/16" till the throw out bearing hits the pressure plate fingers and starts to disengage the clutch. It's the last procedure called...Clutch pedal free play. LOL 

All kidding aside, In your service manual it is probably the first subject in the clutch section. It is also the last step in the clutch replacement process before the operational or drive checks.

 

Joe Lee

 

 

[Ivan_B]

Both of those input shafts look like scrap metal. The seat for the bearing/bushing, at the tip, should probably be checked with a micrometer 🙄

The next time you have everything back together, do a quick test before you attempt to mess with anything else: when the clutch pedal is released, the clutch disc (partially visible from the bottom) should be tight between the flywheel and the pressure plate. When the clutch pedal is pressed down, you should be able to spin the clutch disk with a thin screwdriver. If it ain't working this way, do not attempt to start the car, etc., it will not do any good, at this point.

Also, this clutch video might have some useful info.

 

[Los_Control]

Reminds me of a story about old Uncle Cletus. ..... The girls in town would claim he needs to go home and clean that input shaft up .... What the heck do they know?

 

 

IMHO, the splines on this shaft look really  nice with sharp edges on the teeth ..... little wear on the front of the shaft.

To me it is like the first 1" of the shaft that inserts into the pilot shaft bushing ..... I would want that really smooth . I would use some emery cloth to smooth it up .... same time i would not want to remove any material and make it smaller ...... I would put some grease on the end of the shaft and shove it into the bearing.

I doubt I would ever have a issue with it years down the road.

 

The 2nd photo you showed, looks a little awkward ..... It may work also. If needed.. The very front 1" of the shaft sits in the bearing.

 

Just saying the very first 1" sits in the bushing. The clutch disk is splined and rides on the splines of the input shaft.

The pressure plate is behind the clutch disk, and the throw out bearing is behind the pressure plate .....

Nothing matters between the the splines and the front of shaft .... Only that the front 1" is smooth for the pilot shaft bearing.

 

Thats why I say the 2nd photo is awkward .... It looks good 1" in front but then has a groove cut into it ...... That area is simply not in use .... nobody cares .... the factory cut a groove in it for some reason ..... Just pick the best one to use. You will be fine.

 

[Ivan_B]

The last time I took a 3-speed apart, every single part (including the iron cast housing), except for the counter shaft, was no longer in spec. That input shaft has at least 3 places that needs to be checked: the tip, the "hole" for the main shaft on the opposite end, and the main bearing seat. If you really want to do this right, you would also probably measure the teeth wear and the shaft's end play (when assembled). These operations are performed with 3-4 different micrometers and a dial indicator. I don't know what the specs for this transmission are (they are not listed in the simple repair manual) but they do exist.

Edited April 18 by Ivan_B

[kouseneric39]

Quick update so I'm getting back the clutch tourque shaft from the machinist.

The clutch adjust rod has been straightened it did not have a brnd from the factory.

I'm not using and olite bearing for future retrace since that's the case whir lithium grease on the inputs shaft.

Last but not least there was no bushing in the crank when I took it apart I contacted the original owner the car was driving for 6 years with no pilot bushing and without making a whole lot of noise.weird honestly seeing that I really don't feel that bushing really is to critical or something surely would have came apart.thank you everyone for all the support I'm getting this car registered next week so need these parts to hurry up so I can get to the bottom of this 

 

[Ivan_B]

16 minutes ago, kouseneric39 said:

Last but not least there was no bushing in the crank when I took it apart I contacted the original owner the car was driving for 6 years with no pilot bushing and without making a whole lot of noise.

Nice... 🙄

[kouseneric39]

Update I found a new old stock clutch tourqe kit for80.00 on ebay.

Kit includes 

2 clutch peddle linkages

(One is longer interesting)

1clutch adjustment rod

2 torque. shaft bushings 

1 torque shaft

It did not include the torque shaft retainer clips I have one one was missing

I ordered the kit will install when it arrives 

[Saskwatch]

3 hours ago, kouseneric39 said:

Update I found a new old stock clutch tourqe kit for80.00 on ebay.

Kit includes 

2 clutch peddle linkages

(One is longer interesting)

1clutch adjustment rod

2 torque. shaft bushings 

1 torque shaft

It did not include the torque shaft retainer clips I have one one was missing

I ordered the kit will install when it arrives 

Alright , nice find ! ……

  correct me if I’m wrong , but I think there is only one retainer clip on the left end of that torque shaft , there is nowhere for the RH bushing to go ……

   I think  (-; 👍

[kouseneric39]

That could explain y I have the only one I need lol

This is all great content to help folks work on clutch issues I greatly appreciate everyone's help 

[kouseneric39]

More funny is the kit also comes with the retainer clip that's in the picture and I didn't see

[kouseneric39]

Also have decided to replace my pilot bushing the new one arrived today

Edited April 19 by kouseneric39
Auto fill put a copy of my last post

[kouseneric39]

Update

So I should have measured the pilot bushing 100% because when I installed the bushing with the tool after install same issue as the last bushing to tight of clearance.Either I have the wrong bushing or there's something off in the seat it sits in. There is nothing noticeable except 2 score where I'm assuming people have hit the crank when using a chisel to cut a stubborn bushing. I cleaned it with fine emery paper. Re installed the bushing I didn't have to hit it tool hard or anything.

I then checked it's fit with a spare input shaft. No go it goes in but not easy.

So back to what I'm going to do.

After speaking with an old timer he told me the bushing I have is brass not olite.

Quote "kid stop wasting your time and use a hand flute to ream the bushing to the proper size and finish the bushing with 2000 grit and machine polish"

So after some thinking I decided I have nothing to lose but 48 bucks and some time it's worth a try.

Making forward progress on getting to the bottom of this 

[Sniper]

9 minutes ago, kouseneric39 said:

old timer

Old timer is wrong, or you have the wrong bushing

 

Lots of ignorance parading around as old timer wisdom.

 

A solid brass bushing looks nothing like an oilite bush.

 

Brass is a bright yellow looking metal, oilite is a darker, sintered bronze, oil impregnated metal.

 

This is what oilite looks like

 

 

This is what brass looks like

 

 

[Ivan_B]

49 minutes ago, Sniper said:

Lots of ignorance parading around as old timer wisdom.

+200% to that!

 

1 hour ago, kouseneric39 said:

So after some thinking I decided I have nothing to lose but 48 bucks and some time it's worth a try.

Time to get a micrometer? 😅

[BobK]

Is  the end of the input shaft straight ?  Hard to imagine a bend at the bushing end of the shaft........ but ....... I bent input shaft by using bolts to draw the tranny to the bell once upon a time. 

[desoto1939]

There are two specific miller factory tools that are used to remove and install the pilot bushing on our cars.

 

One tool threads into the pilot bushing and it bushes it out of the pilot hole. the other tool is used to instrt the pilot bushing and then it burnishes it to the proper opening.

 

I have both of these tools and they work everytime.

 

 

Rich Hartung

Desoto1939@aol.com

[Sniper]

Burnishing tool. which sizes the bushing to fit properly

 

https://www.ebay.com/itm/224882347274

[kouseneric39]

You all are so appreciated for this valuable information 

I ordered the right tool.

Ordering another bushing lol fml.

I received my clutch tourque shaft kit yesterday and installed it.also just got my tie rods and front shocks installed all that stuff. Getting closer just wanna drive the beaut.

Again all great content for anyone that knows nothing about 30s dodges.bottom line is MEASURE EVERYTHING!! 

[kouseneric39]

Another question I probably should have asked.

Can I put this furnishing tool into the already installed bearing and it will burnished it and correct the size ?

[kouseneric39]

She's definitely brass

[Sniper]

Wrong bushing then.  Chrysler has used the same pilot bushing from day one all the way up till the 90's when they went with a roller bearing setup.. 

 

Yes, you can use the tool on an already installed bushing, but looking at that picture however you installed it to begin with looks like it really messed the bushing up.

 

The Mopar part number for that bushing is 53298 and it is an oilite bushing.  SKF B286, DORMAN 690005 and TIMKEN PB286 are some other numbers.