Valve Work - 1953 L6 264.5 CI C60 Windsor Deluxe

[Plymouthy Adams]

I withdrew my comment because you back paddled a step you previously stated you would take.....it is very hard to advise or reinforce your comment to open forum when this happens...even if I had money to throw about for frequent purchase of head gaskets, I just do not see doing so....

[55 Fargo]

I would support the notion of being extra vigilant with the OPs decision to make sure all valves are well sealed, this is a no brainer, why take a risk.

This engine as stated should be rebuilt, and the OP hopes to get the valves cleaned up and sealing so he can drive the old girl for the summer, makes sense to me.

I am sure this engine will fire up and run much better than before, might get a few years out of it as is too.

Rules of procedures, who made up the rules...............LOL

 

[keithb7]

All valves are now sealed up tight. Reassembly is now coming along.  Thought I'd share a pic before the head goes on.

Feels good...So far so good.

 

[casper50]

Looks good Keith.  Good luck

 

[Dodgeb4ya]

Looks like the the non factory style replacement header pipe was leaking a bit...

You might want to be extra careful to be sure it seals up well so there is no exhaust ticky noise.

The original header pipe had a 1/2"+ thick header pipe flange and the pipe actually protruded 1/2" through that flange and extended up into the exhaust manifold.

Helped to be sure of no leakage and extra support for the heater pipe.

The rolled over flange you have is typical of today's cheaper repair /replacement pipes.

The gasket sometimes will fail at that flange and get squeezed out or crushed unevenly.

[medium_jon]

On 7/3/2017 at 1:09 PM, keithb7 said:

Thought I'd share a pic before the head goes on.

That is pretty. Thanks for sharing 

[keithb7]

Very happy to say that the old girl is running like I dreamt it would!

I actually completed my work last night but decided against flashing it up. Incase there was a problem then I'd be up late troubleshooting, disappointed, and get a lousy nights sleep. No such worry was needed. After some good cranking time to prime up the fuel system and fill the float bowl, she flashed right up.  No more exhaust noise back through the carb intake from #6 intake being stuck open for so long. She purrs nicely. Next I will warm the engine up to full operating temp and re-set my valves again. Spec is hot at .008 intake .010 exhaust. I set them cold at .010  and .012. They tick a little cold so I figure I'll do them again one more time when hot. No sign of any oil burn so far. I'm a happy camper.

I also plan to re-test the compression and see where it sits compared to before I tore it down. I can post my findings at that time.

Thanks for all your help here kinds folks.  Another one, back on the road.

He she is, just coming out after a long month in the garage. I'm grateful to have a cool air conditioned garage. Hot as hades round here lately.

 

Edited July 5, 2017 by keithb7

[casper50]

Congrats.  Glad it's worked out for you.

[Don Coatney]

Glad you got it going. When you re-adjust the valves favor the loose end. Too tight will cause burning. Better to hear a bit of ticking.

[knuckleharley]

1 hour ago, keithb7 said:

Very happy to say that the old girl is running like I dreamt it would!

 

Always good to hear about a happy ending!

[keithb7]

Some follow up: Definitely more torque. Easier starting. No hesitation. More power all around. Running cool, and its 98F here right now. Very happy with the results.

Edited July 6, 2017 by keithb7

[Niel Hoback]

Congratulations!  That's a beautiful car. Real class. Makes our new jellybeans look ridiculous.

[maok]

+1 ^^^^ Totally agree. The contrasts and shadow lines in that pic are just wonderful.

Its good that you haven't upgraded you b/w film camera...:)

[keithb7]

Thanks folks, it is a head turner for sure. 

More lessons learned I thought I would share:

Initially I roughly set the valves and the car ran. So I warmed it up in the driveway idling. Then set the valves again. The car was not at full operating temp. Unknown to me at the time, I was also setting the lash incorrectly. I was turning the crank and adjusting several valves that appeared fully seated to me. I'd record what ones I'd set, turn the crank a little, then adjust a few more valves and then I fired it up.

The engine was running so smooth. It was so nice and quiet. I proceeded to drive around the neighborhood. Climbed some hills got it good and warm. I stopped at a buddie's house and visited for a minute. The car was idling, now but I could hear a miss. In my mind I was thinking I had not properly set the timing yet.  We get to talking more, and he invites me inside for a few minutes. I hesitated, and shut off the engine. 15 mins later I went to leave, the car would not start no how. I screwed with distributor timing a little. No improvement. I pulled the air filter, looked down the throttle body, and flipped the throttle linkage. Yup, getting fuel. Then I got to thinking...I quickly surmised that I screwed up the valvelash somehow. Too tight and the exhaust valves won't seat! 

I was confident that in the morning, when the car was cold, it would easily start.

Living in a hilly area, I the coasted my car within 300 ft of my driveway. For the heck if it, while coasting I put clutch in, put tranny in D, released clutch and tried to jump start it. That does nothing it seems. Engine does not turn. 

Now out of any downhill roads, I hooked up a tow strap and towed it the last 300 ft home. We pushed her into the garage for the night and I dug in on some education. I watched the Chrysler Master Mechanic episode from 1950 on valves. It taught me about the quieting ramps on the cam lobes. It taught me that the tallest part of the cam lobe should be straight down, away from the tappet, when setting valve lash. This happens when the piston is at TDC for each particular cylinder. So only one set of valves, on one piston, gets set, then you turn the engine to the next firing order TDC, and do that set. 6 times you must turn the crank and set a pair of valves, to do it right.

Makes sense. Yet now I'm left scratching my head. I can tell when #1 and #6 is at TDC, by inserting a long pin at pipe plug hole above 6, on the head. Yet how can I tell the rest of the cylinders are at TDC? 

I go to bed thinking about this. In the morning before work, I flash the engine up. Stone cold. Started instantly. Gotta be valves, but I have to go to work darn it. 

I get home at 4 and dig right in. 

A little more head scratching...I came to this conclusion: By following the firing order, and knowing that every 120 degrees of crank revolution, another piston fires I could follow everything along. So I set #1 at TDC. Set valves on #1. Grab fan turn 120 degrees. Set #5. Turn engine 120 degree set next. Repeat for all, thru entire firing order. 

I definitely found several valves too tight. Especially  exhaust valves. I reset them all. 9 exhaust, 11 intake, cold. I flashed her up and she still purred quietly. I repeated the same neighborhood drive tonight. Its hot out too. About 100 F. Got everything nice and warm and drove right into my own driveway before shutting it off. See? I'm getting smarter every day. Lol. Car flashed up no problem! The engine fires up instantly as soon as the starter gives it the slightest turn. 

I think now I've got this. I'm still going to wait a while before I reinstall the inner fender well window. Just in case. 

If you are green like me, watch the  Chrysler videos on YT. They are excellent on the theory behind WHY, we need to do a repair on a car. Not just HOW to do a repair. 

Edited July 7, 2017 by keithb7

[Don Coatney]

Best way to adjust valves is with the hot engine running. If the exhaust valves are set too tight the valves will burn. Better to favor the loose side of the adjustment. A little ticking at idle is not a bad thing.

[keithb7]

I hear ya. I'm trying to round up the courage to stick wrenches in the moving parts, with a super hot exhaust manifold in the way. It's not a slam dunk even with the engine not running. 

 

Maybe I should invest in some special long wrenches. 

[casper50]

Keith invest in a pair of leather gloves also.  lol

[dpollo]

I have been setting my valves for years  when cold and have had no comebacks.  I add .001 to the intake spec and.002 to the  exhaust  .  If there are no objectionable noises, leave then alone.  rarely if ever have I had a problem except when the tappets have proven to be cupped.  In this case to avoid a major tear up a dial gauge could be used but an engine with cupped tappets is usually due for a major overhaul.

More  a propos to your car, 

To set #1 cylinder, turn the engine over until #6 valves are "rocking"  that is the  exhaust is just closing and the intake is just about to open.  Then set the # 1 valves.

do the same for 2/5, 3/4. 4/3 5/2 and 6/1.  You are then away to the races.

[Dodgeb4ya]

Line up the rotor to the plug wire in the cap..   IE 1,5,3,6,2,4 Starting with # 1 cylinder rotor position.  

Adjust that #1  cylinder..the #5.. then #3 and so on.

[keithb7]

Good point @Dodgeb4ya, lining up the rotor would have been a good way to do it too.

As promised, before and after valve set Compression Test Results:

Before Valve Job, Dry compression test results:

1 - 95 psi

2 - 70 psi

3-  95 psi

4 - 85 psi

5 - 85 psi

6 - 0 psi

 

After Valve Job:

1. 100 psi

2. 100 psi

3. 105 psi

4. 105 psi

5. 105 psi

6. 95 psi

 

[Dodgeb4ya]

A great improvement! Do another CT in a month just to see for fun.

[Bingster]

I'm curious as to what body and paint sites you're on.

[Bingster]

This thread would make an excellent booklet.