1954 Plymouth Belvedere

[binderbart]

Hello to Everyone. I just happened into a 54 belvedere. I would clarify it as a driver. PO must of had plans to make a custom job out of it and did alot of modes. It has sit in my shop now for a couple of weeks and I'm starting to see why it didn't get drove. All of the brakes are shot. I had carquest bring me everything. All they could get me were rubber lines and cylinders. That alone was over $400. They can't find the shoes, I have found them online but they aint cheap either. So at this point I'm in here doing some searching for the most affordable front disc set up and I will probably change out the rear axle also. The flathead six did fire up and run, we ran it for a bout a half hour. I noticed the other day a big puddle of tranny fluid under it. Just curious what other trannys will bolt up to this old girl . It has the auto in it right now with reverse,nuetrel, drive. . Just wanted to pop in and say how glad I am I found this site and look forward to using your knowledge.

[knuckleharley]

Can you return the rubber hoses and cylinders and get your money back? $400 is way too much money.

 

IIRC,I paid about 18 bucks each for the rubber brake hoses on my 42 Dodge.

 

Check the people below for brake shoes as well as wheel cylinders,etc,etc,etc.

 

Northern Brake Service
P.O. Box 142
Minot, ND 58702
701-839-6537
 
The will reline your old shoes, clutch discs, etc; plus they been in business forever & have a lot of obsolete parts on hand.

 

Your best bet is to go ahead and convert your master cylinder over to a dual outlet one for safety reasons. While you are at it,go ahead and replace all the hard brake lines with the new "bend with your hand" brake lines. You can't look at your old brake lines and tell how much rust there is inside them,and they are 60+ years old.

 

Don't forget to replace any rubber gas lines with new hoses that the gas of today don't rot. Same goes with fuel filters.

 

Why are you panicking and wanting to change the trans? Find out where the leak is and fix it. IIRC,these things take 10w non-detergent oil,so find out for sure what it takes before you go dumping modern ATF in it.

 

I strongly suggest getting a parts and service manual for it before you get too involved. Having the correct parts numbers when you go to buy parts can save you more money than what the manuals cost. They are being reproduced,and you can even buy them on CD's and print out the pages you need.

[binderbart]

This is a parts store I use for the shop. I can send it all back, I am thinking of doing a disc conversion up front, probably spend about the same for drum or less. Also, I have access to a junk yard where I can pick up anything for nothing. ie. rear axles , front disc components. I thinking why not do a brake change at this point and have a more reliable system.

[TodFitch]

Can't buy new shoes for my '33 but where ever I've lived I've always been able to find a "brake and friction" firm that would reline them. And they would typically have both cylinders and rebuild kits for my existing cylinders. Same company that would reline a clutch disc and rebuild the pressure plate. Different cities over the years, so different companies each time. Always seemed like reasonable prices when I was doing it. It has been a while since the last time, but $400 sounds like a royal rip-off for the little you got.

[54Illinois]

If the auto trans is the PowerFlite...it does NOT take 10w oil.  Only the semi auto Hy Drive circulates motor oil from the engine.

 

Yes, get a manual, good advice!

[binderbart]

right now I'm bouncing between a few sites and doing some searching on disc conversions. This car is by no means mint, but it would make a good driver. I have some floor board patching and trunk floor patching to do. I'm just thinking maybe now is the time to upgrade and have a much better brake system with better availability. I did some looking and there is alot of knowledge out there. just sorting thru it . I would like to keep the flathead and original tranny. The parking brake on the driveshaft needs to be totally gone thru too. Why not a rear axle change at this point with a better e-brake set up also. Thanks for all the answers, I do apprieciate it. The wife fell in love with this car right away, so you can see the importance of doing it right. She will probably be driving it most of the time

[Plymouthy Adams]

seeing as how you have the Powerflite...you will also have the 230 CI engine..and a 3.73 rear axle

[greg g]

Check the rustyhope.com site for a conversion. The site owner is a participant here. If hes doesnt do brakeconversions for tthe 54, there is athread on the hamb forum that does an adaption of ford explorer pieces usung the plymouth hubs with the drumd removed. Jeep cherokee rear axles are good doners for the rear. But first you need to positively id the trans. The powerflite is a good and reliable unit, the hydrive is a one year mongrel adaptation of a standard shift trans. Check the allpar site for info. Search by name.

Edited May 14, 2014 by greg g

[RobertKB]

Changing rear axle will also involve converting or replacing the present driveshaft which has the ebrake on it. Different rear axle means different ebake set-up.  Nothing wrong with the original brakes if set up properly. Enjoy the project and welcome to the site.

[Plymouthy Adams]

Charlie has the right kit for the 54...

[binderbart]

seeing as how you have the Powerflite...you will also have the 230 CI engine..and a 3.73 rear axle

I do know there is a emblem in the trunk, that needs to go back on the trunk that says powerflite. Thanks for the input

[binderbart]

Changing rear axle will also involve converting or replacing the present driveshaft which has the ebrake on it. Different rear axle means different ebake set-up.  Nothing wrong with the original brakes if set up properly. Enjoy the project and welcome to the site.

all things I'm considering, I am also working on a IH scout II right now, the original e-brake cable is hard to come by. some guy used a e-brake set up out of a cherokee and tied it into the existing rear cables. this would be one possibility.

[Plymouthy Adams]

sometimes these trannies will leak a bit due to seal drying out from long term storage...fired up and run often they seem to swell bck to a seal with the fluid now going over them..not saying this is your prob..but a known cause sometimes..

 

the e-brake band is adjustable either by the cable or by spanner on the shoes..these can be easy relined at most truck shops that do relining..our local shop in town did a set that Ihave out in the shop now...

[knuckleharley]

Can't buy new shoes for my '33 but where ever I've lived I've always been able to find a "brake and friction" firm that would reline them.

I bought new brake shoes for my 31 Plymouth from the company in Minot I listed.

[knuckleharley]

If the auto trans is the PowerFlite...it does NOT take 10w oil.  Only the semi auto Hy Drive circulates motor oil from the engine.

 

Yes, get a manual, good advice!

Thanks for the correction.

 

What does it take?

[Plymouthy Adams]

Dextron is about the only one still out there..type A as used in the past has been phased out....do not use Type F...which is now the modern Mercon

Edited May 14, 2014 by Plymouthy Adams

[54Illinois]

I was told Dexcron. 

 

PowerFlite....0-60mph in 60 seconds...flat!

[Plymouthy Adams]

have never timed my 0-60 but from dead stop with WOT the car shifts into high at about 53 MPH and it does not seem to be in low that long....maybe next time I take it out will do a timed run..while not super fast..I believe it will best the above..

[TodFitch]

have never timed my 0-60 but from dead stop with WOT the car shifts into high at about 53 MPH and it does not seem to be in low that long....maybe next time I take it out will do a timed run..while not super fast..I believe it will best the above..

A few years ago I used a smart phone car performance app and took the car out to a flat empty bit of road. It claimed an 1/4 mile average time of 25 seconds with an ending speed of 56 MPH. Also about 37 seconds for a 0 to 60 time.

 

I guess a better driver could beat those times, but I'm not good at speed shifting a non-synchro transmission.

 

I would hope that performance had improved in the 20 or so years between when my 190 cu.in. 5.5:1 compression ratio engine was built and the 1950s L-6 engined cars.

[captden29]

my 54 Windsor powerflite leaks, just not enough to pull it to fix. I have no idea where it leaks from.good tranny though, but I have no passing gear. had it when I bought the car, it just stopped working at some time.don't need it, but would like it working. nice Plymouth. capt den

[Plymouthy Adams]

I know you are right on hopeful improvements.....but an actual time I could not post as I never thought it would be of any value to know this ....still not even really interested but may do it for the fun of it...

[TodFitch]

. . . but may do it for the fun of it...

Isn't having fun the point of this or any other hobby?

[Niel Hoback]

If you have the manual for it, check out the transmission/throttle linkage adjustment.

[Plymouthy Adams]

TodFitch, on 14 May 2014 - 3:51 PM, said:

Isn't having fun the point of this or any other hobby?

 

yeas..I agree..but for some reason I never have associated a flathead with ripping up the road...leave that for the many V powered vehicles on the premises..

[Ulu]

my 54 Windsor powerflite leaks, just not enough to pull it to fix. I have no idea where it leaks from.good tranny though, but I have no passing gear. had it when I bought the car, it just stopped working at some time.don't need it, but would like it working. nice Plymouth. capt den

 

Check the vacuum modulator on the trans. It's the little flying saucer with a vacuum hose coming off it.