Body Serial # tag

[hotrodbob]

Is there a reproduction body serial number tag available?

[BobT-47P15]

Are you speaking of that little rectangular tag on the firewall, usually

painted body color, that says "Briggs Body Co" and has a number?

[hotrodbob]

No, but would be good too. The one I was looking for is the one on the drivers door frame.

[desoto1939]

I have seenthe serial number plate listed on ebay several times.

I willbe going to a major show in about two weeks. There is a vender that sells various tags for the generator, starters distributor and other tags.

I will see if i can get some information and also prices. Can not guarantee that he will be there. I know he is not cheap onhis items but has a very good quality product. He has been doing this for at leat 10+ years.

What year is your truck or car. The plates do not have the serialnumber stamped on them you willhave to do this yourself. The ones on Ebay offer this service.

Rich Hartung

Desoto1939@aol.com

[hotrodbob]

I have seenthe serial number plate listed on ebay several times.

I willbe going to a major show in about two weeks. There is a vender that sells various tags for the generator, starters distributor and other tags.

I will see if i can get some information and also prices. Can not guarantee that he will be there. I know he is not cheap onhis items but has a very good quality product. He has been doing this for at leat 10+ years.

What year is your truck or car. The plates do not have the serialnumber stamped on them you willhave to do this yourself. The ones on Ebay offer this service.

Rich Hartung

Desoto1939@aol.com

I have a 48 Plym coupe...Thanks!!!!!

[BobT-47P15]

Offhand, I can't recall what those numbers tell you. And how will you

know what numbers to put on that tag? On the early 49 Plym coupe

I had, someone had put those numbers on the title in place of the

engine numbers which were originally used.

[hotrodbob]

Offhand, I can't recall what those numbers tell you. And how will you

know what numbers to put on that tag? On the early 49 Plym coupe

I had, someone had put those numbers on the title in place of the

engine numbers which were originally used.

That is exactly my problem.

[claybill]

a month ago we had the same question.....i searched the address of a guy in calif who had them....right now i dont remember address. look back under 'search' good luck

also..i bought a junker 10 years ago and saved the title and ID plate!!!!!!

i knew someday i would need it. a good investment. glad i did.

bill

[desoto1939]

I checked the serila number on my 1939 desot that is attached to the passenger side inner door post.

The serial number is the VIN number and is the VIN number that should be on your owners card or registration.

My Number is 5677972. The forst serial number was 5634001 and the last was 5687134. So this means that my car was made near the end of the year and that 5172 would have been made after my car was made.

I also checked the engine number S6-45988. So if you are going to stamp the number then this should be the VIN # not the engine number.

Rich Hartung

Desoto1939@aol.com

[Niel Hoback]

Shel, I was told possesion of a loose vin tag is a federal violation, not state. It is also a federal violation to install a older motor in a car than what was original.

[Eneto-55]

.... It is also a federal violation to install a older motor in a car than what was original.

I hadn't heard this before - Where did you find this info? (I have been thinking of doing something like that myself.)

[49roadster]

If you are going to stamp any numbers be sure they match what is in the frame. That is the "hidden number" Auto theft investigators look for. On our cars this matched the motor number when the car left the factory. Any ID number you want use other than that would have given me cause to impound the car. When I was still a working cop. In CA. if the numbers don't match and you can prove (easer said than done) ownership. DMV will put one of their tags on the car and give it a new VIN.

You start messing with VIN's and you may end up in a world of problems. And be looking for another car.

Having a title and VIN plate that didn't match the "hidden number" is not taken lightly.

[Niel Hoback]

Eneto, it is part of the EPA's rulings. They are assuming that an older engine will not meet the emission requirements of a newer on. So, if you're thinking of a flathead powered Caprice Classic, forget it.

[BobT-47P15]

I looked in both the repair manual and the parts manual to see what they

said about these numbers.

They said the "vehicle number" is on the plate attached to the door frame.

The tag on the firewall is the "body number".

And the "engine number" is on the left side of the motor.

Those numbers were used when ordering parts for a specific car.

That's all they said......no breakdown of what those numbers represent.

The Briggs Body tag on the firewall would say which city the car was

built in.......like Detroit or Evansville.......or wherever else they were

made.

When the engine was replaced with another back when, that meant the "engine number" got changed if

another old Mopar engine was put in. Or, it had some number tag attached by an engine rebuilding

company. Neither of which then matched the hidden frame number. The "engine number" was used

on the original title. I doubt that the license bureau folks bothered to physically check for matching numbers

when the cars were newer, so many a title got transferred to the next guy with whatever number was on it....

matching or not. Missouri uses a title.........but some states only use a bill of sale......and I don't know what

numbers they want.

Just an opinion.......but, I would think that if you're pretty sure some old Plymouth has gone to the crusher,

and is no longer in existence, then it might be safe to use a door frame I D plate being sold today.....if you have none at all.

It would need to be riveted on like original.

Then we come back to the laws about such matters. So, how much

trouble can you get into? Can't answer that one.....you will have to

be the judge.

IF the state has a provision for them issuing a new I D number, it might

be safer to go that route. Probably more bother, but may well get you

the needed title, or whatever paper they work from.

Edited August 2, 2010 by BobT-47P15

[Plymouthy Adams]

the body tag, will state body style, place of stamping and the sequence number of that body.

I believe the export model has a bit more data with paint codes being part of that..

Edited August 2, 2010 by Tim Adams

[greg g]

Here is my theory. Bodies were stamped by Briggs and given a number so they could bill Plymouth for the units sold, the engine was assembled at the engine assembly plant, and stamped with a number which tells you when it was made and what it went into. The frame body and engine came together at the assembly plant and became a vehicle with a manufacturer's serial number. Until that number is attached you have parts, components and assemblies.

My registration (no titletill 1972) from NY is based on a transfered registration from PA (no title don't know when PA introduced titles) gave the Serial number as the Identifying property. However since NY DMV folks are a division of individual county clerks office, this may have been different in differnt counties. All the pre title cars I have had and registered have been transferred and registered throught he serial number.

Be interesting to hear from other NY ers to see what numbers are on their ownership documents. The transferrable registration reciept stands as the ownership documnetation for all pre 1972 vehicles in NY.

If you can not produce documents for a pre title vehicle, all that needs to be done is a pencil tracing of the serial number and a signed affidavit (downloadable from the DMV site) that you possess the vehicle and to the best of your knowledge, no other parties have a claim to ownership.

Good luck with your process, sounds like you may be up against it unless you can prove your ownership and have the DMV issue you a new id number.

Edited August 2, 2010 by greg g

[TodFitch]

... Be interesting to hear from other NY ers to see what numbers are on their ownership documents. The transferrable registration reciept stands as the ownership documnetation for all pre 1972 vehicles in NY. ...

My 1933 PD two door sedan was shipped from the factory to Lang Motors in Rochester, NY. I bought the car in 1973 in Rochester, NY while a student at the UofR. Seller claimed he bought it from the son of the original owner. Based on the rust and the above, I'm pretty sure it spent its life prior to my ownership in the Rochester area. The registration for the car listed the engine number.

[Eneto-55]

Apparently there has been a lot of variation from state to state regarding which number was used on vehicle titles. Oklahoma (where I grew up) has used titles since way back, possibly from the beginning of statehood (1907). I know that at first drivers licenses were not required, and that later (in the 20's or 30's, I think) they began requiring a registration sort of drivers license, where you just went in and gave them your name, etc, and they gave you the license. So maybe they started the title registration then as well. When I filed for lost title on my 46 in 81, I gave them the number off of the serial plate on the left front door post, and they found the records for it. They didn't just give me a new title - I don't think they did that sort of thing - and also the title includes some original information, like the original selling price.

[JerseyHarold]

Had been registered with engine # when I bought it.

Got that changed to the serial # when I registered it.

Ditto for me. Did this on several cars when I lived in NY.

[BobT-47P15]

The 1949 P15 coupe I bought had the doorpost serial number on the title when

I got it. Had been registered in Arkansas at one time.....may have

been changed there. Nonetheless, the local license bureau simply

went with that number. I certainly wasn't going to make an issue

of it.

[hotrodbob]

Calif is starting to look at these and if the engine has been changed can re-register the car as a special construction. This then makes the car the year it is newly registered and must meet the smog regs for the engine year or current year.

Calif registered many MOPARs of that era by the engine #.

[49roadster]

As I recall prior to 1955 all Calif. cars were reg. by motor number. It was a big deal to us teen agers when they switched to a VIN.

[hotrodbob]

Yep, that's my problem now. Registration doesn't match and I don't want to register it as a special construction vehicle. I've had it over 25 years

[fstfish66]

how would i find info on the frame serial numbers location ??? i did a dumb thing my car has no ID TAGS,,, ut i kept copies of the previous title,,and owners name,,, id tags were lost so i was told during a paint job,,, not that ide ever wanna sell it,, ide just like to make sure the title and frame serial number match?????

ive seen plenty of vintage 40s vehicles with street rod store bought stamped ID tags,, i didnt think much of it when i bought the car,,,

Edited August 10, 2010 by fstfish66

[BobT-47P15]

The original engine serial number is stamped on the frame, at least on the

46-48 Plym P15. Click on the link to see a previous post I made with a

picture on that topic. There are other comments in that thread. Hope

this might help.

http://www430.pair.com/p15d24/mopar_forum/showthread.php?t=21227&highlight=frame+number