What is a "Title"......can someone explain?

[Andydodge]

O/k.......I'm in Australia and the system is this.......my 1940 Dodge Sedan was made in Australia, I bought it in 1971 and it was "registered" by the state government when I purchased it, which means it had a number plate front & rear with a specific number, it also had a waterslide decal on the windscreen that had the same number as the number plate plus it had the brand and type of car, eg, sedan,coupe,etc it also has on the decal a date of the month of the year that corresponds with the date and month of the year it was sold to its first owner who subsequently paid the state government a "registration" fee on the anniversary of this date that allows/certifies me to use the car on the road.........its classed as "registered".......when I bought it the last owner gave me its "registration"(rego) paper, a sheet of A5 size paper which had the engine/chassis numbers, number plate number and owners address....the previous owner filled in the reverse side of the rego paper that he had sold the car and the amount it was sold for, I completed the reverse side that I had bought this car and how much I'd paid and took this paper and a receipt for the money I'd paid to the State Govt Department that oversights this, paid a small "sales tax" on the purchase price, and a nominal "transfer" fee and had new rego papers issued to me in my name saying I own the registered car.......each year I get a "new" rego paper posted out with the uncertified decal on it and after having the car pass a saftey check by a licenced mechanic I take his o/k'd certificate plus my new rego paper to the State Govt dept and pay a rego fee & insurance fee and I get the new certified decal to replace the old one and new rego paper endorsed that the car can be legally driven on the road for another 12 mths.......how does this differ from the USA system where a "Title" is required or indeed if one doesn't exist can be bought?.........or in fact.......what is a title?.......thanks........I hope........lol...........Andy Douglas

[Plymouthy Adams]

and what proof do you have of ownership of said vehicle say if the car was not prior registered by the PO and in-op for highway use while you do the recontruction? Sounds a bit like you mimic the UK for documentation..of which I do not really know much except from a bud who imports a few cars now and then..

a car title here is proof of REAL tangable property similar to a home tilte for personal held real estate..you can title a vehicle in many states without haveing to have registration and insurance...Ihave done it for years in my prior home state. Title is proof of owner ship free and clear...

[Merle Coggins]

Our Title is very much like how you describe your Rego papers. When we purchase a vehicle we need to transfer the Title paperwork into our name and pay the registration fees and taxes. Then you get a Certificate of Title that shows the vehicle make model and VIN along with your name and address. Then every year we get a renewal notice that has to be sent in with your registration renewal fees. In areas where emission testing is required, or vehicle inspections are required, than those certificates must accompany the renewal. You will then receive a sticker to put on your license plate to show that your registration is current.

Merle

[Plymouthy Adams]

Merle..confusing me....a title is proof of owner ship..the yearly renewal is the registeration that allows you to operate the vehicle on the highway..(tag)..registeration can encompass a number of other things like your proof of vehicle safety, proper taxes paid to date, proof of insurance etc etc..title is not an annual renewal..title is a one time deal when you purchase the vehicle..titles are transferred at time of sale and reissued to new owner as long as you own the car..the title is a one time issue.

[Young Ed]

Tim what would stop someone from just claiming to have bought a vehicle in Georgia in order to get a title in another state?

[Plymouthy Adams]

the bill of sale would be orgin in Georgia..for sales out of the state, the presence of a notary documentation to authenticate the orgin from that state should be present. I would not buy a car in this manner without a notorized bill of sale...

reciprosity can be honored but still have added stitpulations state to state...example, some state may require a bond to be poosted just in case someone should try to claim ownership..

It is always best to appraoch the DMV prior to any purchase and get the "requirement" for ownership/registration in your state prior to purchase.

I can sell a late model car in Ga without title and by resgistration only...this is a broken chain title now..even if I were to go and find the original title..I could never again get it titled in this state..the title is purely "pretty paper" for the owner..

[Young Ed]

The lost title procedure in MN typically requires a bond for 3 years for the value of the vehicle. Which of course is always greatly higher then what anyone would actually pay. So we always make sure the title process is finished before starting any work. My 48 coupe was bought from someone who bought it from a junkyard in Wyoming. We wrote the story down on the sworn paper you fill out and attached the business card of the yard we got it from and I didn't have to get a bond. Small miracle. Next one I have to do is my 40 plymouth. We bought it out of a junkyard in about 96. We'll see what they do to me on that one.

[40plyrod]

When I bought my 40 sedan it didn't have any title or paper work. All I had to do was get a reciept from the guy I bought it from( It wasn't registered to him either) and take that to our local insurance office and give them the vin number off the door post plus $11 and they do a title search. If the car has been recently registered( within the last 30 or so years) you get a copy of the registration. You then have to send a registered letter to the person on the registration asking them to signed the enclosed transfer papers if it comes back unopened or dosen't come back after 30 days you go back to the insurance office and they write you a new registraition with your name on it, and you can then insure it and drive it right away or in my case work on it for the next however many years. No bonds or incumbances. On my dads 27 chrysler the title search didn't show anybody because it had been too long without being registered or had not been previously registered in the province so they send us a special form and now what happens is it has to be safety inspected when finnished and then we take the passed inspection certificate along with the special form to the insurance office and they will write my Dad a new registration with his name on it. I'm not sure what restrictions will be on that though. We are in Canada Though

[Robert Horne]

the bill of sale would be orgin in Georgia..for sales out of the state, the presence of a notary documentation to authenticate the orgin from that state should be present. I would not buy a car in this manner without a notorized bill of sale...

reciprosity can be honored but still have added stitpulations state to state...example, some state may require a bond to be poosted just in case someone should try to claim ownership..

It is always best to appraoch the DMV prior to any purchase and get the "requirement" for ownership/registration in your state prior to purchase.

I can sell a late model car in Ga without title and by resgistration only...this is a broken chain title now..even if I were to go and find the original title..I could never again get it titled in this state..the title is purely "pretty paper" for the owner..

I live in Va. Bought my 49 Plymouth from Ga. The owner gave me a bill of sale, and also the the Ill. Title from the prior owner. Took these 2 documents to the Virginia Department of Transportation, got a new Virginia Title, no problem. The Va. DMV said I only needed the Bill of Sale, but they make a copy of the Ill.Title, and they let me keep the Ill. Title as a sovernir.....

[JerseyHarold]

What Andydodge is describing sounds exactly like the way New York State operates for all vehicles built prior to 1973. For '73-up, you need a title to prove ownership and a registration to use the vehicle on public roadways.

The title usually lists the lienholder if the car is financed, so a future owner would be aware of a title encumbrance when purchasing the car. If the loan is paid-off, the lender issues a 'Lien Satisfaction' document that the new owner presents to DMV along with the original title so they can receive a new, clear title. Many states (NJ is one of them) deliver the vehicle title to the lienholder, who then gives it to the vehicle owner once the loan is paid-off. The theory is that the owner can't sell the vehicle without the title, to protect the finance company.

New Jersey has always been a title state to my knowledge.

[Plymouthy Adams]

beleive you will find most states are like that..the one you got to be careful of is the states that will allow later model sale of vehicles without a title but by registeration only (Gerogia for example) now the real problem exist in the fact that the owner can go to a title pawn and get money against the car on surrender of the title..then he can sell the car to a unsuspecting buyer who later finds the title could have a lien on the car..not sure at all how to un-sticky this situation..I know that title pawns should NEVER be allowed to exist just for the single scenario as above...they operate on the fringe of everything I guess as if you pawn the title, default the payback..wreck the car..the most the pawn broker can do is collect the wreck..I asked a broker of this and he said they are not allowed by law to report this default to the credit bureaus..so while they make money..I would assume they operate at quite a risk themselves.

[greg g]

Y has two systems, prior to 72 or 73 there was a transferrable registration document. This was a carry card you showed to police if stopped (Liscence, registration and insurance card please) the was the annual document to legally register your vehicle for proper over the road operation. On the back was a line to sign when you sold the care or transferred ownership. With out the signature on the sold by line, the document was not valid for the transfer. This got sticky when the owner had passed a way and the car was being sold by a relative. You could also include a bill of sale, but this was merely documentation for the folks at the DMV to calculate the sales tax value of the car. Lots of times the value was deflated as a fovor to the buyer, it was even part of the price negotiations for the car. As in if you give me 100 bucks more, for the car, I'll write that I sold it for 300, so you will get it back on the sales tax.

When the title laws began, a title was procurred from the state, by either exchanging the Manufacturer's certificate of origin, or the previous owners title document, pluss the fee for the new title in the new owner's name. So here its just a fund raising thing for the DMV as the process has gone from 20 buck's to 75 since it introduction.

We still need to register our cars for the road, include license plate, windsield decal, and glove box reciept showig fees are paid. Ours are based on vehicle weight for pass cars and carrying capacity for commercial vehicles, and are valid for two years.

If you buy a different car, you can choose to begine the process anew or transfer you current plate and registation to the new vehicle. and yes there is a fee for that transfer, but if you just renewed your 2 year in DEC and buy a new car in Jan, it cost less than starting from scratch.

But you do need to get the new title for each post 73 vehicle.

However for us old car folks, fo a car 25 years old and older, possesion is 9/10's of the law. All we need to do is take a tracing of the serial number, or vin plate, and a affidavit saying you own the car, and can not provide any other documentation due to previous owner unknow, deceased, moved out of state etc. They will check their stolen vehicle records for the number and if it doesn't show up it yours. If its a pre title car you get a transferable registration, if it a title ar you need to pay for the tiltle ad the registration. In other words unlike Minnesota where you need to back up you claim with a cash money bond, in NY your word is your bond. (now there a cencept we should all have more insistance on)

[P15Mike]

I live in Md . Maryland ia a title state for any car any year . No inspection is needed for any car registered as antique or classic ( over 25yrs old ) . With a classic car you have to re-up your licence every 2 years ( new sticker for the tag ) About 4 years ago they instituted law where any vehicle over 60 yrs old ( mine being 63 ) only has to pay a one time fee for licencing , therefore only leaving insurance premiums for the duration of ownership . Unsure why this came about , but my guess is that anything this old , one would not be getting away with everyday driving . Also with antique/classic plates , these vehicles cant be drivien during the week unless for special circumstance's or holidays .

Mike

[Young Ed]

Greg I wish MN was easier on this. When I was doing the process for my 46 pickup the state wouldn't issue a title without a bond. Bonding company wouldn't issue a bond for a vehicle without proof of ownership.

[JerseyHarold]

Ed,

Do you have any friends or relatives in a state where the title laws are more user-friendly? They can get a title in their name and transfer it to you as a gift. If you don't have any documentation to begin with, you have nothing to lose.

[Frank Elder]

Do you guys think you have Andy confused yet?

[Niel Hoback]

I was getting ready to explain Indiana, (a title state), when I confused myself and gave up!

[Young Ed]

Ed,

Do you have any friends or relatives in a state where the title laws are more user-friendly? They can get a title in their name and transfer it to you as a gift. If you don't have any documentation to begin with, you have nothing to lose.

No one I'm really close with except in Uncle in Washington where apparently they are even worse!

[BobT-47P15]

A few years ago, my next door neighbor rebuilt a 46 Ford coupe.

After it was done, I noticed a Georgia license tag on it....for about

a year.

I would say he availed himself of a service that gets you a new

registration and tag in Georgia for a fee, of course. Then you

later re-title it to Missouri.

All cars in Missouri are supposed to have a title.

When you buy an antique vehicle license plate (for age 25 or

older) you do not have to pass the annual vehicle inspection

and the plate is good as long as you own that car. No annual

renewals.

If you buy parts and pieces to build a car, I believe you can take

bills of sale for major components like body and engine, plus the

completed car to the Highway Patrol for inspection. I think they

issue a new VIN number and also check records for any prior theft

info related to the old VIN number on the car. I've never done this.

If all goes well, you get a new title - but I'm not sure how that new

title identifies the car.

Guess I should ask sometime.......the new paper might call a 1948

Plymouth a 2010 Plymouth or something....

[BobT-47P15]

You can, sometimes, purchase "historical documents" - old titles,

probably saved from old salvage yards - on ebay or from other

sources.

Of course, you try to find one the same make and year as your old

untitled car. Not sure what you do about the non-matching vin #.

[JerseyHarold]

Over on the HAMB there seems to be thriving commerce in those Historical Documents. Sometimes they even come with matching VIN tags for the true 'collector'!

[Andydodge]

Frankie.......lol.........you ain't wrong, but seriously tho' it seems that the Title is basically the same as our registration .....the Rego Dept does a check to see if the car has been previously reg'd, stolen or noted as a written off wreck, and if everything is o/k then the ownership of the car is noted in my name, the rego papers, window sticker and whatever number plate that i want, whether just the standard issue plate or a custom ordred plate with my name etc is issued..........the car is legally in my name( the "Title" I suppose) and is noted by the govt, insurance industry if I get it insured, and for issue of parking fines, speeding tickets, etc...........I wondered last night how many responses i'd get.........lol........its all good........thanks, guys, all of you, makes me smile & I learn some more ...........anyway, off to work........hi ho,hi ho...........Andy Douglas

[Frank Elder]

Andy, we have 50 states and several territorys and each one has different rules and regulations concerning titles, what a headache.

For example our cars in my state are no longer inspected annually, but if you buy a car with no title or from a different state it must be inspected to be titled.

[greg g]

You said if you insured it. Is insurance not mandetory? Many states here have a minimum coverage requirement, basically to protedc others against damage you cause to them or their property. Used to be some states would let you buy an indepedant surity bond but ot any more. We have to have a valid insurance card to present to law enforcement officials.

Here is you let you insurance lapse (on payment) the company is required to notify DMV that you are not covered, They will revoke your plates and park your car (says here in fine print) Likewise if you want to cancel a policy, you need to send in a reciept for surrender of plates from the DMV before thay will cancel the policy.

To many people with revoked or suspended liscenses running around in unisured vehicles with bogus plates. If the favorite pass time of folks who have been convicted of more than one DWI, and certain folks who have a more than casual disregard for others and the loaws that govern our behavior.

[55 Fargo]

Andy, we have 50 states and several territorys and each one has different rules and regulations concerning titles, what a headache.

For example our cars in my state are no longer inspected annually, but if you buy a car with no title or from a different state it must be inspected to be titled.

Frankie, even in Canada, we have 10 provinces and 2 territories, all of which have different regulations for titles and registration rules.

Some provinces have private insurance same companies as in USA, State Farm, Prudential etc, while other provinces have Public Insurance for motor vehicles, state run so to speak. Manitoba has public insurance for motor vehicles, but private insurance companies sell the stuff to you and register the vehicles, go figure, it is dirt cheap though compared to the private insurance provinces like Ontario, which has 13 million people and little old Manitoba only has 1.2 million people.

When I registered my 47, did not need title, just signed a declaration, and produced valid Motor vehicle safety certificate, and it was done, normally you just need a bill of sale, but I lucked out on this old baby, even got my 888 plate too boot........