Master cylinder options on p15.

[rcl700]

I know many on this forum are well versed in what works and what does not. I'm in the process of getting my 48' p15  black on the road. I will need to tackle breaking system soon and want to know what options are available for the master cylinder. Do I replace with stock unit, attempt to rebuild stock unit, upgrade???

 

I'm looking at the explorer 8.8 with drums for swapping the rear. I'm not set but with stock I need to find all the leaks in the center section probably replaced wheel cylinders possibly brake shoes. I'll need to buy a puller for the drums.... (limited by factory gearing) 

I also plan to replace brake and fuel lines. One day id like to have disk in the front but this seems pricey (1700)My original question is what options should I be looking at for the master cylinder. I'm not really excited about one  reservoir for front and back, but also lM Limited by my understanding of how to modify the system. 

What are your thoughts? Best option for starting with essentially no brakes. 

Links to products, pictures, descriptions, write-ups all welcome. I'm not apposed to disk in the rear but read that a stock p15 MS may not be up to the task. 

Are there duel res units that fit in the factory location? 

 

I need help🤓

 

[Plymouthy Adams]

you should be able to do a search here, this is not a cop out in any manner but there are tons of ways of doing this and in truth, how handy are with your hands and what tools are at your disposal.  The job can range from just a C note out your pocket to that of a Franklin family reunion.  

[Ivan_B]

2 hours ago, rcl700 said:

I'll need to buy a puller for the drums....

Isn't the one available for loan from a local parts store going to work?

The easiest fist would be a direct OEM replacement, for sure

[DJ194950]

https://ecihotrodbrakes.com/chrysler-master-cylinder-assemblies

 

Others have used this company and their parts.  They worked well for most. A search to find forum posts may be good.

 

This is brought up if you do not have the tools and/or enough knowledge to design something simular as some others have done.

Again a forum search on these posts may well be in order.

 

Just some possibilities to chew on.

 

Best to ya,

 

DJ

[Tired iron]

Not saying what you should do, but just helping you consider options...

 

My master and lines were shot, so I had to do something. With a very long and steep mtn road driveway, I was nervous about a single circuit master to begin with, so I bought a 50 dollar common 2 circuit master (firewall mounted) and new NICOP brake tubing. 150 bucks and safe...and easy to top off.

 

Lots of other options, tho.

[Plymouthy Adams]

something you may wish to consider is the question, do I want to continually be checking and servicing fluid levels through a hole in the floor, if planning carpet do I want to have to pull the carpet back each operation.  Do I really need/want to relocate pedals and alter the pan on top of the high cost of the master and bracket when installing a new master does not need these encumbrances?  These are things you should look at close before pulling the trigger on any KIT a company should sell or any setup you should entertain if a 'roll your own' install.  The planning phase is where to address this, not midstream and at the first 'oops' in the process.   This is just issues with the master upgrade, you have not tied in with the original brakes and or the possible upgrade to disc where issues of balance and residual pressure will need be addressed also.  

[Eneto-55]

Something I've wondered about, and maybe it has occurred to you as well - Is it legal, feasible, and/or 'safe' to use a bell crank (like the one in your clutch mechanism) on a brake pedal to MC design?  This would allow for the placement of a dual reservoir MC in a more accessible location without converting everything to hanging pedals.  For instance, some have gutted the original MC and used an extended push rod (passing through the length of the original MC) to engage a dual reservoir MC mounted farther back.  The issue with that is that it places the fill point farther back, under the front seat.  (Even more inconvenient to check than the stock location.) 

 

I haven't thought this all through to the point of knowing where all this would allow the MC to be located, so it may not be a reasonable proposition at all.  My main question would be as to the advisability of introducing the ball crank into an otherwise straight in-line push rod design.

 

EDIT to Add:

Here is a custom hanging brake system that also uses a bell crank design.

Brake bell crank

Edited May 6 by Eneto-55

[Plymouthy Adams]

the belcrank is marketed by one of the leaders in braking for hotrods and racing.....many case it is better defined as a cantilever.   

 

Adding to some of the comments here, even my own, do not overlook the simplicity and ease of maintenance that a remote reservoir offers, and most popular master cylinder designs have some aftermarket support for this application also.  

[Sniper]

Lot's of factory setups use a cantilever setup.  Remote fill caps are simple enough solution to the under the floor fill cap situation.

 

There is a thread here on this very site on how to roll your own front discs.  Using commonly available brake parts.

 

 

 

[46BulldogDodge]

Here’s a suggestion, maybe just for research and understanding. Greg Coffin makes and sells a kit for power wagons that adds a booster and dual MC while keeping the hanging pedals. Check powerwagonadvertiser.com and search “Under-Cab Power Brakes and Dual Master”. It’s from Jan 2015!

 

If you can’t get in that website, try the dodgepowerwagon.com forum. Click on Phil’s Archives and search the same title above…”Under-Cab…  It will link you to the PWA article.   The kit is available from vintagepowerwagons.com. 
 

Making it work on a car would be the next thought!

[Sam Buchanan]

1 hour ago, Eneto-55 said:

  For instance, some have gutted the original MC and used an extended push rod (passing through the length of the original MC) to engage a dual reservoir MC mounted farther back.  The issue with that is that it places the fill point farther back, under the front seat.  (Even more inconvenient to check than the stock location.) 

 

Not if you use remote reservoirs that are easily accessible. 

 

[Eneto-55]

1 hour ago, Plymouthy Adams said:

the belcrank is marketed by one of the leaders in braking for hotrods and racing.....many case it is better defined as a cantilever.   

 

Adding to some of the comments here, even my own, do not overlook the simplicity and ease of maintenance that a remote reservoir offers, and most popular master cylinder designs have some aftermarket support for this application also.  

Yes, while the example site I posted came up on a search for 'brake bell crank', that one isn't really what I think of as a 'bell crank' - I was thinking more like the clutch bell crank.  But to do what I was thinking it might require two or more bell cranks.  (I just haven't thought it through at any depth.  I have personally never had any serious brake failure using a single reservoir MC, so don't think of it as being a serious issue. I HAVE had fairly bad fluid leak issues with one, but it wasn't as serious as the time the rear brake line burst on my 2000 Chrysler T&C.  That went down to nothing really fast.)

[Eneto-55]

36 minutes ago, Sam Buchanan said:

 

Not if you use remote reservoirs that are easily accessible. 

 

Yep, I've seen these described and illustrated here, but I think I'd want to see one in person before doing it myself.