1952 B3b with Cummins 4bt

[Young Ed]

When I did the spring hangers on the back of my 46 I used a grade 8 shoulder bolt for a tight fit to keep them from moving. Lock washers or nuts are of course needed.

[Dodgeb4ya]

I have always removed the hangers with a 3/4" or bigger hand chisel with a 5lb hammer or a air chisel. Then a punch  just a bit smaller size than the diameter of the rivit shank. Quick and easy. No time consuming drilling and hole enlargement.

A shoulder bolt is wise too.

[1952B3b23]

I agree with Grade 8 bolts, this is a very important part of the front suspension and i dont want to get cheap on any of it. The more heavy duty the better especially since im adding a little bit more weight with diesel.

 

I finished removing both of the mounts last night and i used a combo of drilling and chiseling to remove the rivets. On my truck there where backing plates that mounted between the shackle mount and frame rail and they extended back to the transmission mounts. I assume that this is there to give some extra support to the frame. My question is was this on all trucks or is it just something the previous owner did to mine? Either way i still think its a good idea since this is a pretty high stress area.  

 

-Chris

[John-T-53]

I think if I were doing this, I would use Frame Bolts and Flanged Stover Locknuts. These are Grade 8 quality and are better suited for this type of application.

 

I like this idea. Merle, now you're gonna make me crawl under my truck again! Any ideas on a source for these?

 

Thanks,

[Don Coatney]

 Any ideas on a source for these?

 

Thanks,

Check McMaster Carr. They should have them.

[1952B3b23]

Check McMaster Carr. They should have them.

 

Thats where i'll be getting the ones for my truck, heres what i found on McMaster-Carr:

 

Bolts:

 

http://www.mcmaster.com/#standard-cap-screws/=mka6m0

 

Flanged Nuts:

 

http://www.mcmaster.com/#standard-collar-locknuts/=mka7q2

 

The nuts are a one time use distorted thread fit but i think they'd be great for this application.

 

-Chris

[Merle Coggins]

The nuts are a one time use distorted thread fit but i think they'd be great for this application.

 

-Chris

 

That's pretty much it. Also... don't use an impact gun to install them. If you spin them too fast it will over heat the nuts and ruin the locking ability.

 

Merle

[1952B3b23]

That's pretty much it. Also... don't use an impact gun to install them. If you spin them too fast it will over heat the nuts and ruin the locking ability.

 

Merle

 

Good to know Merle, thanks.

 

-Chris

[1952B3b23]

Well guys ive gotten a little bit done on the truck just havent been able to update the thread lately. I removed both of the front leaf spring shackle mounts that are riveted on the frame and cleaned and straightened the frame rails in those areas. I then decided to weld a piece of sheet metal to the inside so that i could fill some holes where the tranny mount went. Then i ground the welds down to give the outside of the frame rails a smooth look, see attached pics. 

 

Also i bought one of the last major pieces of the puzzle, a rear end. Its a Mopar 8-3/4 with the "742" third member and posi which from my understanding is the most desirable for high torque applications. The previous owner told me it was out of a B-body car and the serial number stamped on the outside of the carrier places it somewhere from ~1961-1969. It has all new 11" drum brakes and supposedly the third member was professionally rebuilt some time ago and it has new axles. He told me that it has 3.43 gears which should work well with the 4bt. I'll verify the gear ratio by spinning the tire and counting the revolutions the drive shaft yoke makes.

 

Things are finally coming together and im slowly getting closer to having a rolling chassis so i can work on motor and tranny mounting.

[wayfarer]

...just an observation, but I don't recall MotherMopar ever using a 3.43 gearset.  The 3.55 was common with manual trans cars and a 3.31 was an early 8¾ option. Of course the 3.23 was found in just about everything.

Not a big deal, just an observation. It would only affect your speedo gear selection.

[1952B3b23]

...just an observation, but I don't recall MotherMopar ever using a 3.43 gearset.  The 3.55 was common with manual trans cars and a 3.31 was an early 8¾ option. Of course the 3.23 was found in just about everything.

Not a big deal, just an observation. It would only affect your speedo gear selection.

 

I had that same thought thats why i want to check the gear ratio myself. The guy may have just forgotten exactly what gear set he chose. From my research i also see that 3.43 isnt listed as an option, but like you said no big deal. Thanks for pointing that out.

 

-Chris

[Merle Coggins]

I saw this 4BT install today. They look a lot bigger installed in a pickup.

 

 

I wasn't wild about how he did the rest of the truck, but the engine conversion looked pretty good.

 

 

 

[Young Ed]

I saw this 4BT install today. They look a lot bigger installed in a pickup.

 

 

 

I wasn't wild about how he did the rest of the truck, but the engine conversion looked pretty good.

 

All that fab work and he can't come up with a decent hood prop rod......Those R series binders are nice looking trucks. I believe that one started out as a 53-54.

[1952B3b23]

Thats a pretty cool looking truck, i think ive seen it in before in a Diesel Power magazine article. I like the compound turbo setup, dont plan on doing it to my truck but none the less i wouldnt mind driving a 4bt with them.

 

Merle, was this at a local car show?

[Merle Coggins]

Merle, was this at a local car show?

 

Yes, it was in Wisconsin Dells, WI this past weekend.

[1952B3b23]

Yes, it was in Wisconsin Dells, WI this past weekend.

 

Very cool, i wish i could take a look at the truck and maybe pick the owners brain for any helpful hints. Did you get to talk to him (or her) at all?

[Merle Coggins]

No, there was a pretty good crowd around it when I walked past. I was lucky enough to get those shots without too much interuption.

[1952B3b23]

Small Update:

 

I checked the rear axle ratio on the 8 3/4 and its got 3.55's, should serve me pretty well. I also got in the new leaf spring perch mounts (from Summit Racing) to weld to the new rear axle. 

 

I ordered up some custom u-bolts for mounting my front and rear axle from the following place:

 

http://uboltsdirect.com/

 

They look to be good quality (Grade 5 Steel, 1/2" rod) and they fit the mounting brackets and around the leaf springs well. I paid $5/ea. for the rear axle ones and $4/ea. for the front axle. I also ordered up the nuts and washers to go along with them so that i have everything i needed in one package when it comes time to instal. I would definitely recommend these guys and the customer service was great. They are out of NY so it only took them one day to get them down to me in MA. 

 

-Chris

[1952B3b23]

Made some progress last night. I got the rear suspension off and it was much easier than expected. Thanks to 48Dodger for making the YouTube videos it was much easier and quicker to get mine off.

Also my frame rails over the rear axle, where the hump is in the rails are twisted. The tops of the rails on the left and right side are both bent inwards. The bottoms of the rails are still straight which is good. But I have no idea how both rails would have gotten twisted inwards unless the truck was over loaded at some time. I'm going to try using a come a long or porta power to try and straighten things out. I'll post up some pics when I'm outta work cause its much easier to see what I'm talking about.

[1952B3b23]

Small update:

 

Installed the new rear shackle frame mounts, new shackles, and new leaf springs on the rear suspension. Making progress slowly but im one step closer to a rolling chasis again. Attached a picture for your viewing pleasure.

 

-Chris

[1952B3b23]

So i did a bit more work on the truck after work today. I have decided to box the frame in at the humps that go over the rear axle to strengthen this area up a bit more. I brought the boxing plate (1/8" thick) as close as possible to the shock mount but still leaving enough space to get a wrench in there to remove the bolts if need be. 

 

I welded up the plate and began to grind down the welds to try and blend it better into the frame so it looks nicer. I dont want to grind down to far and grind all the weld away. What do you guys think? Ive attached two pictures of my progress so far. 

[Apittslife]

Looks like it will work

[Dave72dt]

if you have the plate set flush with the top of the frame, bevel the frame edge back and the inside of the plate also.  You'll get better weld penetration and won't have to worry so much about grinding off too much weld.  You can also drop the boxing plate down so it's top edge is even with the inside edge of the  frame lip and weld from there, once again getting good weld penetration and not having to worry about grinding the weld and weakening it.

[1952B3b23]

if you have the plate set flush with the top of the frame, bevel the frame edge back and the inside of the plate also.  You'll get better weld penetration and won't have to worry so much about grinding off too much weld.  You can also drop the boxing plate down so it's top edge is even with the inside edge of the  frame lip and weld from there, once again getting good weld penetration and not having to worry about grinding the weld and weakening it.

 

Thanks for the input guys. I did bevel the edges as you suggest and i left a small gap between the face of the boxing plate and edge of the rail to try and get good weld penetration, so i should be alright. When i box the front portion of the frame for the engine and tranny mounts im going to make the boxing plates fit inside the rail so that i can recess them in a little and create a sort of shelf to catch the weld. That should give me a good solid weld and then i wont have to grind them down. 

 

I hope to be able to work on it more after work, stay tuned for some more progress.

 

-Chris

Edited July 11, 2013 by 1952B3b23

[1952B3b23]

Update:

 

Worked on boxing the frame over the rear axle humps again, i have one side complete and the other all welded up but still need to grind down the welds. I also mounted the frame on my homemade "rotisserie" so i can easily flip it without help. Thanks to Tim aka 48Dodger for the idea for the frame stands. After finishing up the rear boxing i'll move onto the front portion where the motor mounts and tranny crossmember will go.

 

-Chris