Getting the Seized Engine Free/Moving Thread

[Young Ed]

Niel do you think you could use the spark plug wires hooked to the fuses to fire them off?

[falconvan]

Okay Sir, but AGAIN I AM IN NO RUSH, so will let soak, until it breaks loose or Ima ready to dsimantle, not a big deal.

I am not being brutish with the flywheel or front pulley nut, but understand what forcing can do....

My boss bought an old custom 46 Ford truck two years ago that was put together in the mid 70's but had been sitting behind a shed and hadnt run in years. It's really cool; red sparkly diamond tuck interior, 389 Pontiac that was froze up solid. Anyway, he did the same deal; filled the cylinders with penetrating oil and let em soak while working it with a pry bar. I told him he was nuts and should just tear it down and save the hassle. I'll be darned if he didnt get it broke loose, got it running, and is still driving it after just doing a few oil changes to get the crud out, a tuneup, and carb rebuild. It made a believer out of me.

[knighthawk]

I remember hearing of a guy that hung a long pipe or bar off the crank pulley for leverage, like a really long crank handle and hung a weight on the end of it, and just waited, eventually, when the long handle fell to the ground, he knew the motor was free

[knuckleharley]

NOTHING beats carb cleaner for unsticking a stuck engine. Free up and close all the valves,and then pour the front cylinder full of carb cleaner and then use a "hold open device" to use your air compressor to pump 125 psi or so of compressed air to push the carb cleaner past the rings. If you don't have or are too cheap to buy the tool that allows you to change valve springs in a OHV engine without the valve falling into the cylinder,you can make one from a old spark plug by knocking the porcelain off and tapping the inside to accept a air fitting,or just soldering the air fitting in the hole.

Anyhow,put your air hose on it and sit back and relax while the carb cleaner does it's magic on the aluminum pistons and steel rings and cylinder walls. Soon you will hear a "glub,glub,glub" noise as the air leaks past the rings and makes those noises in the oil pan.

Remove your plug and hose,and then fill that cylinder full of thin oil like WD-40 or ATF. Reattach the plug and hose and repeat the pressure process until you hear the glub noises again. You do this to make sure the rings and cylinder are well-lubed when you eventually use the starter to spin the engine.

Move on to the next cylinder and keep repeating until all have had a breath of compressed air and a good coating of thin oil.

Once this is done use the starter to spin the engine. I normally just hit it lightly several times at first before trying to spin it fast.

Once this step is completed,go ahead and pull the oil pan to clean it out properly to make sure that any sludge,rust flakes,or anything else broken free by the carb cleaner and clean oil is eliminated from the system before you get carried away with excitement and try to start the engine. Refill the engine with the cheapest 30 wt non-detergent oil you can find because if you are wise you will change the oil again after running the engine for 30 minutes or so.

Once I am sure there are no broken rods or other nasties to deal with,I go ahead and spin the engine using the starter until I build up oil pressure. You may have to do this several times because you need to pause after maybe 15 or 20 seconds of the starter spinning in order to let it cool down to prevent burning it up.

It should also be said that the starter should have been taken off and cleaned and had the end bushings greased before you start this process.

The last one I did this was was my 49 Chrysler that had been sitting for maybe 15 years. The oil pumped up so slowly on this one I was worried that the oil pump wasn't working,but eventually the new oil got pumped up and it spun up to 60 lbs psi of oil pressure just from using the starter.

This is done without the spark plugs being in the engine,of course.

Once this is done go ahead and readjust the valves,install the spark plugs, and fire the old girl up.

VERY important to do this. I forgot to readjust the valves on a 54 Olds once that I freed up,and it drove me crazy for a couple of days trying to figure out why it wouldn't start. Come to find out,the valves have to open and close. Go figure!

BTW,it is also very important to flood the cylinders with ATF or a good light oil if for some reason you don't plan on starting up and driving the car for any length of time. The reason for this is the carb cleaner will have left the cylinder walls,pistons,and rings as dry as a bone,and rust will immediately start reforming if something happens and you don't get to spin up oil pressure right away. Don't ask me how I know this.

[55 Fargo]

NOTHING beats carb cleaner for unsticking a stuck engine. Free up and close all the valves,and then pour the front cylinder full of carb cleaner and then use a "hold open device" to use your air compressor to pump 125 psi or so of compressed air to push the carb cleaner past the rings. If you don't have or are too cheap to buy the tool that allows you to change valve springs in a OHV engine without the valve falling into the cylinder,you can make one from a old spark plug by knocking the porcelain off and tapping the inside to accept a air fitting,or just soldering the air fitting in the hole.

My engine is a Mopar Flathead 6, the head is off, the engine is out of the car, the cyls are filled with ATF and solvent right now

Anyhow,put your air hose on it and sit back and relax while the carb cleaner does it's magic on the aluminum pistons and steel rings and cylinder walls. Soon you will hear a "glub,glub,glub" noise as the air leaks past the rings and makes those noises in the oil pan.

Remove your plug and hose,and then fill that cylinder full of thin oil like WD-40 or ATF. Reattach the plug and hose and repeat the pressure process until you hear the glub noises again. You do this to make sure the rings and cylinder are well-lubed when you eventually use the starter to spin the engine.

Move on to the next cylinder and keep repeating until all have had a breath of compressed air and a good coating of thin oil.

Once this is done use the starter to spin the engine. I normally just hit it lightly several times at first before trying to spin it fast.

The starter is off, the engine, right now

Once this step is completed,go ahead and pull the oil pan to clean it out properly to make sure that any sludge,rust flakes,or anything else broken free by the carb cleaner and clean oil is eliminated from the system before you get carried away with excitement and try to start the engine. Refill the engine with the cheapest 30 wt non-detergent oil you can find because if you are wise you will change the oil again after running the engine for 30 minutes or so.

I plan to pull the pan, and pull crank, rods, pisotns for clean-up, measurements, and corrective action.

Once I am sure there are no broken rods or other nasties to deal with,I go ahead and spin the engine using the starter until I build up oil pressure. You may have to do this several times because you need to pause after maybe 15 or 20 seconds of the starter spinning in order to let it cool down to prevent burning it up.

It should also be said that the starter should have been taken off and cleaned and had the end bushings greased before you start this process.

The last one I did this was was my 49 Chrysler that had been sitting for maybe 15 years. The oil pumped up so slowly on this one I was worried that the oil pump wasn't working,but eventually the new oil got pumped up and it spun up to 60 lbs psi of oil pressure just from using the starter.

This is done without the spark plugs being in the engine,of course.

Once this is done go ahead and readjust the valves,install the spark plugs, and fire the old girl up.

VERY important to do this. I forgot to readjust the valves on a 54 Olds once that I freed up,and it drove me crazy for a couple of days trying to figure out why it wouldn't start. Come to find out,the valves have to open and close. Go figure!

BTW,it is also very important to flood the cylinders with ATF or a good light oil if for some reason you don't plan on starting up and driving the car for any length of time. The reason for this is the carb cleaner will have left the cylinder walls,pistons,and rings as dry as a bone,and rust will immediately start reforming if something happens and you don't get to spin up oil pressure right away. Don't ask me how I know this.

Thanx for the very detailed and thorough post, at this point, if the pistons don't loosen up, then will get knocked out, for a rebore and rebuild...

[Desotodav]

I came across this info about running in engines recently http://www.mototuneusa.com/break_in_secrets.htm .

This guys ideas seems somewhat controversial and I'm not sure that I'm sold on them. He uses motorcycle motors as examples, but says that the same principles apply for vehicle engines. The idea of running an engine hard from rebuild does not sit comfortably with me - but to each his own!

Desotodav

[48mirage]

The term "running an engine hard" is probably not the best choice of words. The intent is to put a load on the rings. This is done by acceleration and can also be done by downshifting and letting the engine slow the vehicle. Just sitting in neutral reving the engine doesn't do any good. It is the load that the engine experiences that will seat the rings.

[james49ply]

I have always broken in my engines by the same as discribed, find a long steep hill, accelerate HARD to the top, turn around and use the engine to brake going down the hill. That was when I lived in hilly country, there ain't no hills in Florida, so, I take off in second gear Hard, then short shift (shift at low rpm to increase the load on engine), and just downshift for engine braking, there again, watch who is around you so you don't get hit in the backside. Used that method on my Harley, 165k and compression still at specs and no oil burn.

[hkestes41]

I've got degrees in Physics and engineering. Does that make me less than last?

No it just makes you wierd.

[54Illinois]

This 54 Savoy I am working on is stuck. The pistons have been soaked with PB Blaster for over a week. Cast iron cheater bar will not budge anything. Look at the valves, I think they are rusted shut, or a spring is stuck (like on the other engine). In the pic, you can see the piston soaking in PB.

[55 Fargo]

This 54 Savoy I am working on is stuck. The pistons have been soaked with PB Blaster for over a week. Cast iron cheater bar will not budge anything. Look at the valves, I think they are rusted shut, or a spring is stuck (like on the other engine). In the pic, you can see the piston soaking in PB.

Pull the side cover, and see if the valves move at all, or which ones are stuck.

Then pull timing chain, and ee what spins.

Let her soak, try ATF and acetone, or diesel or kerosene..

[55 Fargo]

Hey all, today my engine broke fre, and spins very easily:D. So easily infact, My 9YO Son, gives a demo on this You Tube Vide:rolleyes:o, enjoy.....especially you naysayers....

[greg g]

the yield of patience and perserverence. The cyliners wall look pretty good inspite of themselves.

[busycoupe]

Congratulations Fred,

I'm looking forward to hearing it run.

Dave

[John Reddie]

Great news Fred. Keep those cylinders oiled up. I knew that you could do it:).

John R

[54Illinois]

This 54 Savoy I am working on is stuck. The pistons have been soaked with PB Blaster for over a week. Cast iron cheater bar will not budge anything. Look at the valves, I think they are rusted shut, or a spring is stuck (like on the other engine). In the pic, you can see the piston soaking in PB.

Turns out the first one holding the PB Blaster is the only piston seized. Gonna pull the engine, roll it over and soak it from the bottom.

[Joe Flanagan]

Very good, Fred. That thing looks like it's turning without much effort at all. Nice job.

[JoelOkie]

Good job Fred. A guy gave me a 251 Spitfire today that has a cracked block. It is supposed to have came out of a running DeSoto some years ago, (but the numbers C48-109341 seems to indicate a 1950 Royal or Windsor, so it was possibly swapped at some time) and everything is on the engine, and although it is nothing I personally need I thought someone might need some of the parts. The crack in the block looks like it could be welded pretty easy, but as I don't need the engine I don't care to pursue if, or how much trouble it would take to fix it. The head and manifolds look good. The crankshaft turns with indication of compression. Too late to get a picture tonight, but if you or anyone need anything off this engine they can let me know. Joel

Edited October 3, 2011 by JoelOkie
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