Hurt my transmission

[D35 Torpedo]

She popped out of first, taking off at a light. Transmission is rattling in first. 

Edited July 13, 2023 by D35 Torpedo

[Doug&Deb]

Check linkage adjustment first. Hopefully that’s the problem.

[D35 Torpedo]

19 minutes ago, Doug&Deb said:

Check linkage adjustment first. Hopefully that’s the problem.

It goes into first fine. It just makes a bad noise, like the gear is missing a tooth. I can still drive it to get home today. But it's hooped.

[Ivan_B]

Is it a regular 3-speed? After the linkage, the next step would be to drain the oil, and remove the side cover to inspect the first gear and the transfer shaft.

Do not drive it anymore.

 

Also, check the drained oil for extra parts.

Edited July 13, 2023 by Ivan_B

[Plymouthy Adams]

does it make the same noise if you pull off in second gear?  this will give you a bit more indication as to what may have gone awry.

[Ivan_B]

Are you thinking this is potentially not transmission? Could be useful to do some shifting while it is on the shop lift, even spinning the wheels by hand, to see what's going on underneath.

[Plymouthy Adams]

no..thinking transmission, just maybe not only 1st gear is affected.

[Frank Blackstone]

For year 1st pops out so I have used 2nd for years until now I can insect  inside. 20 years ago I chested out the transmission and replaced some gears , blueprinted what parts I could and it ran for years. Now I am into replacing throw out bearing. I need guidance how to get past shift lever yoke( Y shaped end holding retainer ) that holds bearing. Manual says 1st pop out  can be countershaft end play(check through side  access plate A/s/above) (shim fix) or wear of other parts( requiring disassembly).

[D35 Torpedo]

1 hour ago, Plymouthy Adams said:

does it make the same noise if you pull off in second gear?  this will give you a bit more indication as to what may have gone awry.

No second and third are normal

[Dodgeb4ya]

Pull the trans out...probably find 1st gear slider tooth damaged and or cluster gear tooth same.

Not uncommon  to see this on an old hard driven high mileage 3 speed.

[D35 Torpedo]

I usually shift into second, then back to first. This way it doesn't grind. Well every once in a while it doesn't go into first. The dogs done line up. So while holding it into first ill slowly let the clutch out and it will drop in. Well this happened. But it didn't go smoothly.

Edited July 13, 2023 by D35 Torpedo

[SteveR]

2 hours ago, Ivan_B said:

the next step would be to drain the oil, and remove the side cover to inspect the first gear

Look to see if the oil has a metallic look to it

[Ivan_B]

32 minutes ago, Frank Blackstone said:

I need guidance how to get past shift lever yoke( Y shaped end holding retainer ) that holds bearing.

Are you talking about replacing the clutch bearing? I would just disconnect the drive shaft and pull the transmission back to get to it.

 

28 minutes ago, D35 Torpedo said:

I usually shift into second, then back to first. This way it doesn't grind.

And this is one of the ways to do this, since first and reverse are not synchronized. Second then first, and third than reverse

 

7 minutes ago, SteveR said:

Look to see if the oil has a metallic look to it

You'll probably see that in most gear boxes, and especially the ones with non synchronized gears (like ours). I would not at all be concerned about that. He might see some gear teeth, or large fragments of copper washers/brass synchros, the sliding mechanism springs, balls (depending upon the design). Now, this is a sign of problem.

Edited July 13, 2023 by Ivan_B

[Los_Control]

I feel your pain.

If this is something new that has never happened before ..... anything exterior  like linkage adjustment, clutch ..... If you are fully engaged in gear & it sounds like it is missing teeth & popping out of gear ..... It is internal and your first thoughts are probably correct ..... transmission is pooched.

I hope it can be repaired, probably a good chance you can rebuild it ..... The sooner you pull it apart for inspection & repair it, the less damage will happen while trying to drive it.

 

I recently made a post about a strange squeal from my clutch on a OT vehicle ... hoping for some suggestions that do not include pulling the transmission ..... My mind was just not ready to accept I now have to pull the transmission on this vehicle & fix the clutch .... It worked perfect 5 minute ago & now it does not.

Someone please tell me it aint so!

 

If it looks like a duck, walks like a duck, quacks like a duck ..... you got a duck.

 

Helped me to drink beer & sleep on it .... in the morning I knew my job was to prepare to drop the transmission & go from there.

 

Sorry to hear this is your current job, looking forward to hear progress on it to see how much if any damage is done & if you can repair it or possibly replace it .... they are not growing on trees but still available.

[D35 Torpedo]

12 minutes ago, Los_Control said:

I feel your pain.

If this is something new that has never happened before ..... anything exterior  like linkage adjustment, clutch ..... If you are fully engaged in gear & it sounds like it is missing teeth & popping out of gear ..... It is internal and your first thoughts are probably correct ..... transmission is pooched.

I hope it can be repaired, probably a good chance you can rebuild it ..... The sooner you pull it apart for inspection & repair it, the less damage will happen while trying to drive it.

 

I recently made a post about a strange squeal from my clutch on a OT vehicle ... hoping for some suggestions that do not include pulling the transmission ..... My mind was just not ready to accept I now have to pull the transmission on this vehicle & fix the clutch .... It worked perfect 5 minute ago & now it does not.

Someone please tell me it aint so!

 

If it looks like a duck, walks like a duck, quacks like a duck ..... you got a duck.

 

Helped me to drink beer & sleep on it .... in the morning I knew my job was to prepare to drop the transmission & go from there.

 

Sorry to hear this is your current job, looking forward to hear progress on it to see how much if any damage is done & if you can repair it or possibly replace it .... they are not growing on trees but still available.

I have a spare. However the tail shaft looks to be longer. I will need to make one from two. There goes my weekend. 

[Los_Control]

Just now, D35 Torpedo said:

I have a spare. However the tail shaft looks to be longer. I will need to make one from two. There goes my weekend. 

Well it's go time .... you only get so many days a year you can enjoy your cars ..... slap it in there & run it ..... hoping it is not too much of a issue to swap the tail shaft.

I wish you good luck. In a few months you will have all the time you need to do a proper rebuild.

[D35 Torpedo]

The car made it home just fine. Leaving in 2nd sucks. Thanks for the help and concerns. I'll keep you guys posted.

[Ivan_B]

6 hours ago, D35 Torpedo said:

I will need to make one from two.

Make sure to check the internal parts and the housing against the OEM specs, if you want it to last. Also, I am pretty sure that the transmission housing and the bell housing are matched to be parallel to the engine block.

[D35 Torpedo]

41 minutes ago, Ivan_B said:

Make sure to check the internal parts and the housing against the OEM specs, if you want it to last. Also, I am pretty sure that the transmission housing and the bell housing are matched to be parallel to the engine block.

That's good to know. Thanks

[D35 Torpedo]

Carnage

[D35 Torpedo]

[Ivan_B]

Is this your spare box, or the one from the car? That input shaft and counter shaft are gone

[D35 Torpedo]

1 hour ago, Ivan_B said:

Is this your spare box, or the one from the car? That input shaft and counter shaft are gone

This was the one in the car. I blew it apart on the healing bench. It looks like it had water in it at some point. First/reverse gear on the output shaft is pitted pretty good. Explains why it whined in first. The ball bearings don't look to bad but they feel a little off. The countershaft thrust washers have a lot of metal inbedded in them. Syncros look new. Rear seal looks monkey'd on. Looks like I will save the casing, but swap most of the guts. The main things are the case and output shaft, they are good. We will see what the donor looks like tomorrow. The plan is to get this done with no new parts. Fingers crossed. 

 

A guy told me my stubby trans is a rare bird. Can anyone elaborate?

 

[Dodgeb4ya]

The stubby transmissions are used in the short wheel base cars... wagons, 3 passenger coupes and hog back cars.

The  stubby trans front and rear mainshaft bearings wear out quicker than the longer style 3 speed transmission....

as it has three bearings that support the main and output shafts.

[D35 Torpedo]

20 minutes ago, Dodgeb4ya said:

The stubby transmissions are used in the short wheel base cars... wagons, 3 passenger coupes and hog back cars.

The  stubby trans front and rear mainshaft bearings wear out quicker than the longer style 3 speed transmission....

as it has three bearings that support the main and output shafts.

So not "rare". I was just looking at a schematic of the long tailshaft transmission and I was thinking that the stubby probably wasn't as strong. The book I have doesn't show a blow up of the shorty. I do see some discrepancies in the diagram and what I have. One being a spring behind the synchro, mine has it and the book doesn't. Another being thrust bearings on either side of the counter shaft, mine has thrust bushings. It's interesting how the main shaft ball bearings are captured to provide thrust support. There is no thrust bearing beside the pocket bearing, and there is no shimming or preload.