Barn find…sort of…not a Mopar

[Young Ed]

14 hours ago, RobertKB said:

I have NEVER understood why GM and Ford stayed with the torque tube so long. Absolutely no advantage to it.

 

Also don’t understand why Mopar stayed with Detroit universal joints for so long. A few of their cars did come with the spicer joint like my 1948 Canadian Dodge D25. Same joint as ‘57 Chev so very easy to find. 
 

They held onto those Detroit joints into the 60s. Although by then they were only putting them at one end

[RobertKB]

Both my ‘53 Plymouth and ‘51 Canadian Dodge have the Detroit joints. The ones in the ‘53 have worked flawlessly for decades although I have replaced the rubber boots with leather.
 

The ones in my ‘51 Dodge have given nothing but trouble. I have a spare driveshaft from a ‘48 Dodge D25 parts car with spicer joints. I also have the appropriate yokes for the transmission and differential. Shaft will need lengthening slightly. Got new u-joints and set to go this spring replacing the ‘51 driveshaft. 
 

I don’t mean to hijack this interesting thread but the last few posts might be better in the car forum. 

Edited March 1, 2023 by RobertKB

[Young Ed]

4 hours ago, RobertKB said:

Both my ‘53 Plymouth and ‘51 Canadian Dodge have the Detroit joints. The ones in the ‘53 have worked flawlessly for decades although I have replaced the rubber boots with leather.
 

The ones in my ‘51 Dodge have given nothing but trouble. I have a spare driveshaft from a ‘48 Dodge D25 parts car with spicer joints. I also have the appropriate yokes for the transmission and differential. Shaft will need lengthening slightly. Got new u-joints and set to go this spring replacing the ‘51 driveshaft. 
 

I don’t mean to hijack this interesting thread but the last few posts might be better in the car forum. 

It's odd how they are like that. My dad's fully restored 51 ply got all new u joints along with everything else. That driveshaft never worked right and he's been running a parts car fresh driveshaft for probably 20y now 

[Bobacuda]

The master cylinder on this ‘54 Chevy wagon never misses a chance to frustrate me. 
 

Original MC rusted and frozen, so I took the leap and bought a new, Centric MC.  Even with a lift, it’s roughly a 6 hr job to remove and replace.  And the new one leaked like a pig.

 

Pulled the new MC out and bought a rebuild kit that the parts vendor guaranteed fit - wrong. The kit fits a 1” bore and the MC’s for this car have 7/8” bore. Tried repositioning the rubber parts, reassembled with the new MC’s parts and installed. Didn’t leak UNTIL the brakes are pressed hard, and it did not hold pressure.

 

Finally found a vendor with 7/8” rebuild kit, put it in and reinstalled. Did not leak and held pressure!  And the leak showed up 3 days later, but from a new location. 

Edited April 2, 2023 by Bobacuda

[Bobacuda]

The leak now appears to be from the steel line (on the right) to where it screws in to the part that looks like a nut head. If not that, it could be at the copper washer between that “nut head” and the cooper washer under it. At least I can get to those without having to pull the MC, again (I hope).

Edited April 2, 2023 by Bobacuda

[RobertKB]

Certainly frustrating! Mopar ones can be a bear also if so inclined. One of the greatest automotive advances was when master cylinders were moved to car firewalls! 
 

Good luck with the project and keep us posted on your progress. 

[Bobacuda]

There is a copper washer under the part that looks like a nut. That part goes through the  distribution block, and another copper washer, then connects to the back of the MC.  
 

Neither the new MC or either rebuild kit had those washers. Parts store looked at me like I was nuts, so I got an assortment pack from Harbor Freight.  The washer closest to the MC fit great. The one under the nut head needed a larger opening.  Another gift from a GM engineer… how to make a 30 minute job into a 3.5 hr job. 

 

Using a round file, it took damn near 3 hrs to open the hole and  keep the opening round. In the photo, you can see the new copper washers. Did not leak so far. Should have a better idea tomorrow.

 

Interesting, the photo is upside down, looking like a mirror image.
 

Edited April 4, 2023 by Bobacuda

[Bobacuda]

Pumped the brakes today, mashed down on the brake pedal - NO LEAKS!

 

Hopefully, it isn’t just holding back so it can crush me tomorrow. 

Edited April 4, 2023 by Bobacuda

[Los_Control]

I wish you luck.

When I rebuilt my MC, I spent a whole day chasing down leaks with the new lines & getting pressure too them.

 

Then I replaced the old MC because it failed with my rebuild with a newer 2 stage MC.

I then chased leaks for a day on the new improved brake lines.

 

Been a couple weeks now .... I turned the truck around in the driveway ..... I noticed two separate leaks that are a easy fix.

Just a few drips then stopped .... but 2 weeks after installing the lines. ...... Never over until it is over.

 

[Bobacuda]

During the “got brakes” test drive, the 3 spd trans groaned and the diff growled like a demented junkyard dog. And that started my learning experience with the enclosed driveshaft (Torque Tube).  ROYAL PITA.

 

Took about 10 hrs to get this out of the car. The TT and the diff are unique - got to take it all in to an old school shop for a rebuild. Taking in the trans, as well. While in there, I’m changing the clutch. 

Chevy trans definitely smaller and lighter than a comparable Dodge trans. 

 

 

 

[Plymouthy Adams]

some folks just had a tough time shaking the T-model days and ways

[Young Ed]

I learned the ways of the torque tube when Dad bought a 50 Chevy fastback. We towed it home on a 2wheel dolly as we did with most of our projects. Shortly after we left the trans started howling. I asked why we didn't pull over and pull the driveshaft and got a verbal lesson on how the Chevy was different (and inferior) to the Mopars I was used to. We had to listen to that thing howl all the way across town. 

[Bobacuda]

Diff from my late FIL’s 54 Chevy wagon (I now officially hate the GM Torque Tube). Hasn’t been opened in 70 years. It was growling and groaning; however, the diff guy said the axles and gears are all OK. All the bearings are shot and being replaced. Note the NASTY old gunk in the housing.
 

[Bobacuda]

The pumpkin (3.70 ring gear)

 

[Bobacuda]

And if you have never seen the bearings, seals and “drive bar” inside a GM Torque Tube (a Royal PITA to replace).  Not in the photo is the “Okie Seal” that goes in the TT right behind the transmission. 

 

Edited May 7, 2023 by Bobacuda

[kencombs]

For all the weirdness the Chevy TT possesses, I've driven them thousands of miles with no issues at all.  My first car was a 48 with the old babbitt-beater.  Second was a  cherry 52 with a low mileage but broken 216.  First owner lived in Chicago and decided to drive rte 66 on vacation.  Did so too fast and threw a rod in my town.   Bought the car and installed a full pressure 235 and drove it for a long time.

 

One thing for sure, the TT will prevent wheel hop for spring windup! Even with the narrow leaves of the time.

 

The transmissions were weak though.   I'll bet at least fifty got pulled, repaired or, changed in Dad's place in the early 60s when  I worked there a lot.  Low sliding gear and/or cluster was the most common failure, followed by jumping out of high gear on deceleration.   Dad could do the bench repair in a couple of hours, due to LOTS of practice.  Them and Fords of that era too.  But, I don't recall any Mopar trans failures of that sort.

Dad and/or I could do an R&R in an afternoon.  But I grew to hate those little bitty front u-joint bolts with the bend up lock tabs.  

[Bobacuda]

Ken nailed it on the cluster gear in the trans. It was pitted and showed wear. Although it would still have been serviceable, failure was in its future. Other than that, the bearings, bushing and seals were shot. 
 

Trans guy was surprised how well it had held up over the past 70 yrs (first time it’s been opened).

 

Challenge now is to get someone to sell me the right clutch. Rock Auto (two) and Parts Geek (one) have the 9” clutch advertised, and then they send me a 10”.  Can’t anyone use a damn tape measure to get it right?

[Bobacuda]

The trans has been rebuilt. The photo is the flaky gear. Look at the pitted teeth and the wear. Only gear that needed replacing. One bearing felt like it had sand in it.  The other felt like loose chunks of metal - would sometimes stop and have to be forced to turn again. Guess 70 yrs was the lifespan. 

[Bobacuda]

Finding a new clutch saga...

 

Tried the local parts stores, could not get one that fit.  Seems everyone can get heavy duty Chevy truck clutches, or clutches that fit newer Chevies.

Ordered two "exact fit" clutches from Rock Auto - had to send them back because they did not fit.

Ordered one "exact fit" clutch from Parts Geek - had to send it back because it did not fit.

 

I started missing times past when I could have ordered a clutch for a old car from JC Whitney.  Feeling nostalgic, I looked them up online and discovered they had morphed into Carparts.com.  Went to their website and ordered an "exact fit" clutch.  IT FIT!  And, it cost about $50-$75 less.  If ordering parts online, might want to check with tehm as well as the usual sources.