New (to me) Truck

[ssnowden]

I got the engine, transmission and fuel tank out this evening.

 

 

The tank looks to be in decent shape, except on the side closest to the frame had some old debris piled on it. The result is there is a hole in one spot. 

[ssnowden]

I got the running boards off now. I couldn't be happier with how good they are and how solid the supports are. I just need to clean them up and paint them. 

 

[ssnowden]

I had a busy weekend prepping the frame for the KBS Frame Coater kit. I got all of the scale and heavy rust off first and then did the cleaner/degreaser step and the Rust Blast steps.

 

I am very happy with the results. It pretty much got all the rust off with a 30 minute soak. 

 

Before:

 

After:

[John U]

If I ever decide to do mine again I know who to call

[ssnowden]

I got one coat on the frame now. It covers well. It took one quart for the one coat. It spreads like ink instead of paint. It's very easy and I used a brush. 

 

 

I'm going to pick up the front end and do it separately, plus I have the disc brake kit to install and the rear end comes back out again and I'll get it all cleaned and painted. 

[ssnowden]

I got the second coat on all of the frame now. 

 

[ssnowden]

I'm looking for some insight on how to proceed. 

 

Here is my situation:

 

The truck came with a Chrysler 25" engine out of a '49 Royal or Windsor with a Spitfire head. The PO had it all just sitting in there and hadn't done any modifications for the radiator yet to make it work in the 23" engine space the truck has.

 

 

It had this transmission in it:

 

 

The spline is thick, it's 1 3/8" and the smooth end of the shaft is 2" long and 3/4" thick. This is the transmission I want to use if possible.

The engine that was in the truck has an 8 bolt crank. 

 

 

The engine I want to put in the truck is a 23" 230 from a 1953 M37 truck that was in my P15 car. It will bolt right in to the truck with no modifications necessary. I want to put the Chrysler in the P15 with the Spitfire head in a future project, and I know there will be modifications per Don's threads with his DeSoto engine.

It has a 4 bolt crank.  The transmission that worked in the car has a 1" spline and the smooth end of the shaft is 2 1/2" long, 3/4" thick. 

 

The truck came with an additional engine and transmission. The extra transmission is this one: 

It has the same size spline as the car transmission of 1", but the smooth end of the shaft is 2" long which is a 1/2" shorter than the car transmission. 

 

So here are my questions. 

 

1. Will an 8 bolt flywheel work with a 4 bolt crank and not cause it to wear or break because of the differences? 

2. Could I use the 4 bolt flywheel that came with the 230 engine and just mount the bigger clutch and pressure plate to accommodate the bigger transmission? Since the shaft ends are the same thickness if that works, it seems to be the cleanest option. 

3. If I can use the 4 bolt flywheel, will the bigger transmission work ok considering I do have the right clutch and pressure plate for it? 

4. If I can use the 4 bolt flywheel, will the 1/2" shorter shaft end of the truck transmission be an issue? 

5. Is there any advantage to using the smaller spline extra transmission? I have no idea if the transmission even works. It was laying in the back yard of the PO.

 

I've been reading many threads on flywheels and I've seen where some have used a 4 bolt flywheel on a 8 bolt crank, but I haven't seen the opposite to my recollection. 

Edited August 1, 2016 by ssnowden

[DJ194950]

I think I have read here that all 230" cranks were 8 bolt. Your "230" could be a 218?

 

Others??

 

What you got for bell housings?

 

DJ

[ssnowden]

I've got two truck bell housings. Both look like they will bolt up to the engine. 

I used http://www.t137.com/registry/help/otherengines/tengines.html as my source. The engine has a T245 prefix which should be a 230. I wonder if someone changed cranks?

 

The pressure plate that works with the larger transmission is larger than what was on the 4 bolt flywheel, so if I were to use it, I'd need to have bolt holes drilled for the pressure plate to fit. 

[ssnowden]

I had a good chat with one of the guys at Andy Bernbaum this morning. He said the bigger transmission with the 1 3/8" spline most likely came from a bigger truck, like a 1 ton. That makes sense to me because it is such a significantly bigger and beefier transmission than the 3 speed extra one I have that I know came out of the truck originally. 

 

The 3 speed spline is the exact same size as my P15 transmission and should fit right in with the new clutch and pressure plate I have for it already. I'm thinking it would be worth investigating the 3 speed to see how it is mechanically and use it if it's good. 

[ssnowden]

I started working on the 3 speed transmission. I planned on starting with draining the oil. I unscrewed the drain plug and all that came out was water. Since it was laying in the back yard of the PO for 6 years, I wasn't too surprised.

 

I opened it up and from what I can tell, all the gears look to be in very good shape. Of course, I've not seen that many, but to my eye, I don't see visible wear or chips on the gears and it all spins easily. 

 

 

I used what I had near, so I filled it with Pine Sol and let it soak a few minutes and wire brushed what I could reach. Then I washed it all out. Then,  I sprayed about a can of PB Blaster in it and then filled it up with oil to soak for a few days. 

[JBNeal]

I am not sure of the particulars but there are dimensional differences between standard and Fluid Drive transmission components, especially with regards to the bell housings and input shafts. If ya try to mix and match these components, things might not jive the way ya want them to...as for the transmission full of water, ya might want to inspect those bearings for corrosion and galling...they can make themselves known on down the road in a most unpleasant manner

[ssnowden]

I am not sure of the particulars but there are dimensional differences between standard and Fluid Drive transmission components, especially with regards to the bell housings and input shafts. If ya try to mix and match these components, things might not jive the way ya want them to...as for the transmission full of water, ya might want to inspect those bearings for corrosion and galling...they can make themselves known on down the road in a most unpleasant manner

 

 

Yes, I'm wanting to minimize the complexity as much as I can.

 

Also, I'm planning on putting new gaskets and bearings in it to hopefully have it in good shape for a long time. 

[pflaming]

Too bad you are not closer I would give you my extra. If you are interested you can have it for the cost of shipping and $25.00 for packaging. Paul.

[ssnowden]

Too bad you are not closer I would give you my extra. If you are interested you can have it for the cost of shipping and $25.00 for packaging. Paul.

 

I'll PM you. 

[ssnowden]

Between traveling for work. I'm still making progress, although not directly on the truck sometimes. I got a HF media blast cabinet and put it together. I watched a few Youtube videos for tweaks and did what they said. I added a dust collector, silicone caulked all the seams and put a much better light in it. After a coupon, it was about $150, and I'm pleased with it. 

 

[ssnowden]

I got a new water pump from RockAuto and only broke two of the 3 bolts off removing the old one.  Fortunately, I have plenty of drill bits in preparation for such things. 

After getting it removed, I was happy to see the water distribution tube was replaced when the engine was rebuilt 30 years ago. Since the engine didn't have 1000 miles on it after the rebuild, the tube looks like the day it was installed. After reading so many threads and watching 48dodgers video, I'm glad this is one thing I don't have to do. 

 

 

[ssnowden]

I got tired of looking at a rust/patina combination on the engine, so I cleaned it up and sprayed some color on it. The media blast cabinet has come in handy already blasting small parts for it. I still need to do some touch up on it, but at least it has some color now. 

I'm glad I took some of the parts off. I had a new thermostat to put in it and when I took the housing off and found it had no thermostat in it. 

I have a carburetor kit and will do a full clean up of it as well. It really looks dirty now against the fresh paint.

[ssnowden]

Since this engine didn't come in this truck, I decided to test fit it in to the new mounts and the housing that I cleaned up and painted that was laying in the PO's back yard for 6 or 7 years. I had to cut two mounting nuts they welded to make the bigger Chrysler engine fit, but other than that, it dropped right in to the space. They were in the way of the pulley. 

 

 

[ssnowden]

I found another engine and transmission on CL for a good price, so I picked it up today. It has the right pan I need and it also has the throttle linkage I needed along with a transmission that was working with they parked the truck. The badge on the truck it came from said "Fluid Drive". The transmission doesn't look any different than the 3 speed I have already. How can you tell if it's a fluid drive? 

 

 

 

[Young Ed]

The bellhousing will be considerably deeper. Also if you remove that 3spd you'd see the input shaft is about a foot long. 

[ssnowden]

Thanks. It's the exact same size as my 3 speed, so this isn't a fluid drive.

[Merle Coggins]

No, that doesn't appear to be a FD housing. As Ed said, it would be much deeper. Also, the FD bell housing would have a second shaft for the clutch/brake pedals and the clutch shaft would be much shorter. That appears to be a standard clutch housing and trans.

 

Merle

[ssnowden]

The transmission that came with the engine I got this weekend was for the column mount shifter. It looks to be in better shape than the one I have, so I wanted to swap my floor shifter top to it.

All the bolts line up and the top is the same size. The only problem is the fork is 5/8" narrower on the floor shift than the one that was for the column shift. 

Can I just swap the rails and use the bigger one? It looks like I can.  The bigger fork is on the left. 

[ssnowden]

I got the new clutch, pressure plate, release bearing, spring and transmission installed. I also got the pedals back on and testing my clutch. The clutch works, so that's good. 

I also got a new thermostat and water pump installed this week. 

 

Edited September 22, 2016 by ssnowden