Who's Really Happy With Their T5 Conversion

[Plymouthy Adams]

Ed is on target with his comment...and with open forum there is not a set list of folks invited to participate....folks feel the need to post a reply they do so...if it goes off topic a bit then it is on par with the other 99% of all threads opened here..the subject of the tranny upgrade be it a T5, TK5 or the 833 I would think would have relevance in the same thread as part of the normal OT slant we always get..other than price restrictions I would bet others may be interested in the later model NV or Getrag or maybe even the high priced priced GV units

Edited December 21, 2015 by Plymouthy Adams

[55 Fargo]

Ed is on target with his comment...and with open forum there is not a set list of folks invited to participate....folks feel the need to post a reply they do so...if it goes off topic a bit then it is on par with the other 99% of all threads opened here..the subject of the tranny upgrade be it a T5, TK5 or the 833 I would think would have relevance in the same thread as part of the normal OT slant we always get..other than price restrictions I would bet others may be interested in the later model NV or Getrag or maybe even the high priced priced GV units

Which trans and V8 conversion can you offer your expertise on Tim. Since you want to open this thread to further discussion perhaps you can share your insight to the Borg &Warner R 10 Overdrive trans, which would be applicable on this forum board.

[meadowbrook]

Not really a nightmare....just replacing a 45 year old trans (the 3 speed) with a 30 year old trans (Astro 5 speed) wasn't sensible.  Its getting to be that way with GM Small blocks and the older 4 speed autos.  There is much better tech out there and much of it now lasts 250K or more miles.....more than another lifetime on a hot/resto rod whether or not its daily transportation.

 

Most of the problems with my T5 related to the porosity of the casting, lost a thread every time as the alloy just won't hold a thread.  That, plus internal parts for the GM T5s are getting scares enough now that its more difficult and expensive to rebuild them.  They are old and like old men, the older they get the more they break and the less likely they are to get fixed well or at all. 

 

I am satisfied with the T5 enough that I could recommend it as an option, but probably not for someone that actually wanted to put 30K miles a year on his vehicle.

 

Given the availability of 21st Century power packs, I just don't think it makes sense, especially if you plan to drive it away from your well stocked and tooled garage with its shelf of musty tomes covering all the repair specifics for the old parts ya stuck in in the name of upgrade!......

 

Its more certain that with a late model drive line, in any old car, yer less likely to have a failure and if ya do, ya can pull in to the appropriate shop, parts will be on the shelf ...

 

and using the OBD port, even the Mechanic in EAST BF Wyoming (located on Rural Route 0, 200 miles from the nearest big city) will be able to do more than scratch his butt and say, "Jeez, I never seen nothing like that before!". 

 

More likely he'll say, "Yep, got that part and have ya back on the road lickety split, grab some coffee, I'll get er done!"

Sure, different strokes and what not, but I think you miss out on the feel and experience of what driving a 60 year old car is like by replacing all that hardware with modern hardware. There is no question modern hardware is more advanced and can accumulate more miles and is more easily replaced with off shelf parts and if practicality is all you want then fine.

But in my mind, replacing my Dodge's points fired, carbureted flathead and old school BW o/d with a modern hemi and a 65rfe trans, just makes my old car drive like a new Charger I can just buy off the dealer lot. What's the fun in that?

[Sharps40]

I have plenty of experience driving the old ones in original form.....As a young man I drove Ol Bessy the 37 dodge (recently found and undergoing total refit as we type) daily for 20 years with the 218 and three speed.  It was my work and school vehicle and best friend and totally reliable in its original drive line trim. 

 

In between that and the trucks below I drove, 52 Dodge Gryromatic, 48 Dodge with 3 speed, 66 Valiant auto, 68 valiant auto, 66 Bug, 67 bug, 68 bug, 62 impala auto, 62 Chevy II 3 speed, ad infinitum.....

 

Drove a 64 C10 with 283 and 3 speed for 2 years, fine but a workout.  It was replaced with an inline 6 65 C10 with three speed, slower and still a work out.  The 65 then got a T5 and power brakes.  Much nicer with the T5 but still too slow and lacking the agility that both makes an old car/truck  a pleasure to drive and safer in modern traffic.  It was sold to finance the recovery of the 37 dodge. 

 

A V8 and Auto OD with PS/PB is needed for this somewhat older man. Soon, soon.  The dodge will be on the road again and nimble, strong and safe enough to drive with confidence and safety for my wife, grandkids and mutts. 

 

Besides, those of us that upgrade provide yall with spares.  Ya should be happy...

Edited December 21, 2015 by Sharps40

[Sharps40]

Well, this one is vectoring away from its T5 discussion points but tell ya what......

 

With 340 horses and a 4l60e and the hitch I plan to put on Ol Bessy, When I see ya on the side o the road,  I'll be happy to stop and provide a tow to any of ya's with flatties, old Carters boilin over, broken glass in the fuel bowls, fried regulators, blown gyrosmatics, fluid drives or even T5s or just good old original style honeycomb core radiators that couldn't keep up with the temps! 

 

Love ya'll!

 

Edited December 21, 2015 by Sharps40

[Plymouthy Adams]

Fargos-Go-Far, on 21 Dec 2015 - 08:47 AM, said:

Which trans and V8 conversion can you offer your expertise on Tim. Since you want to open this thread to further discussion perhaps you can share your insight to the Borg &Warner R 10 Overdrive trans, which would be applicable on this forum board.

good point Fred but my swap incorporates a complete different tranny..I have sold three R10 to folks who wish to stay with the flathead as an alternative to later upgrades...some folks do not whish to be invasive and to that end I support with no problems.  I have helped locate a couple OD's for other people to purchase..that is my total involvement in the R10.  As well you know I do a few later model upgrades and I can say without a doubt the easiest transfer I have done of late has been the 3.7 V6 with NV3500 5 speed complete with the donor pedals and hydraulic clutch...sweet to the fact that with the donor rear gear, (necessity for tone) it was a basic bolt in including the driveshaft.  Now before folks say but hey, you did a clip...yes, but with the clip, you still need to move the engine 7 inches rearward after the fabrication of the engine mounts the rest was just a simple slide to existing holes and Bob's your uncle..

 

I would say that 95% of all this is just a willingness to start, accurate measurements and an ability to fabricate and weld...again many limit themselves by not using their imagination and taking steps to put it on paper to test the feasibility.

[T120]

good point Fred but my swap incorporates a complete different tranny..I have sold three R10 to folks who wish to stay with the flathead as an alternative to later upgrades...some folks do not whish to be invasive and to that end I support with no problems.  I have helped locate a couple OD's for other people to purchase..that is my total involvement in the R10.  As well you know I do a few later model upgrades and I can say without a doubt the easiest transfer I have done of late has been the 3.7 V6 with NV3500 5 speed complete with the donor pedals and hydraulic clutch...sweet to the fact that with the donor rear gear, (necessity for tone) it was a basic bolt in including the driveshaft.  Now before folks say but hey, you did a clip...yes, but with the clip, you still need to move the engine 7 inches rearward after the fabrication of the engine mounts the rest was just a simple slide to existing holes and Bob's your uncle..

 

I would say that 95% of all this is just a willingness to start, accurate measurements and an ability to fabricate and weld...again many limit themselves by not using their imagination and taking steps to put it on paper to test the feasibility.

...Kinda like - those that can do.....   

[mopar_earl]

good point Fred but my swap incorporates a complete different tranny..I have sold three R10 to folks who wish to stay with the flathead as an alternative to later upgrades...some folks do not whish to be invasive and to that end I support with no problems. I have helped locate a couple OD's for other people to purchase..that is my total involvement in the R10. As well you know I do a few later model upgrades and I can say without a doubt the easiest transfer I have done of late has been the 3.7 V6 with NV3500 5 speed complete with the donor pedals and hydraulic clutch...sweet to the fact that with the donor rear gear, (necessity for tone) it was a basic bolt in including the driveshaft. Now before folks say but hey, you did a clip...yes, but with the clip, you still need to move the engine 7 inches rearward after the fabrication of the engine mounts the rest was just a simple slide to existing holes and Bob's your uncle..

I would say that 95% of all this is just a willingness to start, accurate measurements and an ability to fabricate and weld...again many limit themselves by not using their imagination and taking steps to put it on paper to test the feasibility.

If you come across anymore R10's, keep your good old buddy Mopar_earl in mind. Still regret not buying that OD at Hershey this year. Money was tight at the time and I wasn't sure if I'd benefit from the OD. I had the mind set that I need to get the car on the road and see how it runs and how I use it. I have come to the realize I love the M6 trans but hate the lack of OD.

Earl

[austinsailor]

I'm sort of surprised so many focus on the difficulties, or however you'd describe them, of driving the old stock cars today. After all, isn't that part of the fun, driving something old, saved, that many can't drive or have the good sense to figure out how to keep them running well. If that's all we cared about we'd all just write a check at the dealer every couple years and buy another throw away car.

After all, the people doing a marathon could much easier just catch a cab. Then they wouldn't have to worry about all the complications - shoes, heat stroke or whatever.

Personally, I like driving around in something that 95 % of the people wouldn't even know how to drive. Foot starter, or crank? Set the spark? Points, what is that? Set the timing? The computer does that, doesn't it??

My only fear of driving these things is the morons on the road. Run right up on a stop sign or my bumper, never considering that the brakes might just not work correctly at the last minute, leaving them no way out, or a bit of gravel even if the brakes do work. Texting as they don't even notice you're in front of them. Or, the lady recently who had no clue what a hand signal is, who follows me and informed me I forgot to "use your blinky thing".

I've never had an old one fail to get me home. Might have had to tinker a bit, but a pliers and screwdriver got me in. Try that with a throwaway car!

Ok, I haven't tried a T5 yet, just to get back on topic. :<)

Edited December 21, 2015 by austinsailor

[55 Fargo]

Tim says, good point Fred but my swap incorporates a complete different tranny..I have sold three R10 to folks who wish to stay with the flathead as an alternative to later upgrades...some folks do not whish to be invasive and to that end I support with no problems. I have helped locate a couple OD's for other people to purchase..that is my total involvement in the R10. As well you know I do a few later model upgrades and I can say without a doubt the easiest transfer I have done of late has been the 3.7 V6 with NV3500 5 speed complete with the donor pedals and hydraulic clutch...sweet to the fact that with the donor rear gear, (necessity for tone) it was a basic bolt in including the driveshaft. Now before folks say but hey, you did a clip...yes, but with the clip, you still need to move the engine 7 inches rearward after the fabrication of the engine mounts the rest was just a simple slide to existing holes and Bob's your uncle..

I would say that 95% of all this is just a willingness to start, accurate measurements and an ability to fabricate and weld...again many limit themselves by not using their imagination and taking steps to put it on paper to test the feasibility.

Fred says, Tim think it may be a good time for you to start a "Modern Drivetrains" Thread, and/or Blog, that way you can be on your chosen topic, have your own followers etc. Or perhaps a build thread(s) on your current builds, that way those interested can follow by your lead. I know by your admission, you prefer the build, not sure if you have anything roadworthy yet, as I do not recall any posts to the fact.

This thread has veered a bit, however there have been a few posts by those who venerate the T5 conversion, how well it works, how easy or how difficult the conversion was in their own unique case.

Personally it makes no difference to me how, what, you want to undertake your project/build.

I mentioned a few posts up, there are many different flavors of Ice Cream for a reason. So fill yur boots, on whichever way you want to go.

[Plymouthy Adams]

Fred...it would be a good time to stop asking folks to join a thread if you are not truly looking for a reply...this is twice you have done so to me in the past few weeks and failed to realize that should I have an opinion counter to yours so I should go out and start my own thread.   I was being courteous to the point to reply to your question but in return you wish to try and drag me down and sully my name or my builds in the mud.  My cars and I do say cars, are progressing at a good clip and compared to your ONE running truck that might I add took you nigh onto three months just to fix a radiator!  Is my progress on a number of cars compared to a radiator change is what may be bothering you or the fact that I am making progress on a number simultaneously be the irritation, truly it is a mystery to many here....Just because I do not post a pic, start a thread or create a blog does not mean anything except that I care not to post such on open forum.  But as many here can attest, that I am making progress is well known.  I am not even sure you understand your own questions at times or in asking that you don't maybe realized that an invitation to reply was extended.

[Don Coatney]

Fred, I must assume by some of your responses that the reason you started this thread is because you are not happy with your current transmission, you are looking for a change, and you have discounted all alternatives except the T-5. Do you plan on buying a "kit" or being innovative such as I did? What is your time frame for this upgrade? Are you going to do the install yourself or farm it out? Is there a good selection of T-5 transmissions in the Canadian bone yards?

[Dave72dt]

I don't know if the T5 will solve your problems or not. That it will work behind the flat 6 is a given. It will not increase the horsepower of the 6 so if it's the highway speed and power that's the real concern, at best it may better utilize what power the engine has. Hopping up the 6 or a bigger 6 may get you what you want with or without the T5. In 4th gear the T5 is the same as what you already have so nothing gained there and we already know your truck doesn't like a head wind so 5th gear is a moot point. Changing rear axle ratios so OD engaged compares to current final ratio, again, nothing gained on top end, just a better spread on the lower gears.

Some of the work involved in a T5 conversion is the same as that contemplated V8 swap. parts may be different the type of work is the same. Start pricing the cost of hopping the 6 against a stock V8 conversion. I doubt you'll find any that are unhappy with the T5 they've got, want to rip it out and go back to the double-clutching trans they took out or swap it out for a different OD trans of whatever other make unless it by chance is an automatic.

Now, since I don't have a T5, have any experience with one or even particularly want one, you can disregard the entire post if you so choose.

[55 Fargo]

No Don , I have no problem with my T98 acme,did I mention something?

But thanks for your concern, but don't recall asking for it, much like your unsolicited email to another member, will this refresh your memory,

Don Coatney, on 16 Mar 2015 - 2:47 PM, said:

First to clear a few things up. I was one of the first on this website to install a non MoPar five speed manual over drive T-5 transmission and reported such so on this website. Prior to my install I did my research and was well aware of the ratios. The first T-5 I selected was a 1352-107. This transmission was from a diesel S-10 pickup. What I discovered was the input shaft from this transmission was shorter that the input shaft from a gas powered S-10. So I rejected the diesel T-5 and found and installed a 1352-145. Both of these transmissions have identical ratios as follows. I find these ratios to be a good fit for the torque and horsepower curves of my Flathead 6 engine and I have installed a 3.55/1 differential in my car.

R-3.76/1, 1st 3.78/1, 2nd 2.18/1, 3rd 1.42/1, 4th 1.0/1, OD .72/1

I have driven my car with this transmission installed over 40,000 trouble free miles and I am very happy with it. Others such as Robert Horne have install other non MoPar 5 speed manual transmissions with great success and I applaud there innovative efforts. I have not read any reports of anyone on this forum installing a semi modern MoPar five speed floor shifted transmission behind a Flathead 6 and hopefully if someone has done so they will come forward and post there results of the install and drive ability.

I have read reports on this website of someone who installed a diesel T-5 with a very low 5th gear ratio. This person indicated that that recommendation to install the diesel transmission came from a forum member on this website. I do not recall anyone on this website ever making such a recommendation. The person who made this report is a forum member with zero postings but he did post his e-mail address. I have made attempts to contact this person via e-mail but I did not get a response. I must assume this person did not do his homework prior to doing the install and that is his responsibility and cannot be blamed on anyone else.

I have also read reports on this website that some folks who have installed a T-5 have regrets and are not happy. Problem is the reports are not directly from the folks who have installed the T-5. I would like to hear from them and why they are not happy. Comments from someone else have little meaning.

At the time I did my install there were no “kits” available. I did my own measuring and modifying with the mind set that failure was not an option. Pictures of what I did have been posted on this forum many times. I will gladly share what I did with anyone at no charge. I am not trying to sell my ideas but at the same time I do not want someone else selling my ideas.

Installing any non stock transmission is not for the faint of heart. One must have a good understanding of what the requirements are and a good mechanical skill set. The kits available today are helpful but none are an easy bolt in with no modifications required.

Yes Don, I got your email -

Mar 11 at 5:15 PM

"Donald Coatney I hear you have had some problems with your T-5 install. I would like to discuss these issues with you."

I thought it an odd message given I do not know you nor have I reached out to you asking for advise. Now that I have read your post from this afternoon it is clear you have decided to follow-up on a conversation between myself and another member that took place about a month ago. Well I appreciate what I am sure is

a desire to help I'm good. Thx just the same.

Again Don, your T5 is the best, your happy with do drive on, quit trying to deflect attention on the topic of this thread. Tod Fitch already warned you to move on with your own thread.

You also keep wanting to get A833 info, would you not think it wise to telephone George Asche, don't you think he would be happy to hear from you Don. I think George and the AoK boys should be able to answer all of your questions, if you so desire.

[55 Fargo]

Fred...it would be a good time to stop asking folks to join a thread if you are not truly looking for a reply...this is twice you have done so to me in the past few weeks and failed to realize that should I have an opinion counter to yours so I should go out and start my own thread.   I was being courteous to the point to reply to your question but in return you wish to try and drag me down and sully my name or my builds in the mud.  My cars and I do say cars, are progressing at a good clip and compared to your ONE running truck that might I add took you nigh onto three months just to fix a radiator!  Is my progress on a number of cars compared to a radiator change is what may be bothering you or the fact that I am making progress on a number simultaneously be the irritation, truly it is a mystery to many here....Just because I do not post a pic, start a thread or create a blog does not mean anything except that I care not to post such on open forum.  But as many here can attest, that I am making progress is well known.  I am not even sure you understand your own questions at times or in asking that you don't maybe realized that an invitation to reply was extended.

Now Tim, did I get under your skin, it might have took me 3 months to source the rad I needed, but your builds have been going on for what a decade. So what me 3 months, you 10 years, no big deal, as you have stated on many occasions you enjoy the build, do you even like to drive?

So, yes, you want to discuss the T5, your experience, knowledge and practical use. I will put it in simple terms Tim, how many T5s from an S10, have you retrofitted to  Chrysler Flathead 6 engine? How many miles have you driven?

Tim, again so you do not lose sight, the theme of this thread, is directed to those who are Happy with their T5 conversion, or those who are not. What was involved in the process, and the longer term results.

I am not so rigid where , other items cannot be mentioned, but not sure what you can really add to this thread Tim, so far, not much it seams, but thanks for coming out and trying...

[wayfarer]

...I would bet others may be interested in the later model NV or Getrag or maybe even the high priced priced GV units

 

..or maybe not...I have been making an adapter for many years that will accommodate the late model 'one-piece' type transmissions and sales have been so lack-luster that when the current inventory is gone so might be the adapter. The problem is that the one-piece units require removal of the oem bell and very few folks are willing/able to actually do the needed fabrication to make it/them work. This is also true of Pat McGuire's gm adapter for the L engines. I'm guessing that a lot of folks just like to talk....

 

Well, this one is vectoring away from its T5 discussion points but tell ya what......

 

With 340 horses and a 4l60e and ......

Love ya'll!

 

   sad to hear about the shiverlay parts.......

[Young Ed]

..or maybe not...I have been making an adapter for many years that will accommodate the late model 'one-piece' type transmissions and sales have been so lack-luster that when the current inventory is gone so might be the adapter. The problem is that the one-piece units require removal of the oem bell and very few folks are willing/able to actually do the needed fabrication to make it/them work. This is also true of Pat McGuire's gm adapter for the L engines.

 

 

I'm sad to hear that. This is what I'd like to do for my next swap! On a truck it would mean custom pedals and brake master cylinder setup. Might be a little easier in a car with the frame mounted master and pedals.

 

I'm guessing that a lot of folks just like to talk....

 

 

That seems to be the purpose of this entire thread.

[Don Coatney]

Fred, you mentioned to me and to another poster that our interest in another transmission must be due to the fact that we were not happy with the T-5 install. So I assumed you were not happy with your setup nor any setup other than a T-5. Guess I was wrong. Now I am not sure why you started this thread. Thanks for re-posting my long T-5 posting. It is factual and a good read. I thought the purpose of this forum is to share information and I have done so.

 

 does this mean you are not happy with your T5 conversion, and wish to now learn about the A833 trans.

 

 

  Now you are asking for links of happy A833 trans users, might lead someone to believe you have some reservation on the T5 swap.

 

 

 

No Don , I have no problem with my T98 acme,did I mention something? 

 

[meadowbrook]

A radiator expert told me honeycomb rads cool better.

[Plymouthy Adams]

wayfarer, on 21 Dec 2015 - 3:26 PM, said:

..or maybe not...I have been making an adapter for many years that will accommodate the late model 'one-piece' type transmissions and sales have been so lack-luster that when the current inventory is gone so might be the adapter. The problem is that the one-piece units require removal of the oem bell and very few folks are willing/able to actually do the needed fabrication to make it/them work. This is also true of Pat McGuire's gm adapter for the L engines. I'm guessing that a lot of folks just like to talk....

 

 

   sad to hear about the shiverlay parts.......

WOW...an adapter for the later models but yet...no takers...if this does not scream a lack of owner being proactive, nothing does.  I truly believe that most folks that truly looking for a bit of advancement in technology will not limit themselves always tot he flathead but will go for the whole enchilada... thanks for you timely input into the thread...am sad and glad at the same time..glad it is an option..sad that folks are not moving in that direction..

[Plymouthy Adams]

A radiator expert told me honeycomb rads cool better.

yes but the ability to clean after many many years of build up internally makes them a poor choice for sinking a lot of money into...another piece of old time equipment that often necessitates an upgrade...

[55 Fargo]

Fred, you mentioned to me and to another poster that our interest in another transmission must be due to the fact that we were not happy with the T-5 install. So I assumed you were not happy with your setup nor any setup other than a T-5. Guess I was wrong. Now I am not sure why you started this thread. Thanks for re-posting my long T-5 posting. It is factual and a good read. I thought the purpose of this forum is to share information and I have done so.

Great Don, roll on, keep driving, your T5 is the best, so is your approach.

Being you have been so forward about getting Information on the A833 conversion, would naturally assume you would call George Asche,  to educate yourself, and to actually speak to the man who is building the A833 adapter plates.

Don is there any reason you feel hesitant to call George? Don't you think He could answer your questions?

I mentioned to you, about your dissatisfaction with your T5 Don, are you happy with your T5 Don?

Don I will again ask you to stop deflecting attention from the topic, you have already exalted us all with your Superior Knowledge and Capability with respect to the T5, your Flathead, your wiring, your car etc.

1 more thing Don, if you really want more info on the A833, I suggest you call George Asche, and/or Tim Kingsbury, I am sure they would be real happy to hear from you...

[Don Coatney]

As far as you projects Tim, thanks for sending the photo updates.