1940_dodge Posted December 16, 2014 Report Share Posted December 16, 2014 (edited) I'm about to get started on restoring my D14 and would like to sandblast the frame and paint it as it's been probably 70 years it's been exposed to the elements. But I have no lift to separate the body from the frame and don't want to warp the body by doing it incorrectly. So is there a way to do it without a 2 or 4 post lift, and how can I avoid warping the body once it is lifted off? edit** I should note that the floorboards have been rusted through completely as well as in the trunk. I so I wouldn't count on too much structural support from the floor. Edited December 16, 2014 by 1940_dodge Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Plymouthy Adams Posted December 16, 2014 Report Share Posted December 16, 2014 if your rockers are solid..I use 2x4 reinforced with angle iron..find the central lift point per side and use two trolly jacks to lift it free from the frame...it is a series of lifts but a one man job if you are patient and are verify your balance point....I raise and lower my bodies this manner and ultimately get the vehicle clear of the frame some 32 inches and then remove wheels, place frame on low profile casters and out she comes.. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1940_dodge Posted December 16, 2014 Author Report Share Posted December 16, 2014 I have no idea if m y rockers are solid, would you be able to take a look at some photos I snap and give me your assessment? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
casper50 Posted December 16, 2014 Report Share Posted December 16, 2014 I did as jayson said. lifted both ends a little at a time and my rockers are not solid. I did weld in bracing before I took out the mounting bolts. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ulu Posted December 16, 2014 Report Share Posted December 16, 2014 (edited) You can damage the body lifting it even if it's not rusted out. If it is: Get some light tubing (light conduit will work) and x-brace the body vert & horizontal. Front and rear. Brace the door openings too. You can weld it in or screw it in, but make sure the body doesn't droop & fold as you lift it. You can also brace it with wood, but it's heavier and harder to do. I dropped all the running gear first, then let the chassis down on a low cart with casters. If the frame is stripped, you only need to lift it a little ways to roll out the cart. The lifting can be done with the lightest of jacks, as the body shell is pretty light. If you weigh about 150 or better, you can just lever it up with a 8' 2X4 an inch at a time and have someone keep sticking shims under it get the fulcrum close to the body and your 150 becomes like 1500 lbs. Plenty to lift the body one end at a time. If you lift side to side, there's more chance of damage IMO. Edited December 16, 2014 by Ulu Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Plymouthy Adams Posted December 16, 2014 Report Share Posted December 16, 2014 (edited) I am not sure how Ulu rolled out the frame with a minimum lift unless he found some way to leave a side wide open...the very upturn to the frame for the axle clearance is your limiting factor...stripped or not stripped...as the frame extends the full length of the body front to rear you have no body lift point on the ends..you lift from the rockers as they have clearance between them and the frame....now you can use straps and hoist the body from above but be sure that you have a stay brace rigged at the top to prevent pulling in at the top to common point center of the roof....your car..your call...I have removed and replace a number of bodies here at the house in my method...not saying it is the only way or the most right way only a very easy way for a single person doing the job...the only exception to the rocker rule has been the station wagon (suburban) there is no common point for balance along the rocker if the dog house is off the car...and I assure you, you will want the dog house off the car..you can jack the rockers in this manner safely as you need only get it high enough to slide in 6x6 between the body and the frame to use as crossbucks..once on cross bucks...it is just lift alternately front and rear a few inches at a time...you are in no hurry..if you are...get a crew on hand Edited December 16, 2014 by Plymouthy Adams Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
desoto1939 Posted December 16, 2014 Report Share Posted December 16, 2014 The biggest part of this is bracing the body so the body does not twist. I have attend several AACA seminars on restorations and one of the major shops has the cars always x braced in allof the possible section on the interior to prevent twisting. It is work but if lifting the body off then it is a must do. Also when you dip the body or sand blast the body. drill a small hole in the rockers. Then take a garden sprayer and put int primer or a good rust preventer paint push the nozzle into the hole and spray the interior of the rockers to prevent rust out from the inside. Do this in different spots to insure that the metal is getting coated. Rich Hartung Desoto1939@aol.com Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ulu Posted December 16, 2014 Report Share Posted December 16, 2014 (edited) I am not sure how Ulu rolled out the frame with a minimum lift I mean the engine etc is all off mine, so the frame is all you must clear. 1.5' at the max for me. That's nothing. When I did the Scout, it was assembled, & the front clip was on. I picked the body up over 4' & sat it on 4X4's over 4 oil drums. I don't have the hoist extensions to do that high lift stuff any more, so I can't do it in one pick so easily. (EDIT..unless one of you locals has some heavy 6" & 8" round tubing laying around...) Edited December 16, 2014 by Ulu 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Plymouthy Adams Posted December 16, 2014 Report Share Posted December 16, 2014 (edited) we are not working Scouts here..we are working Plymouths and the very tip of the frame over the rear axle requires quite the lift to clear the body issues as it TUCKS into the raised pocket between the trunk and the rear floor pan..AND...I am not sure if the man has disconnected his steering but the full length of this must be addressed also..disconnect from the frame/firewall/dash and lay it down with the inner pan removed..you can usually get it out still connected to the tie rod/drag link...else it is pulling time here also... Edited December 16, 2014 by Plymouthy Adams Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ulu Posted December 16, 2014 Report Share Posted December 16, 2014 BTW, when I picked the Scout, I picked it (with rope) from 4 points: the front door posts at the upper hinge mounts and rear gate posts at the tailgate latch strikers. It was so stout & compact, that with this method no internal bracing was needed. We swapped one very rusty body for one solid one, and neither flexed with this method. The P-15s are not nearly so solid a "box". They're flexy as heck, even when not rusty. I have not pulled my own off yet though, and the one P15 I have helped with was a field rescue back about 1983. We did that one right there on the dirt, with a crowbar, 2X4's and wood blocks. It was a ghetto job for sure! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ulu Posted December 16, 2014 Report Share Posted December 16, 2014 we are not working Scouts here..we are working Plymouths . . Point taken. I'll shut up about the Scout. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wayfarer Posted December 16, 2014 Report Share Posted December 16, 2014 Another lifting option is to lift the entire car, frame and all, then place blocks under the body and lower the frame. Since you will be doing some sheet metal repair the added bracing should not be a big job to cleanup later. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mrwrstory Posted December 17, 2014 Report Share Posted December 17, 2014 (edited) Jack the whole thing up about a foot or so, slide in a coupla little stub walls under the rocker panels and drop the frame. The body is very rigid. I could easily open and close the doors while it was sitting like this. Edited December 17, 2014 by mrwrstory 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
suntennis Posted December 17, 2014 Report Share Posted December 17, 2014 I wanted to paint my frame and the underside of the car but did not have any room to store a body so I had all of the underside media blasted. This cleaned up everything and allowed me to paint the frame and undercoat the underside of the body. The cost for blasting the underside and the frame area forward of the firewall was about $500. The body forward of the firewall was removed as well as engine and transmission at the time. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eneto-55 Posted December 17, 2014 Report Share Posted December 17, 2014 If you are working inside a building with trusses on 24" center, you should be able to lift the body with come-alongs attached at the hood brackets and to metal lumber bolted to the rear fender mounting area. That is what I did, in a double garage (24' span). (We had a couple of drive shafts laying in the cradle of the trusses where we attached the chains down to the come-along, so as to spread out the weight over several trusses.) I lifted it off the first time with the doors attached, then later did it again after I had removed them. I set it down on 4 15 gal drums with 2 x 6's (laying flat) across under the rockers, from side to side. That was high enough for me to squat underneath to repair the floors (although I was young then....). Lifting from above seems to me to be much safer than lifting from below. (Although my older brother took the body off of a 53 DeSoto by slowly jacking it up, alternating ends, until it was high enough to get the frame out. That was out-doors, on dirt, and if I recall correctly, he used a bumper jack. He just did it for the fun of it, being only 13 or so. Now I can't imagine now why our parents let him do it....) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dodgeb4ya Posted December 17, 2014 Report Share Posted December 17, 2014 (edited) And another option if you have a backhoe..... Edited December 17, 2014 by Dodgeb4ya 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1940_dodge Posted December 17, 2014 Author Report Share Posted December 17, 2014 If you are working inside a building with trusses on 24" center, you should be able to lift the body with come-alongs attached at the hood brackets and to metal lumber bolted to the rear fender mounting area. That is what I did, in a double garage (24' span). (We had a couple of drive shafts laying in the cradle of the trusses where we attached the chains down to the come-along, so as to spread out the weight over several trusses.) I lifted it off the first time with the doors attached, then later did it again after I had removed them. I set it down on 4 15 gal drums with 2 x 6's (laying flat) across under the rockers, from side to side. That was high enough for me to squat underneath to repair the floors (although I was young then....). Lifting from above seems to me to be much safer than lifting from below. (Although my older brother took the body off of a 53 DeSoto by slowly jacking it up, alternating ends, until it was high enough to get the frame out. That was out-doors, on dirt, and if I recall correctly, he used a bumper jack. He just did it for the fun of it, being only 13 or so. Now I can't imagine now why our parents let him do it....) My garage is a 21x21 two car, but I do believe the trusses are 24" apart. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ulu Posted December 17, 2014 Report Share Posted December 17, 2014 You can always add temporary shoring under the trusses or joists. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
40plyrod Posted December 17, 2014 Report Share Posted December 17, 2014 I lifted mine off and on a couple of times using an engine hoist and a rope around the a and c pillars. I brought the engine hoist in from the side that way the kick-up in the frame doesn't cause much trouble. My floor was solid at the time but with some bracing you should be fine. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robert Horne Posted December 17, 2014 Report Share Posted December 17, 2014 A carport make a good hanger for lifting the body. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ulu Posted December 17, 2014 Report Share Posted December 17, 2014 . . .the very tip of the frame over the rear axle requires quite the lift to clear the body issues as it TUCKS into the raised pocket between the trunk and the rear floor pan . . . Yeah, it's about 18" of interference if you try to go straight off. I had to think about this a while and go look at mine again, because the one we "rescued" 30 years ago was a 4-door & in rather bad shape from the floor down. There wasn't much left of the spare tire well either. In fact I'm sure we crushed the muddy rusted remainder up a bit because it was hitting one wheel of the trailer we were loading the body on. The rockers were pretty bad too and we didn't try to lift under them at all. We just kept prying between body and frame a bit at a time, where we had solid metal and wired boards under the floor to it. I often wonder what happened to that car. It was from Tulare County, and my friend was going to use it for a hot rod project, but then he bought a complete '49 Stude and sold the P15 bits off. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1940_dodge Posted December 17, 2014 Author Report Share Posted December 17, 2014 A carport make a good hanger for lifting the body. Hah! You can always add temporary shoring under the trusses or joists. I am definitely not a structural engineer, do you have any examples you can show us? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ulu Posted December 18, 2014 Report Share Posted December 18, 2014 Sorry, no, but basically you put a 4X4 post under the joists you want to lift from, one on each side of the car, close to the car. That cuts the joist span down to a bit more than 6', and it will not cave the roof in when you start hoisting the body. I did this to hoist a very small tractor, and I just cut the posts 1/8" too long and jacked up the joist a little & stuffed them under there tight. Then I just clamped a 2X4X8' stud each side of the joist to essentially triple it in the span over the posts. I stuck a couple wood screws, "toenailed" from the new 2X4s to the post. You could go buy a steel post cap at the local hardware store, which will work fine. just don't weaken your joists by putting a lot of screws or nails in them. All the load goes right to the floor when you do this, and they'll stay in place fine if you don't run into them. BUT Here's the thing: if the joist flexes sideways the posts will tip over, so the joists should be bridged together with a flat 1X4 so they all share the load in that direction. My garage already has bridging from the original build, but yours might not. I can post up some sketches if you like. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tom Skinner Posted December 18, 2014 Report Share Posted December 18, 2014 Gents, I don't want to hijack this thread, however, I have a question. If one wanted to just change the Rubber Body Mounts at the dozen or so places the Body attaches to the frame, would the method be similar? I mean at that point your only lifting the body up off the frame an inch or two right? Then, I ask what other things need disconnecting to do these Rubber Body Mounts? Fuel Line? Wiring harness from the Transmission (If its a Fluid Drive)? Thanks for the information ahead of time! Tom Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Plymouthy Adams Posted December 18, 2014 Report Share Posted December 18, 2014 individual mount rubber can be changed per side simply by a very slight lift of the body...and you can do it one side at a time Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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