Question for anyone running a 6 volt positive ground Pertronix unit.

[Jeff Balazs]

I am looking at replacing my old conventional points and condenser ignition with a Pertronix Ignitor and a new coil. I am a bit confused as to which coil I should select. Some of their literature I have read through suggests that a 3 Ohm coil should be used for 6 & 4 cylinder applications but the Pertronix website lists a 1.5 ohm coil (#40001) for this specific application. My distributor is an IAT-4011. I am really not certain if this confusion is a 6 volt versus 12 volt thing? Or if I have missed something?

 

Was wondering If any of you have the 6 Volt Ignitor and could tell me what specific coil you are using?

 

Thanks in advance, Jeff

[Plymouthy Adams]

Pertronix is the best place to get an answer on this..word on the street is premature failure is due to a mismatch coil..so they are truly the best to advise you at time of order....they sell matched units...given the initial cost, modification to your point plate and fact they are not on the common parts house shelf...they be the experts to turn too...no one here is going to stand behind a particular match up of components

[DJ194950]

I agree with Tim,

Make the phone call to thier tech line. Some times it can envolve weather you need or want to run a voltage drop resistor, but again, ask.

I found them nice and also helpfull.

 

Doug

Edited April 5, 2014 by DJ194950

[Don Coatney]

Did you give up on the dual point setup?

[Jeff Balazs]

Hey Guys;

I have decided that if I was going to do something with the ignition system I would get away from points altogether. I definitely will be staying with 6 volts so the options are somewhat limited. I really like the idea of having a set up that is not subject to change from points wear etc.. I have never used a unit from Pertronix but I have done a few conversions over the years on motorcycle and boats and in all cases I felt that the system worked much better than the stock ignition. In some instances the transformation was extremely significant. Of course I have made mistakes before.....and if this doesn't wind up being an improvement I will happily fess up.

 

Tim; I am not asking anyone here to spec this coil out. What I was hoping to hear was what sort of experience others who actually have done a 6 Volt conversion have had. Pertronix themselves have listed 3 separate coil #s for this particular 6 volt distributor for non-racing applications. This is a bit puzzling to me.......as their primary recommendation is for a coil that has a resistance of 1.5 ohms and most of their literature indicates that 3.0 ohm coils are required for 4 & 6 cylinder applications. I suspect this may have to do with how this particular 6 volt Ignitor is constructed.......but it would be nice to know more.

 

Since no one who has actually done one of these have responded.......maybe I will end up being the first guy to do this?

 

Jeff

[Plymouthy Adams]

I answered the way I did as I think it is best you have a pleasant first time experience with the conversion and speaking with them may be your only assurance of first time right..I do wish you the best...as you are intent to stay with 6 volt Pos Gnd..Pertronix is the only one I know that is set up to accommodate you with this option...

[Niel Hoback]

   I would like to use Pertronix also, so I'm anxious to hear the answers, too.

[deathbound]

I have no affiliation or experience with this seller, but here is a complete set (ignitor & coil) for 6V positive ground. Not sure what year your truck is.

 

1935-1950 w/Autolite distributor:

http://www.ebay.com/itm/Pertronix-Ignitor-Coil-Chrysler-Dodge-6cyl-w-Autolite-Distributor-6v-POS-1935-50-/190732457967?pt=Motors_Car_Truck_Parts_Accessories&vxp=mtr&hash=item2c688a57ef

 

 

[dodgeguy]

Hi, the wife won one of these set ups at a car show. We turned in the coupon for a 6 volt positive ground for her 47 dodge d24. I haven't had time to install it yet its laying on my work bench. I am heading out door to a swap meet right now, its 5 am in st Louis lol,  but I will look at the coil they shipped when I get home and let you know .

[William Davey]

I have installed the Pertronix ignition and coil on my '55 C-3-B8.  As recommended by others above, call them directly to 1) verify the correct trigger number for 6 volt, POSITIVE ground and 2) get the right coil for your system.  Unfortunately, I'm 1500 miles away from the truck right now and do not remember which coil I got.  In short, ask the manufacturer - get the right part numbers - then call one of the many vendors.  I have used this system for 3 or 4 years now and have had no problems.  It seems to start better, but I can't tell if there's any real performance improvement.

[Tones52]

Hi Jeff,

 

The PO installed the Petronix unit and coil in my 52 Cranbrook. The 'Brook also has the Optima 6 volt battery. So far so good. My neighbor down the street has 3 beautiful vintage Saabs which he has installed the Petronix kits in and he swears by them. Set the timing once and be done with it forever (to paraphrase what he said) And he alternates driving them daily.

 

I talk to the PO a couple of times of month. I can ask him why he picked this particular coil if needed. Here's some photos of what I have.

 

Tony

[blucarsdn]

Several years ago I wanted eliminate the constant problem with poor quality points,, i.e. points have not been used in mainstream vehicles for almost thirty years.

I had converted my '59 Ford F100 V8 and my '57 Ford T-Bird many years earlier..

I got conflickting info from the parts counter men so I called Pertonix.. I told the tech rep that I had a '53 Pontiac 8 with a positive ground 6v. I was given the correct module number for the Pontiac and was told that I had to use Pertronic's 12v Flame Thrower II coil..

I questioned the 12v coil on the 6v system? The Pertronix tech responded that 6v systems have a lot of resistance, therefore a 12v coil is required.. I was also told to eliminate the ballast resistor because the Pertronix module requires full voltage..

I took the car and the Pertronix components to my tuneup man for installation.. Later in the day I got a call from the tuneup man.. He told me I had the wrong components for a Pontiac 8.. I told him he was wrong, he was looking at the tuneup spec's for Pontiac V8's, a 53 is a straight eight.. A question was also raised about the 12v coil on a 6v pos ground system.. Here again I told him to install what I brought him and to remove the ballast resisitor per the instructions..

My tuneup man told me the system would fail, I was on my own...

I had the car for several years, never had a problem with the Pertronix... Bill

[Don Coatney]

I am curious why a 6 volt system had a ballast resistor to begin with?

[Jeff Balazs]

Tony;

That is one of the 3 different coils listed on their site for my application. I see it is 1.5 ohm. So is their primary recommendation #40001. I will definitely call and get all this verified.

 

The unit Deathbound linked to is for a different series distributor than I have. It is interesting though....as the sensor detects the lobes of the distributor shaft rather than a slip on magnetic ring. I wasn't aware that they even offered a kit like this.

 

Jeff

[John Reddie]

I am curious why a 6 volt system had a ballast resistor to begin with?

I am too and also, I thought that GM cars back then were negative ground but it has been years since I have been close to those type of cars. I could be wrong.

John R

[rafriesen]

I am doing the same to my 47 Plymouth.  My problem is why is their 2 wires hooked to the neg. side of my coil.  It only checks at 1.3 ohms.  Trying to find a wiring diagram with no success. Thanks

[blucarsdn]

I am too and also, I thought that GM cars back then were negative ground but it has been years since I have been close to those type of cars. I could be wrong.

John R

 

I am curious why a 6 volt system had a ballast resistor to begin with?

 

As I understand the theory behind a ballast resistor, the engine has full votage for starting, then the ballast resistor, or another form of resistor in the ignition system, reduces the voltage in the run mode for longer point, etc., life..

Ford started to use ballast resistors in the early V8's some time shortly after they were introduced.. The ballast resistor in the '35 to about '41 were mounted on the inside of the firewall.. The '42-48 Fords had the resistor mounted on top of the coil.

I learned a very valuable lesson in about 1952 with a '36 Ford that kept having a "fuel pump" problem.. Turned out it was a coil problem which acted like a fuel delivery problem.. Turned out the ballast resistor had failed, therby burning up several coils.. Had to read a repair manual to find the resistor on the passenger side of the firewall.

Ballast resistors, and or special high resistance primary wires can be found in many vehicles during the '30's, 40's, 50's, etc..

The majority of the GM  and Ford vehicles through about 1948, later in the Pontiacs,  had positive ground electrical systems..

Edited April 8, 2014 by blucarsdn

[Don Coatney]

I was not aware that ballast resistors were used on 6 volt systems to drop ignition voltage. I am curious on how low they did drop the voltage. On 12 volt systems ballast resistors drop the voltage to something around 6 volts and that varies from one resistor to the next as heat builds in the resistor and resistance changes. I agree that on a cold engine when using a ballast resistor full voltage will power the ignition until the ballast resistor heat increases and drops the voltage. On my 12 volt conversion I incorporated a 4 pole Ford starter solenoid. On this solenoid the 4th pole is hot only when the starter is engaged. I wired this 4th pole to the ignition coil so I have a full 12 volts supplying the ignition circuit even when the ballast resistor is hot. One thing to remember when doing what I did is that when using a remote starter under the hood with the ignition switch off that the ignition will be fully powered every time and as long as the starter solenoid is energized.

[Jeff Balazs]

I was under the impression that having a resistor ( or resistance) in the line just affected the amount of current that could flow through the line and not the voltage. Learn something new every day I suppose. Must of missed class that day.

 

Jeff

[55 Fargo]

Read this to understand "Ohms law" and resistance, current voltage and power... http://www.bcae1.com/ohmslaw.htm

[Jeff Balazs]

Boy that blow I took to the noggin must of really messed me up.

I didn't see anything about resistance lowering voltage on it's own. Must be something more to a ballast resistor? Or maybe I am just dense?

 

Jeff

[DJ194950]

Jeff, sorry I ever opened this can of worms! If your current ign. If you never had a  drpping resistor there should be NO reason to even consider adding one with the Pertronix changeover. I just suggested from the start for ask them if you were using one on how to wire the new coil up.

 

It just gets mentioned on how to wire their coils with a changeover. I've only done 12 v. and both said that no resistor required with their new coils  but some may be needed for other? reasons and could still be used as per stock setups!

 

SORRY AGAIN!!

 

Doug

[Plymouthy Adams]

my research on line shows that the Ford coil for 1932 - 48 and flathead V8 in application only got a ballast resistor as the coil was wound by the manufacturer to operate at approx. 4 - 4.5 volts and by looking at the position of the resistor it seems to be thermal.... 

 

The 4 cylinder did not require a resistor and though I cannot find the details on the coil for that application, it is evident by the absence of the resistor it is wound for 6 volt straight battery power

[TodFitch]

Boy that blow I took to the noggin must of really messed me up.

I didn't see anything about resistance lowering voltage on it's own. Must be something more to a ballast resistor? Or maybe I am just dense?

 

Jeff

E=IR

 

Voltage drop E is proportional to the current I through the resistor R. Since the coil draws current, there will be a voltage drop across any resistor in series with the supply voltage to the coil.

[Jeff Balazs]

Doug;

Nothing at all to be sorry for.

I am just trying to understand what really happens when the resistance of the coil changes? This is one of those specifics that I have never delved into. Up til now I have been happy just to make sure that I replaced components like this with the correct item....and it worked.

 

Jeff