50 Desoto Brakes, Brakes And More Brakes

[50desotocoupe]

I have been struggling for the last 3 nights to get my new shoes on and adjusted on the front of my 50 Desoto.  I even took off the new shoes and put the old shoes back on thinking that would get be the clearance I needed, nope.  No matter what I do I can't get them in enough to get the drums over them.  I built the tool out of PVC and am close.  What would you experts give for advice?  Should I release the brake line so there is no pressure in the system?  I have read every brake posting that I can find.  I am stumped at this point.  Any tips for the newbie? 

 

Also, I am thinking if I can't get this to work about going with discs.  Scarebird has a kit that fits a 10" drum, but the ID of my drums are 12".  I have an email into them but was wondering what you guys are using.

Thank you!!

[Plymouthy Adams]

did you replace the wheel cylinders?  if so did you check the depth of the cups for the shoe spreader pin for exact fit...there are three known sizes of pins depending upon which cup was being used..

Edited May 16, 2013 by Plymouthy Adams

[50desotocoupe]

Hi, no, they are the same wheel cylinders. They aren't leaking and looked clean inside when I took the boots off to check. I have a receipt from the previous owner that someone did all the wheel cylinders and supposedly shoes about a year before I bought it.

 

Funny how these things start. I decided that I wanted salt flat wheels for the car so I needed to press in studs. While I was there I wanted to paint the drums. Then I saw the condition of the front shoes and ordered those. Then I saw the condition of the tie rods, and ordered those, then the shocks are older than I am, so I ordered those. This thing will steer and handle perfectly when I am done with it...lol

[Plymouthy Adams]

verify you have the major and minor settings at their lowest setting?  also compare the thickness of the lining..13/64

Edited May 16, 2013 by Plymouthy Adams

[50desotocoupe]

Well, I think I do.  I have the minor settings with the "flat" concentric facing towards the outside of the drum.  I have the major settings with the arrow facing towards the wheel cylinder and have moved so the shoes are in as far as they can go.  I havent' measured the shoes, but bought them from Andy Bernbaum and they are slightly thicker than the old shoes (I would assume because of wear).

Thank you for helping me with this!  I raced BMW's for years and restored a Datsun Roadster.  I must be missing something obvious.

[_shel_ny]

As Plymouthy says. Run the settings back to their lowest.

 

Start over from there.

 

The homemade PVC tool is a help in centering the shoes, but is not much value when it comes to clearances.

 

 

[P15-D24]

Pull a shoe and see if it fits the inside circumference of the brake drum. I suspect the shoea need to be ground to fit the drum. The other posts covered the only other possible causes. 

[50desotocoupe]

Thank you for all this good information. I am going to pull everything off and start fresh. 

[JIPJOBXX]

Here is the set up I made from pcv pipe-it works ok not the best but ok!http://i2.photobucket.com/albums/y4/1942dodge/1942%20Dodge/DSC01987.jpg

[desoto1939]

I looked in my Brake catalog and here ae the specs for your shoes:

 

drum diameter 12 inches

width 2 inches

3/16 thickness on the brake pad

length   12 5/8

uses a 4-5 rivet if you have riveted lining 

all 4 pieces are the same length

 

Model 1105A  brake lining

 

Desoto 1942, 1946-48 and 50

Write to me about the Ammco brake gage. Sent you a PM about the tool

 

Rich Hartung

[James_Douglas]

I have an original setting gauge.  I found it works ok, but not great.  Here is what I do:

 

1.  Take the bolts that hold the heel out.

2.  On the bench take a hacksaw and put 2 fine blades on it. 

3.  Now cut a slot into the end of the bolts.

4.  Put the shoes back in and turn the adjusters all the way in leaving the heel bolt nut a little loose.

5.  Take chalk and mark lines on the shoes every 2 inches.

6.  Put the hub back on which will be easy with both the heel and toe adjusted all the way in.

5.  Turn the heel bolt with a screwdriver from the outside back of the backing plate until the heel contacts the drum.

6.  Hold the screwdriver and tighten the nut, (A third hand can help).

7.  Do the minor adjustment, spin the drum.

8.  Take drum off and see that the contact patch is correct across the entire shoe face. (This assumes you measured the drum and arched the shoes correctly or all bets are off)

9.  Re-mark with chalk and re-adjust as needed.

10.  Go drive!

 

 

Best, James

[homebrewer]

James, Brilliant!!!!!

[Dodgeb4ya]

Line #8 is very important!

[P15-D24]

And the drum must be round, as in having been turned. 

[Don Coatney]

Nothing I can add to the great advice already given. Follow it and report your results.

 

[50desotocoupe]

You guys rock!!!  Thank you!  I will be out in the garage tomorrow taking all your insight and hopefully things will be working alot better!!!  I will keep you posted on the progress.

[James_Douglas]

As an aside to this thread...

 

I purchased off eBay a couple of sets of Post WWII aftermarket break shoe anchor self centering bolts and cams.  This was a kit made by a company in the LA area. It uses a special set of bolts that allow the show heel to self center.  I am testing it on one side of my Desoto Suburban.

 

At some point I will let people know if the thing works. It does not self adjust the shoe, but it claims to self centers the heel, thus avoiding the steps I mentioned above.

 

James

[50desotocoupe]

I made progress today.  I have the drivers side basically back together.  It is slightly rubbing on the top but the shoes are as far "in" as I can possible get them.  I will work on the passengers side tomorrow night.

 

thank you again for all of your help and advice!!!!!!

[James_Douglas]

Hi,

 

On the heels...don't worry about getting them "IN" on the heels as far as you can.  The point of the adjustment is to get the ENTIRE shoe centered in the round "bore" of the drum.  You want even contact across the shoe as shown by the marking of the chalk.  You can in fact put the heels too far IN and end up with just the bottom 1/2 of the shoe doing work.

 

Keep at it and you will get the feel of it.

 

James

[50desotocoupe]

I made more progress today on the passengers side.  The shoes are slightly too "big" as the drum fits over but rubs on the top show.  Does it make sense to sand down a little material to refine the adjustments?  I am not sure what else would make it work as I have all 4 adjustors on the "in" position. 

 

I know I said it before, but thank you VERY much for your insight and tips. 

[_shel_ny]

Local shop relined my shoes. Did me a "favor" with oversize linings. Made 2 trips back to have them sanded down so that they would fit in the drums. Took my drums each time. They were sanded to match the drums.

[Jerry Roberts]

 If the arc of the shoe has the same arc as the drum , you probably don't want to remove any of the shoe . As mentioned earlier , you can see if the arc is correct by placing the loose shoe in the drum and look for a space between the shoe and the drum . It must be pretty close as you were able to get the drum on . 

[desoto1939]

On your new brake linings both end should be chamfered on cut on a slight angle and not have a blut end. The slight cut or chamferring permits the drum  to turn without hitting the lining. This might als be your problem.

 

If you can find an old time garage they might have the Ammco safe arc grinding tool to arc the shoes and linig to match your drums.

 

Rich Hartung

desoto1939@aol.com

[50desotocoupe]

Hi All,

Well, the Desoto is on the ground with new wheels and stance.  I am giving up on the brakes and taking the car to someone who knows how to adjust them.  I have worked on them for countless hours the last 3 weeks and just can't figure them out.  Time to call in the experts.

 

What do you think of the stance?  I know not for the purist but I think given the vibe of the car it fits "her". 

[Don Coatney]

Hi All,

I am giving up on the brakes and taking the car to someone who knows how to adjust them.  I have worked on them for countless hours the last 3 weeks and just can't figure them out.  Time to call in the experts.

 

How will you find someone who has the correct tools and knows how to adjust them? Most any brake shop will tell you they can do it but finding a shop that actually has the skills and tools to do it I would think will be a problem. I suggest you ask all the right questions (such as are you familur with Lockheed brakes and do you have the Ammco 1750 tool) before selecting a shop.