desoto1939

In the above picture of the maw4016 notice the use of the correct starter switch and some people call it a solenoid. This is a foot lever pedal style. Notice the screw that is treaded into the lower right corner. This is where the wire connects from the starter motor and runs to the sisson choke if you truck or car has one installed. When the lever is pushed forward it makes contact with the copper plate that sits on top of a fabric material so that you do not short to the connections. The action of pressing the lever forward and hitting the copper plate then pushes the contact point to hit the copper plate and then this makes the connection so the starter motor will spin ad the drive end on the ring gear and at the same time sends the electric current to the sisson choke. Looks as if you now have the correct starter motor and switch. Just have the motor checked out. Rich hartung Desoto1939@aol.com

Angel: according t my autolite catalog the Autolite stater motor MCH-6103 uses the SW-2813 swith that has the hole in the side and the mch-6106 uses the switch sw-2827 that does not have the hole in the side. Have you looked at the attachment that I posted with the pictures of the various starter switches. On the unit that you shoed it has the tab to attach the wire into the side of the starter switch. Please feel free to contact me Rich Hartung desoto1939@aol.comm home 610-630-9188 live near Philadelphia pa

Angel On the starter unit that you have the photo of there isa a copper plate that attaches to the outside of the starter motor body. at the very front of the unit there is a tab that is threaded. The Autolite sw 2813 is the unit that has the hole in the side of the starter switch. A screw is inserted in a a wire clip and then screwed into this hole and then the other end of the wire attaches to the sisson choke. This is the same switch that is on my 1939 Desoto. So if you are using this starter motor that is why the switch is not matching up and there should also be two studs that come out of the motor body to bolt the switch to the starter body rich Hartung desoto1939@aol.com

Starter Switches.pdf

Ok the first question is for what year and what truck for 49 and also for what truck model for 51. There are several starter switches that are used according to the truck model and year and also according to which starter motor is installed in the truck. So I need to know the year and model of the truck and also the starter motor that is installed. I canthen look up in my autolite catalog and tell you the correct components. The switch could have been the SW 2813 or sw-2827 so if you had to weld on the Stater switch then you have the incorrect switch. In my autolite book it did not show a picture of the switch sw-2827. I did look in my Echlin catalog and it shows a picture of the SW-2827. This is almost the same as the SW 2813 but on the SW 2827 there is no hole at the left front ot hook and screw in a wire to send a current to the sisson choke the Echlin number would be an ST-29 to fit Dodge trucks 50-56 and fargo from 1950-56 The SW 2827 is in the upper section in the lower left corner and is marked as ST29 and made by Echlin. the autolite would look the same Rich hartung Desoto1939@aol.com Starter Switches.pdf

I am not sure if people are expecting the brakes on out 1930-40 and 50's car and trucks to perform and stop like our modern 2000 ish vehicles. Back before power brake and vacuum assisted brakes all we had were the manual and if the case of rod mechanical brakes. When our fathers drove these cars the speed were not as fast and the roads were not as good, in certain terms, in which we can average 70+ mph on a super highway and then can come to a complete stop without any fading or softness in the brakes as to be compared when driving on the technology that 80 or so years old. I think everyone has to get back in the car and then think about what they are going to be driving in the next few minutes. It is not your current car but an antique car. The cars do not stop on a dime but can, they do not have the acceleration like the current cars and lighting of halogen bubs and 12 volt system if they are a stock antique vehicle. So if you brakes have a good pedal with the proper amount of travel in the pedal as per the spec's for your car then you should be good go. BUT and I say BUT you have to be in the frame of mind that you are driving an old car and they act slower and anticipate situations, like noticing that a green light has been green for awhile as you get closer to the intersection. Did the light just turn green now you have a much longer time to get through the intersection, anticipate additional stopping distances be aware of the extra distance that might be needed to stop remember the old safe diving lesson keep 3 car lengths between you and the other car. You need in more so reason to be a defense driver in the older cars. We have to have that understanding in our minds before we even venture out of the garage and everytime we start up the antique car, These are older and they do not act like our modern cars. So think of driving your modern 2016 car with a v6 coming home from work and then on the next day you had to use you old Model A to get to work an entirely different driving situation as a prime example. Rich Hartung desoto1939@aol.com

JipJob: Did you use the Ammco brake gage 1750 to set the brake shoe adjustment? Also did you look in the tech section on the setup and use of the ammco brake tool? Rich Hartung desoto1939@aol.com

You stated that you put a spacer in the front wheel cylinder to take up the extra distance to compensate for the front drum being oversized. The pistons onyour car should have a slot that the toe or top of the brake shoe should slide into. This is very important that the tip of the metal part of the shoe is in the slot. So how did you make an insert to take of the extr room. The slot should have approx. 3/8 of depth so did you put a spacer in the slot area and how are you keeping it in place. The original brake material thickness should be 3/16 as stated in an earlier posting. Ok it sounds as if you are getting closer to a better brake. Did you ever look in the technical section on the use of the ammco brake and miller tool brake adjustment section. Again as I stated before I have the Ammco brake tool that canbe rented to insure that you have the proper brake shoe adjustment. Contact me Rich Hartung desoto1939@aol.com

If you have an auto supply house sometime they lend out tools you could ask to see if the have an axle puller that can be loaned some type use the slidehammer style that threads onto the end of the axle. Rich Hartung

Squirebill: Yes there are several methods to purge the wheel cylinder of the air and I also did not recommend that he put the car in a ditch. But with the particular wheel cylinder tht he had on his car which is the step down the hole to let in the brake fluid is at 3 oclock but the bleeder outlet is at the top of the wheel cylinder so the air bubble or air pocket then would float upto the top of the cylinder. I explained this to this owner. So after many attempts of trying to bleed air out and he stated no bubbles it was then made clear it was an adjust ment issue. This is very common with the early Lockheed brakes. Since I have the same setup that is why I have the experience to tell this gentleman to check the adjustment. And guess what it was an adjustment issue. I think we can put this topic to bed but listen to people that have dealt with the issue. I am not an expert but was just trying to help this guy. Most of us bleed our brakes via the two person process and as I stated I was just going over it again to make sure he understood the process. Any process that works for you is perfectly fine it is solves the issue. Rich Hartung

Squirebill: I am not saying that the one man bleeding or the two man bleeding is wrong. But the gentleman has been stating that he has had a soft pedal. Even after bleeding the brake cylinders. I was just trying to make sure he was doing it in a logical fashion. He even called me directly to talk about this situation and I told him on the phone that it sounded as if the brakes were still out of proper adjustment. We went over the adjusting of the brakes. I have the same system inmy car a 39 Desoto so I know the setup that he has. I also think we assumed by his input that he had done all four wheel and then find out it was only the fronts. He then went to another wheel on the car and discovered that one drum was still not adjusted correctly .After adjusting the brakes on this drum he then had a good pedal. But when you ask for help and people try to provide help I get comments from other members that make me not want to help. I was not trying to be condescending in my comments or suggestions but trying to help this gentleman with comments and suggestions on how to proceed and from my own experiences on what still might be the issue with the brakes. I am not a mechanic but also do most of the work myself. So the forum is a great source of ideas and help so lets not put down any messengers. We are all learning about our cars and trucks. Rich Hartung

Get the brass freeze or welch plugs the brass is more but the galvanized evenutall rust the brass is better and get the flat plugs the the lipped plugs the lipped plugs are not correct. The expandable plug canbe used but is not correct these are used in an emergency situation and then replaced witht he correct plugs. Rich Hartung

From your picture of the rear brake assembly it looks as if you have also removed the two eccentric pins at the bottom of the backing plate. Now this will make the adjustment to the heel harder with out the ammoco tool. Yes as by your own education the bleeder screw is at the top of each wheel cylinder and this is how the air gets removed fromt he cylinder. This is why I kept stating that you did not have a air issue but was an alignment or adjustment issue. Please keep us posted on how you kame out with the brake overhaul. Rich Hartung Desoto1939@aol.com

On the latest picture of the brake shoes that were on the car I noticed that the front and bottom part of the lining was not chamfered but had a blunt end to them. These shoes should have been cut at an angle to help with the roatation all of my lining have the slight angle cut so you have a smooth transition into the braking shoe material. Rich hartung

What a great way to bring back some good old memories for your uncles 85th birthday. Get to ask him a lot of questions about what he has seen over his lifetime, you will amazed at what this will do for his spirits and also his mind. They all went through some hard times and then the good time after war and also the depression. They gave up a lot and the current generation will never know what they did for this great country. They sacrificed a lot, worked hard to get their first home and new car, saw the advent of Intersate highways, phones without operator service, plane and jet travel, rockets and space travel going from witing letters to using a typewriter manual then electric, then to computers and cellphone and all the new gadets of today, microwaves instead of good old fashion mom making a home cooked meal, Fresh food and vegetable and not having bread and milk that can sit on the shelf for weeks. The milkman making a daily delivery to your doorstep, cream that floated to the top of the milk glass bottle, the paper cap, the fuller brush man and his brooms, the bread man, the iceman, getting letters in the mail that were hand written in cursive and not an email with accronyms and widgets. And the best of all live was better and people respected each other. Instead of travel at breakneck speeds they travels around 40-50 MPH and going to grandmoms and granddads house was a nice family trip. remember the times spent at the diner table talking about what happened the excitement of things learned and the conversations and also they did not have tv but listens to radio and had to use their mind to vision in their heads what was happening. The big bands and the swing music dancing while holding onto each other and looking into each others eyes and the smiles on each others face. This why the marriages lasted longer and there was a great bond between these two great people that you have posted a picture. And bet of all she is still standing with her husband even thought he is bound to a wheelchair. rich HArtung

OK. So I have the same setup as goat of his Chrysler. My master cylinder is located on the frame rail under the floor board so we both have the same setup with the master cylinder and also the same individual wheel cylinders that are also know as stepdown cylinder because of the two different size inner pistons. So I have been driving my car for the past 30 years yea 30 years and the car still has the original wheel cylinders and master cylinder. So may car is 76 years old and have a good braking pedal. I did have a soft pedal once and that was due to the adjustment issue of the shoes. I have recommended that Mr Goat go and have his individual drums measured with a good micrometer such as an Ammco tool this will cost him some money but this will at least tell him if the drum have been over cut or not. This then eliminates one issue or might be the issue. Then I have told him that I have the AMMCO Brake gage tool 1750 to adjust the brakes, this tool was used by the dealers and also mechanics to adjust the brakes to the proper setting. He has not taken me up on the offer of the tool. So I do not know what else we can do for him He has the stock system. He has also stated that there are no air bubbles when he bleeds the brake so that indicates that there is no issue with air in the system because if he continues to bleed the brakes as he is stating then the air has been removed. So the next part is on him to get the drum miced and measured. If they are over sized I have also suggested that he get a set of brakes shoes that are riveted style but will need to have shims of the proper thickness placed behind the shoe lining to take up the extra space because the drum are oversized. also will need the correct sized rivet. Then will still need the use of the Ammco brake gage to get the shoes set to the proper arc. The brake shoe lining number that is the stock lining is an 1162 number this is a number that is used by all lining manufacturers so is generic across the board. I also do have some extra riveted lining if he needs them. Also to the bleed the brakes in the traditional manner this is a 2 person job. One in the car and one under the car at the individual wheel cylinder and they have to work in tandem to do the job correctly. Rich Hartung Desoto1939@aol.com cell 484-431-8157

The single hole in the wheel cylinder is not an issue. These stepdown cylinders were used for many years on the chrylser products. I have them on my 39 Desoto. Since 1949 Goat has stated that there is no more air bubbles when he bleeds the brake then it is an adjustment issue. The drums might have been cut a couple of times and they might have been overcut. Another suggestion is to take the drums to a repair shop and have them officially micrometer the diameter of the drum opening. If they have been over cut them there is not enough thickness on the drum and they should be replaced. If at the max then the brake lining would need to be shimmed with the proper thickness behind the lining and against the metal brake shoe. This is what was done in the old days when they used riveted linings and the drum was cut to the max. I still fell that it is a brake adjustment issue because when he pumps the brake pedal he gets a hard pedal so that is meaning that the shoes are moving outward but they are to far inward and the second push moves them out more then the first push. As I have suggested he needs to get the Ammco brake gage to officially adjust the shoes and to eliminate the adjustment issue. Then if a problem we can at least make more suggestions. I told goat 49 that I have the Ammco tool. Rich HArtung Desoto1939

Linus: The points cap and rotor are very common items and can be found at most swap meets. I the point here is to know what caps, rotors and ppints and condensors cross reference over to the autolite numbers. This is why I have been collecting and scanning the various other manufacturers information and I have all of this on CD's. I even have a catalog that is a major cross ref to most of the common parts suppliers. Rich Hartung desoto1939@aol.com

Frank Mitchel is in Georgia. you can look him up on a websearch. The company was sold but they have a lot of mopar parts because he is a mopar vendor and has been doing it for over 30+ years. rich Hartung

Robert: HAve you tried Roberts Motor Parts and or even Frank Mitchell. I would assume that someone should have this part if they were used in cars up till 1952. Rich Hartung

I was looking in my tristate mopar catalog and all I can see listed is the oil strainer assembly and for all models the 37-40 can type is part number 672484, 1940-52 oil strainer assembly flat type is part number 862831. I did a search on ebay and found several of the part number 67248 so not sure what you are looking for. Put a picture of the item and this might help everyone. I use the can style pickup in my 39 Desoto rich Hartung desoto1939@aol.com

This is rich Hartung with the 39 Desoto and I have the step down wheel cylinders just like you have on your 41 Chrysler. There is only 1 hole in the middle of the wheel cylinder and it is in the same location as to what you have shown in the picture of your wheel cylinder. so that is not the problem. You have stated that when bleeding the brakes you no longer get any air bubbles in the collection jar. So that indicates that you have bleed the system of air. If you have done this with all four brakes. The go back to the right rear drum and bleed this line only. Let us know if you get any air bubbles. If not, then you have an adjustment problem of the shoes to the drum. With no air bubbles then the system is free of air. I still feel that you need to use either the Ammco 1750 brake gage or the factory miller brake setting tool to get the proper setup for the shoes to not feel soft. The softness is due to the shoes not being adjusted correctly. I do have the Ammco brake tool. If you have an old time mechanic then I would have them involved with the adjustment. Some of the new young guys do not understand the older systems Rich Hartung Desoto1939@aol.com cell 484-431-8157 home 610-630-9188 call me

on the distributor is the hole threaded? If so then the screw-in style grease cup is used. from what I can see it looks as if there are threads. What is the Dizzy model number I can loo u and tell what type of cup was used. Rich Hartung desoto1939@aol.com