no fuel

[jgreg53]

I'm still waiting on my rebuild kit in the mail.

[jgreg53]

I received  the fuel pump kit in the mail.  Put the pump together. Easy enough.  Getting gas to the carb now.  still will not start.  Timing is way off.  With the #1 cylinder at top dead center on the compression stroke, the rotor button is pointing at 10 o'clock instead of 07:00.  Any Ideas?  I think I need to take the oil pump out and move the gear on the shaft around so that the rotor points  to the #1 plug tower.  

[Don Coatney]

1 minute ago, jgreg53 said:

I received  the fuel pump kit in the mail.  Put the pump together. Easy enough.  Getting gas to the carb now.  still will not start.  Timing is way off.  With the #1 cylinder at top dead center on the compression stroke, the rotor button is pointing at 10 o'clock instead of 07:00.  Any Ideas?  I think I need to take the oil pump out and move the gear on the shaft around so that the rotor points  to the #1 plug tower.  

Easier to move the plug wires in the cap to see if that works.

[jgreg53]

Didn't think of that. I might give it a try.  Why do you think it moved like that?

[Plymouthy Adams]

with these older vehicles, one never knows who or how they did their repairs over the ages..if new oil pump put on...failure to index it properly crates a failure to index the distributor properly

[jgreg53]

all of this started when I changed the spark plug wires.  Then the fuel pump quit.  Now this problem.  I know why people who can afford it rip out the original running gear and change it to more modern stuff.

[jgreg53]

should have left well enough alone.

 

[Plymouthy Adams]

23 minutes ago, jgreg53 said:

should have left well enough alone.

 

well........I will say this, IF you have the repair manual for this car, understand how this stuff works I see no reason why you could not just quickly set things back to stock configuration and KNOW what you dealing with....

[Merle Coggins]

I just went back to the beginning of this thread and read through it again. If I have it all right you have replaced the fuel tank and lines, rebuilt the fuel pump, and replaced the plug wires. You recently state that you now have gas being pumped up to the carb and that you have spark at the plugs. Now the questions are, is the spark coming at the right time, and is gas getting to the cylinders?

Earlier you stated that your #1 plug wire was where the rotor pointed at #1 TDC, but later you said that you think the timing is way off. Oil pump/rotor indexing aside, when you set the #1 cylinder at TDC, on the compression stroke, does the rotor point at the #1 plug wire?  Then following around the cap, in the same direction the rotor turns, you should have #5, #3, #6, #2, and #4. If all of that checks out it should be close enough to start. You could fine tune it by static timing. Connect a test light between the 2 small leads on the coil. With your engine at #1 TDC, or set to 2-3 degrees advanced, pull off the cap and have a look at the points. Retard the timing until the points are closed. your test light should be lit if the key is on. Now advance the distributor until the test light starts to flicker and go out. This is the position where  the points are just opening, and this is the point where the coil will discharge through your plug wires to the spark plug. Lock down the distributor and reinstall the cap. If it won't start now then you are lacking fuel into the cylinders, or you have no compression.

That brings up another thought. I've had valves hang open on my truck after sitting for a period of time. Especially if the weather has been damp after running it. It will crank weird and have difficulty starting. In my case they eventually free up and the engine would start. As it warms up the valves loosen up and work normally again. I haven't had that happen in a couple years now.

[jgreg53]

I tried what Don suggested. I moved all the wires on the cap over one spot, then I did a static timing.  She started right up.  I fine tuned the timing with a timing light and she's running good. Thanks for the advise, Don. The new spark plug wires, (which started this mess) actually helped.  The wires from AB are crap.

[Fernando Mendes]

18 hours ago, Don Coatney said:

Easier to move the plug wires in the cap to see if that works.

[Plymouthy Adams]

2 minutes ago, Fernando Mendes said:

index the wires to the now mis-located number one cylinder after improper installed orientation of the oil pump.....

Edited August 16, 2017 by Plymouthy Adams

[Merle Coggins]

12 hours ago, jgreg53 said:

I tried what Don suggested. I moved all the wires on the cap over one spot, then I did a static timing.  She started right up.  I fine tuned the timing with a timing light and she's running good. Thanks for the advise, Don. The new spark plug wires, (which started this mess) actually helped.  The wires from AB are crap.

Good news...

So, were the plug wires off one hole since the change? Or did they get that way after messing with everything else?

[jgreg53]

that's hard to say, Merle.  I was going by what I had read on here that the #1 wire should be at 0700.  I had to set it closer to 10:00.

[Fernando Mendes]

11 minutes ago, jgreg53 said:

that's hard to say, Merle.  I was going by what I had read on here that the #1 wire should be at 0700.  I had to set it closer to 10:00.

Mine is pointing to 0400 o'clock.Many guys here said to me forget if my engine is ok.Then I forgot.But to me, if I want to put in 0700 o'clock(standard position) I only have first to put #1 piston in TDC,#1 plug wire turning both until 0700 o'clock(pulling up dizzy) and oil pump gear(pulling up pump)  to the clockwise direction,number of tooth necessary.

[Merle Coggins]

Where does this idea that "the rotor must point to 7 o'clock" come from? I just read through my Shop Manual and Operators Manual regarding oil pump installation, and distributor installation. There is never this sort of reference. It only mentions to align the rotor to point to the #1 plug wire when inserting the distributor, with #6 at TDC and exhaust valve closing. (This would put #1 at TDC on compression stroke). 

The only place I recall ever seeing this reference is here on the forum. It seems to get several people confused when their rotor is pointing at a different angle.

[greg g]

My P15 manual mentions this on page 147 under Engine Oiling System also referenced in a picture caption for figure 29.  There is also a section on adjusting the spark plug wires if the oil pump position is accidentally changed.  Manual number D13251 covering p15 - p20.

[Merle Coggins]

OK, thanks. It's not mentioned in my B-Series truck manuals.

I guess it's only important on Plymouths.

[Don Coatney]

I believe oil pump/distributor indexing is done only to make it easier for mechanics out in the field to make tune ups easier. If one understands how the system works the oil pump can be installed any which way and the engine will run well.

[Fernando Mendes]

22 minutes ago, greg g said:

My P15 manual mentions this on page 147 under Engine Oiling System also referenced in a picture caption for figure 29.  There is also a section on adjusting the spark plug wires if the oil pump position is accidentally changed.  Manual number D13251 covering p15 - p20.

If is valid to Plymouth is too the other D C D.Can you send us this picture of figure 29?In my WWII 1942 Jeep manual have a figure that ties saying that #1 spark plug is in 0600 o' clock.

[greg g]

.

[Fernando Mendes]

Thanks greg g.

[jgreg53]

what's a good source for replacement brake shoes?

[knuckleharley]

20 minutes ago, jgreg53 said:

what's a good source for replacement brake shoes?

If you have the factory parts numbers and the patience,amazon.com is hard to beat. I bought brand new Lockheed wheel cylinders for my 39 IHC pu for $3.95 each there. IHC parts dealers were wanting stupid money for them.

Same thing with my 51 Ford. It was either my 51 Ford or my 39 IHC that used the same parts numbers as the 53-54 Corvette. The key is searching by parts number stamped or cast on the part. If you look for "1948 Plymouth",generally speaking all you will come up with are parts for a 1948 Plymouth.