thrashingcows Posted September 15, 2011 Report Posted September 15, 2011 (edited) Well I was junk yarding the other day and came across something I couldn't pass on. I was cruising methodically through the yard when I came across a dodge van. I usually don't bother too much with the vans but for some reason I went to the drivers side and popped open the door. Well what did I see staring at me from the drivers side...."3" pedals!!! I then jumped out and looked at the model...88 Dodge 1/2 ton van....Hmmm....looked between the bucket seats and spotted a shifter with a certain shift ball on the top. Then quickly crawled under the van and sure enough it had a complete...unmolested A833OD set-up behind a 318!! Needless to say I couldn't get it out fast enough...30 minutes later I was on my way up to the register one happy customer. Then $150 (including core and taxes) I was out the door with my prize. Here's a couple pics.... I plan on using this set-up behind the flathead 6 in my 48 Desoto...eventually. Edited September 18, 2011 by thrashingcows Quote
greg g Posted September 15, 2011 Report Posted September 15, 2011 what size in the input shaft bearing retainer? Apparently there are several and one is very close to the on the DeSoto, or are you planning on adating the bellhousing to the flattie. nice find, some info here http://www.moparmusclemagazine.com/techarticles/drivetrain/40618_a_833_manual_transmission_swap/index.html Quote
thrashingcows Posted September 15, 2011 Author Report Posted September 15, 2011 Yes plan on getting one of the adapter plates available. I know I've seen the seller here on the board, and also over on the HAMB....Runs his buisness down in Oregon. Quote
55 Fargo Posted September 15, 2011 Report Posted September 15, 2011 Way to go Brian, looks like a good find... Quote
Christopher Posted September 15, 2011 Report Posted September 15, 2011 I would like to know about those adapters.Christopher from the high and lonesome... Quote
wayfarer Posted September 15, 2011 Report Posted September 15, 2011 I would like to know about those adapters.Christopher from the high and lonesome... My web site is still under construction, and probably will be for a long time, but what is there is fully accessible. Take a look around and let me know if you have any questions. www.qualityengineeredcomponents.com Quote
thrashingcows Posted September 15, 2011 Author Report Posted September 15, 2011 Yes plan on getting one of the adapter plates available. I know I've seen the seller here on the board, and also over on the HAMB....Runs his buisness down in Oregon. My web site is still under construction, and probably will be for a long time, but what is there is fully accessible. Take a look around and let me know if you have any questions.www.qualityengineeredcomponents.com And here he is.... Thank you for the link. Quote
Rusty O'Toole Posted September 15, 2011 Report Posted September 15, 2011 This is great information, thanks for starting this thread. Have been wondering about this swap for a long time. Is there any chance of using the stock column shift with the 4 speed? It should be possible to shift 4 gears but what about reverse? Has anyone done this? What about the handbrake? Is it possible to adapt the stock handbrake onto the trans or do you have to change to a rear brake system? Quote
greg g Posted September 15, 2011 Report Posted September 15, 2011 The shifter is spec'd specially for the OD as the gear set resides in the slot which would be 3rd gear in the regular trans so while you row the shifter normally the box actually shifts 1, 2, 4, 3. the shifter is a specially made deal by hurst. to deal with that, as 4th was the 1 to 1 ratio they left it there and but the .073 gear set in in place of third, probably chages the 2nd gear ratio to compensate a bit. GM/Chevy also used this transmission in 6 cylinder light duty vans and 6 cyl half ton pickups of the same time period. there are several iterations aluminum case, cast iton case and long and short tail shafts. As well as three different input brearing retainer diameters. They were common in ASPEN/Volare as they were intorduced there to try to compete with imports in the fuel milage derby in light of the first fuel shortage days. Had a girl friend who had an Aspen with the slant 6 and that trans, it coudn't pass a kid on a tricycle up hill but it would get about 32 mph on the highway. It is not likely that the column shift could be adapted without a lot of levers, bell cranks, turnbuckles, etc. Should be plenty stron for even a built big flattie. Quote
Rusty O'Toole Posted September 15, 2011 Report Posted September 15, 2011 Have seen them in Dodge pickups in local junkyards, in fact I saw one last week. Maybe I should get one. How does this trans compare with the newer T5 5 speed? Quote
John Mulders Posted September 15, 2011 Report Posted September 15, 2011 Good find. Not an expert but is the stick not pointing the wrong direction (to the front)? John Quote
TR Waters Posted September 15, 2011 Report Posted September 15, 2011 There is nothing special about the shifters. The 3-4 change is made by the small lever being reversed on the trans. The OD 4 speeds were built in cast iron, iron and aluminum, or all aluminum cases. Quote
wayfarer Posted September 15, 2011 Report Posted September 15, 2011 Have seen them in Dodge pickups in local junkyards' date=' in fact I saw one last week. Maybe I should get one. How does this trans compare with the newer T5 5 speed?[/quote']Both have a reduction in the .7 range. The Mopar box is probably 10 times stronger but it is also one gear short. Both will require that a new axle be installed so you have an e-brake. The t-5 is a top shift; the A-833 is a side shift. An all-iron A-833 is in the 80lb range. If you adapt the t-5 to a stock bell you get to keep your stock starter and mid-mounts (if you have them) and anything else attached to the stock bell. If you want to adapt the A-833 you can use that somewhat mysterious 59-60 bell that has both the flat six and v-8 bolt patterns and requires only a little fussing or you can use the block adapter and mount the smallblock bellhousing with late 12-volt starter. If the original van/pickup used the 143 tooth flywheel then you just saved a small pile-o-cash by not having to muck about with a new flywheel... Now, if it used the 130 tooth flywheel... Quote
P-12 Tommy Posted September 16, 2011 Report Posted September 16, 2011 Good find.Not an expert but is the stick not pointing the wrong direction (to the front)? John I thought the same thing.Tom Quote
greg g Posted September 16, 2011 Report Posted September 16, 2011 remember he sourced it from a van, where the seats are forward of where they would be in a car or pickup, so the lever is pointed a bit foward. Ever notice a lever in a Cobra? Quote
John Mulders Posted September 16, 2011 Report Posted September 16, 2011 ok , that explains it ! Thanks Greg John Quote
thrashingcows Posted September 17, 2011 Author Report Posted September 17, 2011 Yes I thought it was weird that the shifter pointed forward. And it was really low too. Not sure if you could have sat straight in the seat AND shifted the tranny at the same time. Wayfarer...will check the flywheel next week to see if it's the 143 Tooth one or not. As for the column shifter....been trying to figure that out. Would love to make it work. Will play around with a spare column I have and see if I can figure something out. All A833OD trannies I have ever seen are an aluminum case, with a cast iron tailshaft. The tailshaft was the only real change over the years...other then a slight 1st gear ratio change for /6 vs V8. Most truck, van and manual shifted M-body cars all got the longer tailshaft with a dual mount location for the shifter. But both mounting locations on the tailshaft were not always drilled and tapped. The F-body cars had a shorter tailshaft, like those in A-bodies, and only had the single mounting location. And all A833OD trannies run the big 5.25"? bearing retainer. And as stated the 3/4 shifter lever on the side of the tranny was flipped to accomplish the 4/3 shift run. Quote
Rusty O'Toole Posted September 17, 2011 Report Posted September 17, 2011 "As for the column shifter....been trying to figure that out. Would love to make it work. Will play around with a spare column I have and see if I can figure something out." Compare the floor shifter mechanism to the column shifter. Would it be possible to modify the column shifter to match the floor shifter, possibly using some floor shifter parts? Or if that fails maybe you could get 4 gears with the column shifter and add another handle under the dash for reverse? Just some ideas off the top of my head without seeing either shifter mechanism. Quote
james curl Posted September 17, 2011 Report Posted September 17, 2011 Mercedes used a column shifted 4 speed in the 50s and 60s. If you can find the data on those it might help you to modify the mechanism to use in your car with the 833. Quote
RobertKB Posted September 17, 2011 Report Posted September 17, 2011 I was taught to drive by my older brother in an old Austin that was my parents' second car. It had a "four on the tree" so they are out there. I was 12, my brother 16. Nice brother! Quote
thrashingcows Posted September 17, 2011 Author Report Posted September 17, 2011 Thanks for the ideas guys. I had the idea of a cable operated reverse, and use the 4 gates in the current column to shift the 4 forward gears. But having a line on a factory 4 on the tree set-up could make things a lot less like re-inventing the wheel. Quote
JerseyHarold Posted September 17, 2011 Report Posted September 17, 2011 Early Saab's also had 4-speed column shifts. My cousin had one in the late sixties. Quote
Dodgeb4ya Posted September 17, 2011 Report Posted September 17, 2011 Hillmans had 4 on the columm too. Quote
John Mulders Posted September 17, 2011 Report Posted September 17, 2011 Pretty sure Renault had 4 speed column shifters The Renault 16 TX I had was equipped with it. John Quote
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