Found my camshaft! - Pulling motor on 1948 Dodge.

[Bryan]

Since it's still 31F and windy outside, I inspected and measured the tappets (I brought inside yesterday). All of the bearing surfaces measured .6235" exactly. Every one of them.  I rejected 6 because they had very slight grooves worn in the sides perpendicular to the vertical axis, which I thought was strange since they move up and down. Also 2 had bad scratches on the bottom.  Got me to thinking I should just go ahead and replace all. Resurfacing at $5 would be $33.  Then 6 new ones at $14 each would be $84, so $117 vs $168 for 12 new ones ($51 difference). Not enough to worry.   Only issue is the condition of the tappet bores.  Will check later when warmer outside.  If smooth and shiny leave like is or buy oversize tappets at VPW and risk the machine shop doing it correctly?  

[Bryan]

Tappet bores seem smooth but hard to tell. Has spiral machine marks but with light underneath it doesn't show a ridge. 

 

 

Edited January 28, 2022 by Bryan

[Bryan]

Measured tappet play in the bores today, 5 were all below .002", might let it go at that, or at least get a couple of new ones to see the difference.

 

Spent a lot of time today cleaning out behind the rear core plug. The dirt out of it IS flammable, and looks oil darkened.  I scraped everything out and burnt the inside with a Map torch trying to dry it out and check for cracks. Did not see any.  I squirted brake cleaner in the oil passage to see if any surface darkened behind the core plug area with moisture..nothing.  Sure hope there's not a crack between the water jacket and oil galley.    

 

Also measured the rear crankshaft thrust bearing. It's .2780" thick. Don't know what's normal.

 

Lastly measure the heads again, wanted to see the thickness between the surface where the gasket sits and where solid metal ends behind the water jacket holes. Measured .4875" on both heads..as close as I could tell. It's definitely less than 0.5". 

[Bryan]

I knew the front and rear oil galley plugs would be difficult from what I read from others but crap..went bad. The rear one is flush with solid metal and no threads contact for about 1/4". Then the threads start the full width of the oil galley.  The front one sticks out some, and is threaded the full length. Heated with a torch and oiled a few times. Tried my impact wrench at 100, then 500 a few times, nothing.   Tried at 700 ft/lbs and the heads exploded.   Oh well. Left hand drilling,  got to the point since I didn't know where the oil galley started or its width so I stopped.  Since the head was split tried to tap it out with a coal chisel, punch etc.  Nope.   Got out my dremel and ground to where threads just started to show, but the stone popped.  I'll get a few others and grind it out.   Been a long day..

[Bryan]

Forgot to ask. Anybody know the size and thread pitch of these oil galley plugs?  Will have to get new ones. Maybe can find different design.

[Merle Coggins]

They should be either 1/4” or 3/8” NPT. I don’t remember exactly. New plugs may have a hex instead of a square drive. 

[Bryan]

Went better today. Use dremel to grind near the threads  of one oil galley plug. Could almost see them. Then used a chisel to roll out the shell. It's bigger than my 9/16" taps. Just need to clean the threads.

[keithb7]

Maybe it's just me, but I get the feeling that this engine is going to fight you the entire way. 

 

Someone taught you patience. Of did you just settle down with age? I'd be tempted to melt that block down by now. Just to get even. Lol.

[Bryan]

1 hour ago, keithb7 said:

Maybe it's just me, but I get the feeling that this engine is going to fight you the entire way. 

 

Someone taught you patience.

If I know something is difficult beforehand I can be patient.  A lot of praying. They must have designed these cars thinking either nobody would ever remove the plugs, or they would be removed every 5 years.   A 5/8 or larger thread with a square plug head with walls less than 1/4" thick.  Sheesh.    I can imagine others have about the same issues, they just don't mention it.  Any way do you know the diameter and thread pitch of these plugs?

[LazyK]

they are pipe plugs (NPT) I believe 3/8x18 NPT any parts store should have them.

FWIW 3/8 pipe is measured ID but has an OD of .675, where as a 5/8x18 NC bolt is .625 OD

 

the smaller one is either 1/8 x 27 NPT  .405 od or 1/4 x 18 NPT .54 od

 

NPT Nominal(national) Pipe thread

Edited February 3, 2022 by LazyK

[Bryan]

Got the 2nd oil galley plug out. Just waiting on a tap thread chaser to arrive in the mail.  Drilled it out starting with smallest bit I had after center punching the head of the plug. Worked up one drill bit at a time until I didn't dare go larger.  Then I started with the Dremel with a tiny tungsten carbide router bit.  (They jump out when they hit an edge, be careful).  When I got close to the threads, I changed over to grinding stones on the Dremel.  More a grind and look, grind and look, doing a little at a time.  When you start seeing the thread spirals then stop.  Sometimes you can start tapping on a top edge and fold a section out. This time that didn't work. Wait for the tap.

 

Also finished drilling out the manifold bolt I was working on before.  The drill bit that came with the tap set surprised me. I had already got threads started at a smaller diameter. Thought I'd carefully start the drill bit and work slowly. Soon as I hit the threads it jerked the bit in all the way. Didn't hurt anything. Used the tap slowly back and forth.  Only thing is I think other bolts have been re-threaded before. After chasing the threads, the bolt was very slightly loose, but got tight at the end (no wobble).   About 3 other bolt holes on the manifold are like that using the same bolt. The others are very tight.

[Bryan]

Threaded the holes today with the tap I got in the mail.   On the last one at the top threads got a little too happy with the grinder.  These 2 plugs are stainless to test it out.. Got some brass ones coming.   Will use teflon yellow tape when I put it back together maybe in a year.

[Bryan]

Today also tried to drive a guide out with a brass punch and 5lb hammer. Nope. Didn't want to push it.

Edited February 20, 2022 by Bryan

[Bryan]

Tried again with the 5lb hammer to remove the valve guides. That's about as much as I want to push it.  No go.  Had to work on my truck (92 Dodge Dakota) today to get it road worthy

[Bryan]

Yesterday turned the block upside down and filled the valve area with brake fluid to soak the bottom of the valve guides. Someone said it was a good part loosener.  If my brother is at home going to use his air compressor with the $14 air hammer head I bought on Wednesday to drive the guides out.   

[Sniper]

Brake fluid worked for me when I was getting stuck valves out, never tried it on the guides though. 

[Conn47D24]

Special tool for guides, or an air hammer tool.

[Bryan]

Well that was a bust.  Only got 3 out.  The HF air hammer didn't do it. Was even running it above the max 90 psi at times.  The heads of the guides were slowly shattering and would break off even with the port floor.  I used the air hammer on one that started breaking up in the bore. It drove it out in pieces.  I used the guide driver with my 5 lb hammer that got 2 out, but I was afraid to hit harder. Didn't want to crack the block.  This was after torching around the guide, oil, etc. Reckon I'll have the shop do it.

[keithb7]

Still fighting you hey? She won’t give up. 

My guides came out pretty easy with the air hammer and punch tool. Your engine must have a lot more corrosion than I had. 
 

I read somewhere on line where a person  got a couple pieces of steel plate, some high quality threaded rod, nuts, washers. He made a cheap threaded puller and got them out. 

Edited February 12, 2022 by keithb7

[Bryan]

15 minutes ago, keithb7 said:

Still fighting you hey? She won’t give up. 

My guides came out pretty easy with the air hammer and punch tool. Your engine must have a lot more corrosion than I had. 
 

I read somewhere on line where a person  got a couple pieces of steel plate, some high quality threaded rod, nuts, washers. He made a cheap threaded puller and got them out. 

Didn't think of that but that's how I seated a stubborn race on the rear end of my 92 Dodge Dakota.  Maybe I'll try that. Didn't look that corroded where it was inside the bore, but outside was. But that went away fast when the tops started splitting.  I was punching shards thru on one bore where the guide just shattered.  Might try the rods.

[Bryan]

Guide removal went better with using a 5/16-24 grade 8 bolts.  Anything bigger won't fit in the guide. One thing would be buying 4-5 bolts between 4 and 5 inches long. The 6"bolt I used is too long unless you use an old valve guide on top (it was only partially threaded).   I pushed 3 guides down pretty far, but given I was using an old guide topside, I couldn't push past flush at the top.   When 2 came loose they popped loud, scared me, but I remember using a screw to set my pinion race on my 92 Dakota that wouldn't go in, and it popped loud also..   I broke one bolt..did not realize the bottom of the guide had already started hitting the socket underneath. After that was more careful.   Looking back I wish I had started with this screw method, and once I got them moving, switch to the guide tool and air hammer. I had pulverized the tops of a few guides with the air hammer.  Making it harder now. Also I need some hardened steel tube smaller than the guide bore

[Bryan]

Today wasn't feeling so well but I did manage to buy some more 5/16 bolts of different lengths, but could only get 18 pitch instead of 24.  Did order copper/nickel 3/16" brake & 5/16" fuel lines with fittings, plus the stainless steel coil protectors. Nice weather late morning turned into rain in afternoon but didn't feel like messing with guides today.

[Bryan]

Feeling a little better. Weather is warm but slightly windy. Promised my wife I wouldn't overdo it, just would stay out for an hour.  The screw/bolt method definitely works, but you still have to be careful.  If the bolt stops turning, take a punch and whack the head sharply a few times. Don't do it with a hammer directly. You'll distort the head and can't get the socket on. Mine started being difficult, so I started using the punch.  Then try turning it again. Turn it until it tightens, repeat. Once you get the guide moving, if it stops again make sure that the guide isn't binding on the larger socket underneath (the one you're screwing the guide down into).   Also, once the bolt head starts moving down, you have to put something like a small bunch of washers, small nut, or portion of a guide (tapered part) under the bolt head to keep it from sinking where you can't keep the socket wrench on it. (Everything you use has to be smaller than the guide bore.  Satisfied some day I'll get the rest out..

[Bryan]

On 2/8/2022 at 1:37 PM, Bryan said:

Threaded the holes today with the tap I got in the mail.   On the last one at the top threads got a little too happy with the grinder.  These 2 plugs are stainless to test it out.. Got some brass ones coming.   Will use teflon yellow tape when I put it back together maybe in a year.

Another idea hit me for the rear oil plug. Think when I install the rear (inaccessible) threaded plug, I'll also see if I can find a domed core plug of the proper size to tap into the unthreaded part of the hole, with a little fuel tank sealant I have. Whatever would get past the threaded plug would most likely be just a seep, and not pressurized.  

[Bryan]

First day in over a week that I felt better and could work.   Had to put a new thermostat in my 92 Dakota.  Waiting until tomorrow for RTV gasket stuff to fully set up.