What am I missing? Instrument cluster removal

[White Spyder]

I received my wiring harnesses for my 48 Windsor from Rhode Island Wire this week. Took the day off today to do the install. The engine harness went in very smoothly. Now it's time for the dash harness and after being crooked up under the dash I am at a loss.

How do you remove the instrument cluster? I thought I could install the harness while everything was in place but I do not see that happening. I think if I could pull the cluster out just a little bit I should be able to do the removal/ install do the harness. Any help would be appreciated.

[Plymouthy Adams]

did you remove the cylinder nut that retains the high beam indicator..this is the top center mounting hardware

[White Spyder]

At this point the only thing I have removed is the radio. I am not sure what to loosen to get it out. I am assuming that it somehow pulls away from the dash towards the rear of the car. Hate to sound dumb but thought I had better ask here before I brake anything.

[Young Ed]

On a plymouth its the high beam and the choke and throttle cables. Not sure if a Chrysler is the same.

[JerseyHarold]

Is there an oil pipe going up to the gauge?

[White Spyder]

Yes to the oil pipe for pressure.  On the Chrysler there is no manual choke and I do not see where the high beam indicator is attached.

[Plymouthy Adams]

the Chrysler I am not familar with but the Dodge and Plymouth of the era had their top center cluster attachment incorporated with the indicator for high beam that is  mounted above the cluster on the dash...was thinking they would be similar...this position is often overlooked when removing the clusters...

[White Spyder]

A few photos for referance.

 

 

 

 

[RobertKB]

I have rewired a dash for a '47 Chrysler ambulance that our club did as a project for the local fire fighters union. I did the rewire with the dash cluster in place and did not find it too difficult although a bit awkward. If you have not removed the front seat that is the first thing you should do as it makes lying down for access behind the dash much easier. When I took out the old harness I labelled everything and made sure it matched with the wiring harness and instructions I got. I used Y 'n' Z harmess and had very good luck with it. It's finicky and time consuming but it can be done without removing the gauge cluster.

[White Spyder]

Thanks Robert,  I did remove the seat to get better access and comfort.  I think the connection to the body harness is also going to be a challange as the colors on the wires have fadded and they all look somewhat similar.

[White Spyder]

In photo #2 above to the right of the photo is where the harness for the dash goes over the top of the instrument cluster. You can see it coming out in the top left. This is why I think I need to remove the cluster just a bit to make room to remove the old one and tuck in the new one.

I do not want to totally remove the old one then install the new as the colors are faded and it helps to remove and replace as I go.

[BobT-47P15]

 

 

 

[BobT-47P15]

 

I appears there are four bolt holes in the housing that secure the entire works to the dash.  These pictures I lifted from an eBay ad seem to show

those holes best.   I don't know if a bolt goes thru these holes, or if there is a stud and nut arrangement.  I would think that loosening whatever

goes thru these holes should loosen the dash pod as you wish to do.    Just my take on the deal.     

[Dodgeb4ya]

It is a stud and 3/8" nut (4) that holds the cluster in.

Not a fun job. Access is terrible!

I've done several complete C38/C39 wiring harness jobs...but dash out on complete resto jobs.

A pic of the back of my c39 original dash and wiring barely showing one of the nut and studs lower left marked in red.

Bob

[White Spyder]

Thanks all. I found the 4 nuts and to remove the cluster Saturday evening It would require alot mor items behind the dash to come off to be able to remove it. I have worked at this over the weekend but could only work for about an hour or so at a wack. I had to take some long brakes to get the kinks out of my neck and back! Got most of it in but only by connecting a bit of the new and then cutting the old wires back to the group. I was finallly able to slie the bundle past the curve at the top of the temp guage. There was enough slack in the new harness to work it back in bit by bit.

The other hard part of theis project was matching the right wires as most of the colors had faded to a tanish color. The wire size and tracers (I could tell the difference between the black and white ones) and connectors were a big help. I have to replace a door plunger and then hook the power back up before I can do any testing. Hopefully I can make the parts tonight and report back in the morning

Got things hooked up start another thread with results of the re-wire. Please check it out.

Edited May 19, 2015 by White Spyder

[Dodgeb4ya]

I think the only correct working way is to remove the dash. I would say  DO NOT SPLICE  the new wires to the old faded wires.

You need to use the factory wiring diagram as a back up and take your time. A week if need be.

 

With the dash pulled apart and layed on its face in the car you can carefully and correctly rewire all the electrical fixed to the dash.. 

[White Spyder]

I think the only correct working way is to remove the dash. I would say  DO NOT SPLICE  the new wires to the old faded wires.

You need to use the factory wiring diagram as a back up and take your time. A week if need be.

 

With the dash pulled apart and layed on its face in the car you can carefully and correctly rewire all the electrical fixed to the dash.. 

I did not splice any of the new wires. The harness is new and in tact. What I did was cut out the old stiff wires to get the old harness out and make room for the new harness. I have the diagrams but they are generic. I found this out while having a discussion with the technician at Rhode Island Wire. They also sent diagrams of which wires by color connected to areas. Where I thing I failed is being able to determine the old wire colors due to fading. For example the dash to body connector. There are 6 wires there that plug into a block.

[Dodgeb4ya]

Glad to hear you didn't cut up the new harness!

 

I try to determine faded cloth wire colors by going further along a wire and using a razor blade scraping the cloth wire covering lightly to see if I can bring out some of the original color..

Or by following the wire into the original factory taped harness area ...slitting it open and then try to find and see the original color of the wire.

 

The wire diagram in the factory shop manual shows all the correct wire colors and exactly where they go.

 

There are three production serial # changes that are not shown in the wire diagrams. IE horn relay location changed... starter button moved... turn signal and high beam indicator light locations moved ect.

 

It does seem like your issue is at the black six pin body connector.

 

I'm currently working on a 1935 chryler CW Airflow installing a complete new harness..a very complicated harness as the car is a limosine and has a lot of accessory equipment. The colors of the wires and what they connect to are generally the same as your C38 chrysler and even a say 300D Chrysler!

Mopar wire colors and what they go to have been the same for years!

 

You will get it figured out!

Bob

Edited May 19, 2015 by Dodgeb4ya