Hello guys! New here with my 52 Plymouth..

[Tony724]

Please be pateint with me guys. I am trying to learn this 6V positive ground system, this is new to me.

 

Okay, "Update".....I finally had the time, and installed my new 6 Volt Optima battery. I also put all new 1 gauge cables on.

Both battery cables on, and also a new one from the starter to the solenoid.

 

I also put a new coil on.."Photo Below". I didn't try to start it though. Theres a reason.

 

Is this 6V coil okay? It says No external resistor required...Is that okay???

The 12V one I removed said "External resistor required". Obviously the 12V the guy threw on because thats all he had around.

 

This guy who had the car before, really played with the wiring.

 

He had the +side of the coil going to ignition, and the -side going to the dizzy? Isn't this backwards?

 

Shouldn't the coil +side be connected to the distributor and the - side connected to the ignition or power side for a 6V positive ground system?

 

The odd things is, I have a video clip of this car running, wired to a 12V battery and I think wired wrong at the dizzy, before I bought it??

 

i am also wondering if the "aftermarket" ignition switch is wired wrong too?

 

Here's the aftermarket coil I bought. I don't understand the resistor thing.

 

Edited April 3, 2015 by Tony724

[Dave72dt]

That coil will work fine, no resistor required, and yes, on a positive ground system the positive terminal of the coil is supposed to go the distributor.

[Tony724]

That coil will work fine, no resistor required, and yes, on a positive ground system the positive terminal of the coil is supposed to go the distributor.

 

Okay, I thought so on the coil, thank you!

I need to check the aftermarket ignition switch, since it doesn't work right.

It seemed to start and run, "as my friend told me", after you let off the "start position". It will not start in the starting position.

Is there a simple diagram for the ignition switch that I can be assured that it is done properly? Before I try and start it?

Edited April 3, 2015 by Tony724

[Dave72dt]

That sounds like the ign circuit is not  getting power in start mode.  check your starter solenoid small  terminals,  If you have 2 small terminals on it, 1 will activate the solenoid, the other one provides power to the ignition circuit while in the start mode.

[Tony724]

That sounds like the ign circuit is not  getting power in start mode.  check your starter solenoid small  terminals,  If you have 2 small terminals on it, 1 will activate the solenoid, the other one provides power to the ignition circuit while in the start mode.

 

My solenoid only has one little terminal on it.

A smaller red factory wire that goes into the harness, but I don't see it coming out anywhere at all?. I see a thicker wire, on the side that the battery cable bolts to, they go into the harness together, and it goes to that block on the firewall, next to the regulator.

But the thin red wire on the little stud on the solenoid does not come out anywhere. I am going to cut that harness open tomorrow, and see if it was cut off.

 

This photo below. whatever this block does with the arrow going to it.He spliced that green wire on, and I think the red wire where it is spliced onto goes into a harness and appears to go to the coil. I will know when I cut the harness open tomorrow.

Edited April 3, 2015 by Tony724

[Labrauer]

Welcome to the forum Tony. That's a nice looking car Tony I am sure that you will have a lot of fun working on it when the time comes. Just have a lot of passion with the car as it is old and old stuff needs a lot of tender loving care. There is nothing like driving an old car down the road looking at the people and their eyes seeing a part of history on the road beside them. You will get a lot of thumbs up as people pass you on the road. I have two 48 Plymouths one coupe and a four door sedan. The sedan I just finished putting all new brake lines and a new system. I have all the interior out of the sedan too to redo it but now my main project now is getting the coupe back on the road. I am doing an over haul on the coupes engine and putting an R10 overdrive in it. Here are a couple of pics of the cars today. There are a lot of wise people on this forum that will help you any way they can. And remember there are not stupid questions as we have all been there from time to time.

 

Good luck with the rebuild.

Larry

 

[RobertKB]

 

My solenoid only has one little terminal on it.

A smaller red factory wire that goes into the harness, but I don't see it coming out anywhere at all?. I see a thicker wire, on the side that the battery cable bolts to, they go into the harness together, and it goes to that block on the firewall, next to the regulator.

But the thin red wire on the little stud on the solenoid does not come out anywhere. I am going to cut that harness open tomorrow, and see if it was cut off.

 

This photo below. whatever this block does with the arrow going to it.He spliced that green wire on, and I think the red wire where it is spliced onto goes into a harness and appears to go to the coil. I will know when I cut the harness open tomorrow.

 

Horn relay.

Edited April 3, 2015 by RobertKB

[Dave72dt]

That smaller red wire should be the wire that activates the solenoid.  The thicker  wire fastened to the main terminal along with the cable from the battery is your main power feed into the instrument panel, etc.  Did your car have a key switch and push button for starting or was the start on the key switch, like modern cars?  How many terminals on your aftermarket switch and how is it wired up?

[Tony724]

Welcome to the forum Tony. That's a nice looking car Tony I am sure that you will have a lot of fun working on it when the time comes. Just have a lot of passion with the car as it is old and old stuff needs a lot of tender loving care. There is nothing like driving an old car down the road looking at the people and their eyes seeing a part of history on the road beside them. You will get a lot of thumbs up as people pass you on the road. I have two 48 Plymouths one coupe and a four door sedan. The sedan I just finished putting all new brake lines and a new system. I have all the interior out of the sedan too to redo it but now my main project now is getting the coupe back on the road. I am doing an over haul on the coupes engine and putting an R10 overdrive in it. Here are a couple of pics of the cars today. There are a lot of wise people on this forum that will help you any way they can. And remember there are not stupid questions as we have all been there from time to time.

 

Good luck with the rebuild.

Larry

 

thanks Larry. I am very excited about this car. I have owned quite a few cars from the 60's and 70's. But this is my first 50's car. I am still learning, but hopefully will all work out right in the end. I love the dash and design look of these cars. Thanks again for the welcome, it is very appreciated!

 

Horn relay.

 

Thank you. I have no idea why he has a aftermarket wire hooked onto this horn relay. i will have to chase it under the dash. I hope its not hooked to the new ignition switch. He did some odd things on here.

 

That smaller red wire should be the wire that activates the solenoid.  The thicker  wire fastened to the main terminal along with the cable from the battery is your main power feed into the instrument panel, etc.  Did your car have a key switch and push button for starting or was the start on the key switch, like modern cars?  How many terminals on your aftermarket switch and how is it wired up?

 

I will slice the harness open, and see where this little red wire goes from the solenoid.

I imagine that should be going from the ignition starter position on the switch to the solenoid?

It appears it was cut off, unless I can't see it.

The thicker wire along the battery cable on the solenoid appears to go to that horn relay on the firewall.

 

No push button, just regular ignition switch. Unless he changed it. There's an after aftermarket switch, instead of a factory Mopar key set up. Like a cheap advance auto one. I don't see where there would have been a push button though.

i will check the back of the switch this morning here, and report back on my findings.

It did run before, so thats a good thing. however, he had it all hooked odd, to make it run.

[doctor dirt]

Not sure about your year but my 49' had a relay set up to the right of the radiator looking into the engine compartment. Those take some abuse because of the location so double check the connections there. Your horn line will run down the column then back up to the fire wall. There are replacements if the relay happens to be bad.

 

Nice car, plenty of potential not a bad idea to get into the plug holes and check compression once you get your battery and battery cables rigged up. The heavy duty cables are a must for 6V cars. Take your time and cover all your mechanics before any cosmetics. Theres alot of stuff out here for these cars and this site has a retail

section and theres alot of help there. Bernbaum is a great source for some parts they helped me with a coupler set up and other odds & ends.

Good luck Doc.

[Tony724]

Thank you Doctor dirt! I messed around today, will be making a post here next. I have to learn that people before ya get a car, do really odd things!

[Tony724]

Okay, here is what I found. Bare with me, I have no idea how this car was running before.

But it really did when my buddy sold it to me. He did NOT do all the stupidity that went on, he bought it that way, and decided to sale it without even messing with it. Due to some family issues. But he moved the car around a few times in his driveway, and it ran.

I did not like the 12V battery in it, hooked up the wrong way, and the 12V coil, and once again, was hooked up wrong.

It was hooked up 12V positive battery. But it ran before. But....Not Now!

I checked the universal ignition switch.

I did buy a 6 volt battery, made it positive ground, all new cables, and hooked the 6V coil up properly, with the help from you guys.

 

Here's a follows:

 

Start on the ignition switch goes to the little connector on the solenoid.

 

Batt on the ignition switch goes to the battery hook up on the Voltage Regulator.

 

Ignition terminal on the ignition switch is a double wire coming off of the lead, I think its labeled #16 wire, thick gray color.

However, that wire splits off, "double wire", one goes to the fuel gauge, and the other is snipped, and goes nowhere??? What the heck? How did it run before?

It honestly did though!!!

 

The green wire that was hooked up to the horn relay, "previous owner, aftermarket wire", was hooked to the accessory on the switch? I don't get that one either. I am officially confused. Obviously it won't start for me though.

Did this green wire going to the acc on the ignition switch to the horn relay, somehow make it run? I never heard of this before.

 

Also....side note! I was trying to crank it before I knew about the wiring mess. I touched the cable from the solenoid to the starter, and burned my fingers on the solenoid end of the cable. The cable and terminal on the solenoid was extremely hot after cranking it. Unless that is normal?

The other side of the solenoid was fine that goes to the battery.

 

Here's where the green wire he had hooked to the acc on the ignition switch was hooked up on the horn relay. Bottom left of the relay as pictured.

 

Edited April 3, 2015 by Tony724

[TodFitch]

 

. . . Also....side note! I was trying to crank it before I knew about the wiring mess. I touched the cable from the solenoid to the starter, and burned my fingers on the solenoid end of the cable. The cable and terminal on the solenoid was extremely hot after cranking it. Unless that is normal?

Not normal. High temperatures on wires, switches, junctions, etc. is an indication of high resistance that should not be there.

[Tony724]

Not normal. High temperatures on wires, switches, junctions, etc. is an indication of high resistance that should not be there.

 

If I have the key in the ON position, it doesn't get hot. Only when cranking. This whole thing is a nightmare...

[Dave72dt]

From your description of what you've found, I think it would be wise to procure a wiring diagram, ohm meter and test light and rewire the car correctly.

You should have power to the coil when the switch is in the run position and in the start position. You can disconnect the red wire from the solenoid, turn the switch to start and there should be power at the coil. Removing the red wire will prevent the starter from engaging when turning the key. You may just have a defective key switch. You can test the same scenario at the switch if you want. If it works at the switch and not at the coil, you've narrowed down the area you need to look at.

[Dave72dt]

Clean and inspect the cable and terminals that's getting hot.

[Tony724]

From your description of what you've found, I think it would be wise to procure a wiring diagram, ohm meter and test light and rewire the car correctly.

You should have power to the coil when the switch is in the run position and in the start position. You can disconnect the red wire from the solenoid, turn the switch to start and there should be power at the coil. Removing the red wire will prevent the starter from engaging when turning the key. You may just have a defective key switch. You can test the same scenario at the switch if you want. If it works at the switch and not at the coil, you've narrowed down the area you need to look at.

 

I did find a wiring diagram online, its like looking at a puzzle. ugh!

I am confused with the +ground system. In the ON position, which side of the coil should have power?

Do you know where the IGN wire on the switch goes to? He snipped it off. I am not sure where that goes. I was thinking one of the terminals on the coil?

He did put a universal switch on, and when he was starting it, he would crank it to starting position, and would have to let it go to the ON position, for it to actually start. Which is odd.

Then having a wire running from the one port on the horn relay, to the ACC on the ignition switch was odd. Somehow he got it run though, hooked up the wrong way the the 12 volt. Am I too old to cry right now? 

Edited April 4, 2015 by Tony724

[JerseyHarold]

These aren't the most complicated electrical systems.  Take a deep breath.  The car will run.

 

Quick and dirty way to start the engine:   IMPORTANT:  MAKE SURE TRANS IS IN NEUTRAL, PULL UP HAND BRAKE AND CHOCK WHEELS  so car won't move when you crank it.  A helper stepping on the clutch and pumping the gas pedal as needed wouldn't hurt.   Disconnect negative wire from ignition coil (assuming positive ground battery hookup).  Leave wire from other terminal on coil that runs down to distributor connected.  Connect remote starter switch to negative (ungrounded) battery terminal and to small terminal on starter relay.  Make a jumper wire using alligator clips and connect from ungrounded battery terminal to the negative terminal on the coil.  You now have electricity going to the ignition points via the coil and a way to crank the engine.  When  you press the push button on the remote switch the engine should crank, and since you have juice to the points the engine should start.  If any wires start getting hot you have other issues to look for and correct.  Hope this helps.

[Tony724]

These aren't the most complicated electrical systems.  Take a deep breath.  The car will run.

 

Quick and dirty way to start the engine:   IMPORTANT:  MAKE SURE TRANS IS IN NEUTRAL, PULL UP HAND BRAKE AND CHOCK WHEELS  so car won't move when you crank it.  A helper stepping on the clutch and pumping the gas pedal as needed wouldn't hurt.   Disconnect negative wire from ignition coil (assuming positive ground battery hookup).  Leave wire from other terminal on coil that runs down to distributor connected.  Connect remote starter switch to negative (ungrounded) battery terminal and to small terminal on starter relay.  Make a jumper wire using alligator clips and connect from ungrounded battery terminal to the negative terminal on the coil.  You now have electricity going to the ignition points via the coil and a way to crank the engine.  When  you press the push button on the remote switch the engine should crank, and since you have juice to the points the engine should start.  If any wires start getting hot you have other issues to look for and correct.  Hope this helps.

Thank you! I will need to grab a remote starter, I don't have one handy. I do know the engine runs. Of course I have no idea how it did before the way it was hooked up. I was hoping to figure out where this ignition wire hooked up. I thought the -side of the coil. But looking at a wiring diagram is aweful, at least for me.

[Tony724]

Okay, I hooked my IGN on the switch to the horn relay, that also goes to the coil.
I am sure thats right according to the wiring diagram. Then again, I could be wrong.

Still no start!! Ugh!! this car ran before it got towed here, I even have a film clip of it running, when it was hooked up wrong the 12V positive way.

I figured I would check for fuel, the filter is quite clogged, but flowing fuel still. I disconnected the fuel line to carb, and cranked it. The fuel is pumping out slowly. I can barely blow through the filter. I think it may be restricting full pressure.

I pulled the carb, and theres a bunch of gas laying down inside the intake? I don't think thats normal??

 

Here's the fuel that pumped out of the tube. The tank was empty. I had put 5 gallon of fresh fuel in. There is a darker color laying on the bottom of the bottle, and lighter layer on the top of the fuel, never saw that before.

Edited April 4, 2015 by Tony724

[DJ194950]

fuel separated from the Water!

 

Looks like time to pull the tank drain plug and clean out.

Remove the fuel line from the tank and blow it out backwards. Open carb as it surely has water in it which will block the jets and clean out/rebuild. Replace fuel filter as it must be full of water also.

Clean plugs as they get fouled by water.

 

More to do yet but all needs to be done for reliable running car.

 

Good luck.

[Tony724]

fuel separated from the Water!

 

Looks like time to pull the tank drain plug and clean out.

Remove the fuel line from the tank and blow it out backwards. Open carb as it surely has water in it which will block the jets and clean out/rebuild. Replace fuel filter as it must be full of water also.

Clean plugs as they get fouled by water.

 

More to do yet but all needs to be done for reliable running car.

 

Good luck.

 

Yeah, I have more ahead of me than I thought. I am truly still amazed that his car was running just weeks before I bought it. Puzzled!