Anyone ever try a 4x4 T5?

[41/53dodges]

It seems in this neck of the woods it's pretty difficult to find a T5, more so one in an S10, and even more so one that's 2WD! So I wonder, with some minor modifications could a 4x4 with it's transfer case be wedged in under the truck? It wouldn't be too hard to shorten the tail housing on the trans, and certainly has it's perks...

If you are wondering, why is Josh asking an overcomplicated question about installing unnecessary hardware?

-They are cheaper

-They are much more common

-Transfer cases tend to offer cable drives, or are easier to get that way

-They tend to have high/low range, good for putting around the yard or going against a bulldozer in a tug-of-war

-If I ever decide to make a 4x4 half the work is already done!

 

So the question here is, how long can the transmission be before it hits something? Like the fuel tank for example!

Edited November 18, 2013 by 41/53dodges

[41/53dodges]

So nothing? Not even any ideas?

Edited November 20, 2013 by 41/53dodges

[NiftyFifty]

Way different trans, and sounds like a nightmare for installation and bracing vs a plain 2wd t5. I wouldn't say their easier to find, more difficult in my mind. I'm sure there's room, but ever going to a 4x4 would be massive amounts of fab work and messing around and if your rear diff isn't matching then you'd damage everything. Do some searching and more calling for a 2wd T5, it would be better to pay an extra $100 in shipping then all the messing to make a 4x4 fit and you'd need a 2wd one to stitch tail housings so no further ahead. Not trying to burst bubbles, but IMO its the wrong direction for a good driver. I've seen a bunch up here for sale, but they are starting to fade away.

[41/53dodges]

Around here I only find later electric models or 4x4 ones, never a nice s10 2wd with mechanical speedo. i can grab the 4x4 ones for $100 with their case, or around $500 for a 2wd version. Thats my motive here. Massive pain, but its the problem of cost and availability. Not saying to definately build a 4x4, just to use the parts available.

[RobRobitaille]

Could use an electronic speedo one and just change the speedo.

[41/53dodges]

Once again, cost factor comes in. Dont the digital dashes cost around 500+?

[NiftyFifty]

I was sure you could remove the electronic sensor and replace it with a gear and adapter from a normal manual tranny? If not, as I say...start hunting out of your area and avoid the big brand name wreckers if possible. $500 seems a lot for a T5, and I'm not sure when you hit the newer versions if everything stays the same for sizes etc? Not sure if want a free wheeling transfer case there all the time, somehow I see it causing more issues especially come install time

[41/53dodges]

Cable drives were last used in 1987, then there were a select few that worked as you describe that can be switched, but they quickly switched to a design that cannot be converted. There arent too many good old wrecking yards around here except the one with the 4x4 trannies, and thats all they have for t5.

[Jeff Balazs]

I think there are probably several ways around the speedo issue. I had a sports car that I drove for years with a broken speedo. I knew exactly how fast I was going just using the tach. And I never got pulled over using it.

The speedo in my pilothouse isn't anywhere near accurate .........I have changed the rear axle from a 4.10 to a 3.55. It is easy enough to run some measured miles  and calculate actual speed at a given rpm or speedo reading and then just add a couple of reference marks.

 

Or there are probably cheap Gps units out there that could be used?

Just a couple of ideas.....I am sure there are other ways as well.

 

Jeff

[TodFitch]

How does the electronic speedometer take off on that era transmission work?

 

If I recall correctly, the electronic speedometer on my '91 Jeep Cherokee actually had an adaptor screwed into the transmission for the sensor. And where it screwed in it looked identical to the older mechanical cable based setups. Looked like you could just pop off the electronic sensor and hook up a cable.

 

But that could have been a mistaken impression on my part. Or it could have been a transitional way of doing things that did not last long. But there is a chance that speedometer setups could be a non-issue.

 

And as pointed out, a GPS unit or a smart phone with a GPS app will get you a very accurate speed regardless of your gearing or tire size.

[Plymouthy Adams]

if anything like the GM auto's..the very tail shaft sender is exchangeable between electro and mechanical in about 15 minutes max..

[RobRobitaille]

I have been researching converting the electronic T5 to mechanical but haven't found a way to do it as of yet. There are some cheap aftermarket speedometers that will work with the GM sending unit and can be calibrated with any gear ratio. One if the biggest issues I see with the T5 is the loss of your parking brake unless you swap the rear end for one with wheel mechanical brake.

 

Here are some pics of the electronic T5 speedo unit maybe one of you will have an idea if how to convert it!    

[wayfarer]

How does the electronic speedometer take off on that era transmission work?

 

If I recall correctly, the electronic speedometer on my '91 Jeep Cherokee actually had an adaptor screwed into the transmission for the sensor. And where it screwed in it looked identical to the older mechanical cable based setups. Looked like you could just pop off the electronic sensor and hook up a cable.

 

But that could have been a mistaken impression on my part. Or it could have been a transitional way of doing things that did not last long. But there is a chance that speedometer setups could be a non-issue.

 

And as pointed out, a GPS unit or a smart phone with a GPS app will get you a very accurate speed regardless of your gearing or tire size.

 

MotherMopar was light years ahead of the game by keeping the housing the same as the mech units. For the AX15 swaps I have been involved in it is just a simple matter to plug in a TF gear assembly. GM folks seem to like doing things the hard way...

[Plymouthy Adams]

yes..unlike the mopar insert from outside the GM requires removal of the tailshaft..at least on the auto unit...not hard...especially if out of the car/truck

[41/53dodges]

This is the problem with T5 swaps, the speedometer. GM had to do things the hard way for sure... now if there were a good alternative to cable drive other than the $300+ cable-x units, then we could have something!

[HanksB3B]

I think there are probably several ways around the speedo issue. I had a sports car that I drove for years with a broken speedo. I knew exactly how fast I was going just using the tach. And I never got pulled over using it.

The speedo in my pilothouse isn't anywhere near accurate .........I have changed the rear axle from a 4.10 to a 3.55. It is easy enough to run some measured miles  and calculate actual speed at a given rpm or speedo reading and then just add a couple of reference marks.

 

Or there are probably cheap Gps units out there that could be used?

Just a couple of ideas.....I am sure there are other ways as well.

 

Jeff

 

There were interghangeable speedometer cable gear drive ratios available. Research, a PHD in mathematics, eBay and the luck of the Irish would be required.

 

Hank 

Edited November 21, 2013 by HanksB3B

[41/53dodges]

There were interghangeable speedometer cable gear drive ratios available. Research, a PHD in mathematics, eBay and the luck of the Irish would be required.

Hank

The issue isn't finding the right ratio, the issue is finding a cable driven one to begin with! Most after 87' are electric drive and cannot readily be converted. So the luck of the irish is still pretty helpful here! Edited November 21, 2013 by 41/53dodges

[Don Coatney]

Is the tailshaft on a non world class 4WD T-5 the same as the tailshaft on a non world class 2WD T-5? If so it may be possible to swap the tailshaft (where the speedo gear resides) from a 4WD to a later model 2WD. Could also possibly upgrade to a world class transmission as I believe the tail shafts are interchangable.

 

Perhaps Gear Rhonda has the answer

 

click here------>  http://www.5speeds.com/rhonda.html

[NiftyFifty]

Is the tailshaft on a non world class 4WD T-5 the same as the tailshaft on a non world class 2WD T-5? If so it may be possible to swap the tailshaft (where the speedo gear resides) from a 4WD to a later model 2WD. Could also possibly upgrade to a world class transmission as I believe the tail shafts are interchangable.

 

Perhaps Gear Rhonda has the answer

 

click here------>  http://www.5speeds.com/rhonda.html

Chances of finding just a tail shaft are pretty slim, if you had a 2wd to rob from you might as well just use the whole trans. T5 is a great little trans, their pretty bullet proof from all the ones I've seen. One wrecked one I've come across was mine because the dealer told me to put the wrong oil in it.

[Don Coatney]

I have the pictured T-5 sitting in my garage. I spent a lot of money on new internal parts for this gearbox only to find out after I rebuilt it and installed in my car that the main gearbox shell is worn beyond repair. So I found another T-5 that was good to go and installed it saving this one for parts. I may someday mate this tailshaft to a world class T-5 as they have more flexable gear ratios than the granny gear in my non world class T-5.

 

 

 

 

[40desoto]

Don, S10 5 speed with Mechanical speedo run for about $700- 750  in my area.   When I call wrecking yards they swear they have them but when I arrive they are electrical speedo.

 

I was looking at some of your work on the T5 install.  what cluctch do you use ?   Im assuming you used the same pressure plate?

 

 

Do you want to trade a T5 speeds for a 727 tranny with a flathead adapter?  ..  LOL  cheers!   The engine and extra parts look great.

[Don Coatney]

Clutch disc is S-10, Perssure plate is P-15 Pilot bearing is my custom design.

 

 

[Drifter99]

If the speedo is not the concern what years t5 would fit? I have been hunting 82-87 with little luck. I am finishing up installing a 3:55 out of a 1996 jeep so I was thinking the speedo wouldn't be correct anyway so i am going off a Tac or speed. I am heading to Daytona Turkey run next week maybe one to be had there. Hoping to see some PH trucks also !!

[41/53dodges]

Without concern for speedometer, I think any s10 with a v6 would work, but I'm not 100% sure there...

[Drifter99]

If the speedo is not the concern what years t5 would fit? I have been hunting 82-87 with little luck. I am finishing up installing a 3:55 out of a 1996 jeep so I was thinking the speedo wouldn't be correct anyway so i am going off a Tac or speed. I am heading to Daytona Turkey run next week maybe one to be had there. Hoping to see some PH trucks also !!