48 Dodge 2dr

[stechbody]

We are a technical college Auto Collision program that received a 48 Dodge as a donation. Due to the general good condition of this disassembled car we have decided to keep it to use for program promotion.

We need it to be driven by any college employee as it will be taken to high schools and county fairs. It must be driven all winter so we will likely blast, epoxy prime and bedliner the frame and underside. An aftermarket A/C setup will be used.

My thoughts, I'm the instructor, are to build a mild small block Chevy with the machining done in our school's Engine Machining class. Engine buildup would be by the auto class. A 700R4 overdrive auto trans has been donated and rebuilt by the Auto 2 class. The plan is to have the Welding class assist with fabricating mounts.

My questions are: Is the front suspension design adaquate for everyday use by many people? We plan on the shock mount upgrade, anything else suggested?

What are options for disc brakes? We prefer OEM parts from a salvage yard due to cost.

What about the rear axle? Will it handle a basically stock SBC? What are some options for upgrades?

Steering column and gear upgrades?

Any other suggestions?

We are also accepting tax deductable donations that include your name in the school paper (copy sent to you) and your name on the show board displayed with the car if desired.

[greg g]

We would probably prefer you kept it a MOPAR powertrain but since you have the GM OD trans that I guess is a big determining factor.

Front shocks a couple of Ford F100 mounts will bolt or weld to the frame. Then use shocks or the rear of an Dart or Valiant A body car, Check rustyhope.com for a front disc mounting adaptors. The stock rear is plenty stout enough for he SBC however with the trans swap you will loose the parking brake, it's transmission mounted on early mopars. So you can use a MOPAR b body (charger satelite etc.) rear axle assembly or one from an early Jeep cherokee, either one will give you the parking brake deal and require only a relocation of the spring perches. You will of course need a new drive shaft. Early Jeep Cherokee rear ends are 3.55 gears, if you can find a 2wd drive in 80% of the applications it will have limited slip, a plus for MN winters.

A Cavalier rack and pinion PS unit can be added fairly easily.

Glad you found this forum, Pictures??? progress reports, and posts from the students would be a great thing. Welcome and good luck.

You may also want to rewire. these cars were fairly basic with a 30 AMP circuit breaker and one fuse located on the headlamp switch. the radio if it has one may also have and inline fuse, but that probably it. Original elecrical system is 6V positive, so if you switch over, you will need to address the Amp gauge and the fuel gauge.

[Don Coatney]

It is really good to see a D-24 as a school class project. My personal opinion is installing a cookie cutter engine is not the best way to go. Is the original engine available? I personally have a flathead Mopar Desoto engine installed im my 1948 Plymouth and it is hopped up with dual everything and a lumpy cam. I live in Tennessee and drive my car year round including long road trips (Tulsa, Oklahoma, Detroit, Michigan, Charolette, North Carolina, Southern Georgia) and all states in between. As I said this is just my opinion.

[greg g]

Poor fellow said it will be driven by any college employee. Probably a bunch of ham fisted akademics, with no knowledge of cars with no power steering, no automatic, no cruise control, no cup holders, no cell phone thingies, no AC, so I can see the need for the modern upgrades and the belly button motor.

Hey its another old MOPAR on the road.

[greg g]

Gentleman your responses look like they are formated to the POC forum specs. Where has all the openmindness, your car do what you want, welcome abord gone???

[WatchingWolf]

I have found a valuable resource in renting a postal box and signing up for as many restoration parts catalogs as I can find for free or low cost. There are often exploded views, part descriptions, part numbers and fabricated mounts and brackets pictured that can be gleaned and constructed myself as well as

price several price options from all the suppliers. The rented box keeps the junk mail to a minimum at home.

[steveplym]

Poor fellow said it will be driven by any college employee. Probably a bunch of ham fisted akademics, with no knowledge of cars with no power steering, no automatic, no cruise control, no cup holders, no cell phone thingies, no AC, so I can see the need for the modern upgrades and the belly button motor.

Hey its another old MOPAR on the road.

I agree with you Greg. Plus there are probably lots of donations there as well. When I went to auto body school at a junior college in the nineties we did project cars there too. All the parts, engine, paint, etc was donated. A whole lot easier and cheaper to donate a 350 motor and build it with all the bolt on parts.

Plus this is where the industry is going. If these students are going to work in hot rod shops they need to know the basics of upgrading to a common V8 motor used in street rods today. Gotta teach them what other people are demanding. I love my flathead and everyone's cars on here, but due to practicality I understand why they are going this route.

If I was to build a street rod for my wife to drive everyday I would probably go this route too. She doesn't know much about cars and if there were any problems she would want them to be fixed right away. If I was available to help or not. That is the same with these college students.

[Merle Coggins]

Which Tech school are you with in SW Wisc? Your project sounds like a good one for your students, with several departments sharing in the development. I'm in SE Wisc. but if I can help out somehow I will.

Like others here I cringe at the thought of another SBC motor in a Dodge car. I've been a long time Mopar lover and would like to see them kept all Mopar. But I also understand the need to keep costs down and work with what you already have.

I would also like to echo what someone else already said. Please keep us posted on the car's progress. And posts from the students would also be great.

Merle

[stechbody]

I am a little surprised by the negative comments. I am a regular at a Chevy Nova site and have never seen negatives like this, they believe it is your car, do what makes you happy.

However, I believe it is your house, your rules and am not too thin skinned to read the posts.

The students WERE polled, they did not want it stock. I should not have writen "my thoughts" it should have been in third person. I'm a technician not an English teacher. I did forbid them from considering a Honda engine, so I guess that we be "one guy..only this way".

The school has a problem with the students posting freely when my Email is attached, thus I post for them. They see what is written. It is a fresh group every August but some decisions can't be reversed if the next group had different ideas.

Mr Adams, they are not too stupid to make decisions and perform the work, but they certainly do not have the skills (yet) or the time and finances to randomly experiment with suspension and brake designs or retrofits. Are they to try building something by guessing only to have it fail on the road with a fatality the result? I think not. They should be taught to do some research and use other's knowledge to guide to help them reach a goal. Don't rethink the wheel everytime but also look for improvements and solve problems that come up when doing the work. THAT is why we posted here. Isn't that part of why anyone posts here?

Assistance does not have to be funds, a small part that someone has 3-4 of and we have none can make a big deal to us.

It makes more sense from a driveability standpoint to have it more modern.

From a financial standpoint a SBC 350 is the cheapest route to take. Rebuild kits are far cheaper. Fewer raffle tickets need to be sold to buy the kit. When you explain to them that you can use a Mopar engine but you need to raise "X" amount more funds, they do not have the brand loyalty you all have and opt for the less expensive engine which equals less fundraising. Working on the car is the fun part, raising funds is not.

We got one SBC free, noone was stepping up with a Mopar or Ford. I had three 350's to give and we had four others offered by school employees. The engine machining shop is set up best for a SBC because they are the most common. Most agreed that once you move beyond the original engine, the brand of modern engine is not important.

We can incorporate the Performance class in flowing the heads and have only SBC plates for the flowbench. Even though flowing is not necassary we want to incorporate as many students as possible to give them all a piece of the action.

There will be no billet on it, unless someone gives us some,then it will be blasted and painted. I was surprised at how many thought billet was outdated, as do I.

Greg G, not sure about the ham fisted part, it will be some young ladies used to driving minivans !!! Unfortunately we have no choice but to make it accessable to others on campus. This is definately not my first choice.

Although I like street rods, even more I like to see original old cars. Make a street rod out of the "cookie cutter" Model A's that you already see in restored condition. Restore the "odd balls" you don't see everyday. I love history. We do not have the funds in my program to restore the car and keep it for our own use. Some school funds will be used which means they have to see some use out of it which brings us to the modern parts. If the program had the money and I or the students had the time to go to the high schools and fairs, it would be original.

The Auto Tech class was also not interested in working on an old flathead, they preferred an injected engine but we compromised on a carb engine.

They teach in units so if they are on the auto trans unit and we need engine work (tune up, engine miss, etc) they won't do it. So we would then have to take it to a local shop. I can imagine the local shops reaction when we bring in a flathead Dodge. Few have never worked on a SBC.

The school administration wanted us to pimp out a PT Cruiser for cripes sakes! This is way better than that regardless of the engine.

[Norm's Coupe]

I have no problem with upgrading to a 350 engine myself, or any other modifications you may do.

You ask if you needed any modifications to the front end to go with a 350 engine. You can use all the original front end parts with the 350 engine, 350 automatic and there is no problem with support. I know one guy who had a 48 Dodge coupe with the original front end and rearend in the car, including original steering gear. He lived near me in Brookfield, WI. He was even running with the original drum brakes. You just need to make the necessary mounts for each.

If you want to scrounge around the salvage yards you can use the same system that Ed Gross used on his P15 Plymouth. His system can be found in Tex Smiths book titled "How to Build a Mopar", or on Ed's website. Or send him an email off his profile on this forum. Here is a link to his profile for the forum http://www430.pair.com/p15d24/mopar_forum/member.php?u=328. He lives in Wales, WI. He is usually more than happy to answer any questions on his disc brake setup. He wrote the article in Tex Smiths book that I referenced. He did it from all salvage yard parts except the brake pads. He also has a 440 engine under the hood with an automatic transmission. Here's a picture of his car. He also has a website and I believe the disc brake setup is explained there also. Here's a link to his site. http://www.dndrodshop.com

Good Luck and have fun with the guys in the class.

[Young Ed]

It sounds like you are doing a good job of guiding the students. My one question though it why no fuel injection? If you expect anyone at the school to be able to jump in and drive that seems like the way to go. Its been quite a while since they made a carb vehicle.

[Don Coatney]

Just a couple of thoughts. Honda engine? Carburation? I think it would be cool to do a Honda multicarbed engine. Of course I am thinking from my Honda motorcycle days and not from the more modern rocket rice engines. Probably good to kill that thought.

Fuel injection? Why not convert a Flathead to fuel injection. It has been done by some with success and dependability. Flathead 6 with turbo charging? Pretty much uncharted water but good young engineers should like the challenge. An engine shop set up to do SBC's only? Find another shop with flexibility.

I understand it is a funded project. And I understand the selected progression is the easy street. And I understand the easy street is cookie cutter. Does not mean I have to agree with it. One thing we all do on this forum is agree to disagree without animosity. And it does not mean that you are not welcome here. I sincerely hope that you post the progress of this project so we can all assist as required and perhaps learn a bit along the way.

[BobT-47P15]

One thing we all do on this forum is agree to disagree without animosity. And it does not mean that you are not welcome here. I sincerely hope that you post the progress of this project so we can all assist as required and perhaps learn a bit along the way.

I second that comment.

[Norm's Coupe]

And I understand the easy street is cookie cutter. Does not mean I have to agree with it.

I like cookie cutters myself. Wife uses them all the time to bake the best cookies you'll ever want to eat. Ahhhh..........makes the house smell real good too.

[55 Fargo]

I am a little surprised by the negative comments. I am a regular at a Chevy Nova site and have never seen negatives like this, they believe it is your car, do what makes you happy.

However, I believe it is your house, your rules and am not too thin skinned to read the posts.

The students WERE polled, they did not want it stock. I should not have writen "my thoughts" it should have been in third person. I'm a technician not an English teacher. I did forbid them from considering a Honda engine, so I guess that we be "one guy..only this way".

The school has a problem with the students posting freely when my Email is attached, thus I post for them. They see what is written. It is a fresh group every August but some decisions can't be reversed if the next group had different ideas.

Mr Adams, they are not too stupid to make decisions and perform the work, but they certainly do not have the skills (yet) or the time and finances to randomly experiment with suspension and brake designs or retrofits. Are they to try building something by guessing only to have it fail on the road with a fatality the result? I think not. They should be taught to do some research and use other's knowledge to guide to help them reach a goal. Don't rethink the wheel everytime but also look for improvements and solve problems that come up when doing the work. THAT is why we posted here. Isn't that part of why anyone posts here?

Assistance does not have to be funds, a small part that someone has 3-4 of and we have none can make a big deal to us.

It makes more sense from a driveability standpoint to have it more modern.

From a financial standpoint a SBC 350 is the cheapest route to take. Rebuild kits are far cheaper. Fewer raffle tickets need to be sold to buy the kit. When you explain to them that you can use a Mopar engine but you need to raise "X" amount more funds, they do not have the brand loyalty you all have and opt for the less expensive engine which equals less fundraising. Working on the car is the fun part, raising funds is not.

We got one SBC free, noone was stepping up with a Mopar or Ford. I had three 350's to give and we had four others offered by school employees. The engine machining shop is set up best for a SBC because they are the most common. Most agreed that once you move beyond the original engine, the brand of modern engine is not important.

We can incorporate the Performance class in flowing the heads and have only SBC plates for the flowbench. Even though flowing is not necassary we want to incorporate as many students as possible to give them all a piece of the action.

There will be no billet on it, unless someone gives us some,then it will be blasted and painted. I was surprised at how many thought billet was outdated, as do I.

Greg G, not sure about the ham fisted part, it will be some young ladies used to driving minivans !!! Unfortunately we have no choice but to make it accessable to others on campus. This is definately not my first choice.

Although I like street rods, even more I like to see original old cars. Make a street rod out of the "cookie cutter" Model A's that you already see in restored condition. Restore the "odd balls" you don't see everyday. I love history. We do not have the funds in my program to restore the car and keep it for our own use. Some school funds will be used which means they have to see some use out of it which brings us to the modern parts. If the program had the money and I or the students had the time to go to the high schools and fairs, it would be original.

The Auto Tech class was also not interested in working on an old flathead, they preferred an injected engine but we compromised on a carb engine.

They teach in units so if they are on the auto trans unit and we need engine work (tune up, engine miss, etc) they won't do it. So we would then have to take it to a local shop. I can imagine the local shops reaction when we bring in a flathead Dodge. Few have never worked on a SBC.

The school administration wanted us to pimp out a PT Cruiser for cripes sakes! This is way better than that regardless of the engine.

Hi and Welcome to the greatest Mopar Forum on the planet. You have come to and selected a very fine group, a lot of very decent Gentlemen belong to this forum, we will try and assist you to the best of our abilities.

As mentioned, we do have differences of opinion, but we all accept one another, and how each of us are unique in the ay we have decided to undertake our particular car builds. Heck if all the cars/engines were the same, it would be boring, offering very little variation, so only you and your student body's imagination will set the paradigms of how your car should be built.

What you are trying to do in your build sounds very reasonable to me, there's nothing wrong with a SBC engine, we happen to be partial to Flathead 6s here, but we totally accept other engines used as powertrains as well, nothing wrong with this idea.

As mentioned, the Mopar 6 can be hopped up, dual carbs, headers, Fenton Aluminum Heads, polished ports, performance cams, igntions etc.

But if your students have collectively and democratically made the decision to go the route you have outlined great. What a learning experience, guide them, have fun, and let them learn and be proud of there accomplisments.

I am sure this project will be both a great time for learning the opportunity for your students to think "outside of the box", and to enjoy the challenges they will inevitbaly face on this ground -up build.

So keep us posted, show us the pics of your progress, encourage your students to join us here on the forum. I am also interested in learning new things that may transpire from you project.

So good luck, and keep visiting us here on P15 D24..............The Rock

[Frank Elder]

What are going to do with the original parts, some are common, but all need to be removed very carefully if they are to retain their function. Such as saving fittings, bolts, or electrical connections that go with said parts.

Selling these items instead of hot wrenching or tossing away could make you money for your project.

Frankie

[Norm's Coupe]

Guys,

After the post made about "Cookie Cutters", it started me thinking a little. Did you notice a wood burning smoke smell?

I know we usually call the look alike street rods and custom cookie cutters. However, what does a cookie cutter really do? It makes all the cookies the same shape, all the time.

Now, with that in mind think about this for a moment. How many thousands and millions of cars come out of the end of an original manufactured cars on the assembly line, that all look alike except for color.

So.............by now you're probably getting my drift. Cars that are original are more of the cookie cutter class than anyone can hope to make one at a time. So.........I think the Cookie Cutter classification should go to original cars rather than street rods or customs, regardless of the engine used in a street rod or custom.

[Don Coatney]

So.........I think the Cookie Cutter classification should go to original cars rather than street rods or customs' date=' regardless of the engine used in a street rod or custom.[/quote']

Norm;

I would think that by now you would have learned that no matter how hard you try you cannot change the world:D

[falconvan]

Check with Fatman's Fabrications for suspension, disc brake, and steering options. They're the only ones I know of who have a few different options engineered specifically for this car. Engine? Get that big honkin steering box out of the way and you pretty much have room to fabricate mounts for anything with a rear sump oil pan. Ford Ranger or Dodge Dakota rearends are just about perfect on the width; just need to relocate the spring pads.

[1941Dodge]

Keep it original the straight 6 from Chrysler was the best of the best, mine still runs strong w/o a rebuild over 67 years later! Most of the engines from the 40's were great, as many of them had military uses and had to be good.

[james curl]

In the tech section of the forum I posted a site for suspension upgrade using the original frame and crossmember. They are converting a 50 Pontiac to modern components with ball joints and disc brakes if you think the original is not up to the task. The site is www.hotrodders.com then go to the "bulletin board" and look for "build hot rod how to articles" and there you will find one titled "37-57 Buick, Olds and Pontiac front suspension up grade". These cars are very much like the early MoPars. From this you can see ways to convert to later front suspension without cutting the front half of the frame to install a later model clip.