OT City wants to scrap any unsightly cars on private property OT

[PatS....]

My question is does anyone know of local city legislation that addresses the problem of wrecks littering a yard while respecting the legitimate hobbyist needs?

I'd like to be at the council meeting in a few weeks with a viable alternative to the draconian bylaw now suggested.

If you know of a city that has done a good job of walking this tightrope I'd like to know. It's easier to get the right bylaw in place to begin with than try to change it later

Thanks

[48mirage]

My experiences won't help. While living in El Dorado Ks I had a wreck in my '70 Challenger. Nothing serious but it was going to take some work to get it looking good again. I had the tow truck deliver it to my house I had him drop it in the 2 car wide driveway so that it didn't block the entrance to the garage. The cedar trees in the side yard even obscured it from the street. Three days later a local cop (that I had gone to school with) started telling me about the city ordinance that said I couldn't keep the car because it wasn't in running condition. I told him I was a little confused. I pointed down the street to a neighbor's old plymouth and told him that car hasn't moved in the 6 years I've lived here and it's parked on the public right of way. He just shrugged and left. I did find out the guy down the street was buddy's with the city's long time mayor.

Maybe that is your solution. Suck up to the local politicians and get the issue ignored. No bylaw or ordinance is easier to accomplish than one that seperates neighbors.

[Dodgefran]

Our town policy is no more than 4 unregistered vehicles can be on any one residential lot. I hope this helps. I have 2 that I'm working on now. No problems so far.

[Plymouthy Adams]

SEMA thaem the people who you want to contact with any proposed legislation..they fight this stuff daily...

[steveplym]

My club has been a Sema Action Network member for quite a while and fought the same type of laws here in Illinois and other states. Looks like SAN just expanded to Canada too.

Check them out at: http://www.semasan.com/main/main.aspx?ID=/content/SEMASANcom/HomePage

If you want to contact them for assistance click on feedback at the bottom of the page and e-mail Jason for more info.

[Young Ed]

The POC region for MN donates to SEMA also. I believe they do good work. I think they had a big hand in getting regulations in place that will still allow hobbyists to paint cars at home. That almost became completely illegal

[PatS....]

SEMA thaem the people who you want to contact with any proposed legislation..they fight this stuff daily...

Tim, to my knowledge they don't operate in Canada. Wish they did.

This doesn't affect me at the moment. While the 50 DeSoto parts car is in the yard, it is completely out of sight. The proposed bylaw will require a complaint, so if I get one I'll put it in the garage here.

I would like to be able to show the City Council an example or two of old car friendly legislation that works, for them to consider with their pointed heads.

[steveplym]

The POC region for MN donates to SEMA also. I believe they do good work. I think they had a big hand in getting regulations in place that will still allow hobbyists to paint cars at home. That almost became completely illegal

Yes they did and that is a good thing too as that would have really hurt the hobby. Not all of us can afford to pay a body shop to complete a paint job and not many of them will do it either.

[steveplym]

Tim, to my knowledge they don't operate in Canada. Wish they did.

This doesn't affect me at the moment. While the 50 DeSoto parts car is in the yard, it is completely out of sight. The proposed bylaw will require a complaint, so if I get one I'll put it in the garage here.

I would like to be able to show the City Council an example or two of old car friendly legislation that works, for them to consider with their pointed heads.

Actually Pat there website says they just expanded to canada and have legislative alerts from Canada on the link I attached.

[PatS....]

Thanks a million, Steve. I'll be checking that out right away!!

[steveplym]

No problem Pat, it's nice to know there are people on our side who are in the right places.

[greg g]

Just looked up ours. Looks like a lot of interpretive space.

The Town of XXXXXX Zoning Ordinance allows for the parking/storage in the open of ONE unlicensed OPERATIVE motor vehicle.

No inoperative motor vehicles, licensed or unlicensed are allowed to be parked/stored in the open.

[PatS....]

It angers me to no end that these pompous asses can't keep their effin noses off my property. As long as it's out of sight, it's nobody's damn business.

We really haven't had specific legislation up to now but the existing bylaw covers things quite well in my opinion. If I was collecting opera singers or Mona Lisa's or big effin broken statues outside, they would have guided tours but it's an old car so lets crush it.

Those same politicians would happily park their fat butts in a retored car to be in a parade and wave like morons to people who don't even know who they are. They don't give a thought to how the car came to be in that condition.

GGRRRR

[greg g]

Well I guess you could claim discrimination. I 'm sure if you look around you will find a yard cluttered with what I refer to as SOS ($#!+ ona stick) Stuff sold at craft shows little plywood cut outs made to look like cows, rabbits, kids peeing in the garden. then there is likely a house with every piece of injection molded kid crap ever sold at wal mart, all sun faded to that pinkish yellow color. I will bet you there is a family some where with a soccer goal, a swing , a trampoline, an inflatable kid pool, several bicycles in various states of repair. On down the road there will be a house with a couple lawn tractors, an ATV, 2 snowmobiles, a popup camper, a 30 year old faded fiberglass boat on a trailer with flat tires, under two uv beat and wind shredded tarps one blue one green.

But heaven forbid there be a car under a cover..... Most of the ordinences say in the open, get some stockade fence and put it around you hobby piece. If anybody asks what's behind the fence tell em it's a dumpster. That seems to be OK for all the businesses that have a dumpster so why not for you.

[Norm's Coupe]

Around here the only requirement is that the car be moved at least once a month and must have license plates on it. I think thats a good law because it does keep people from parking old modern beaters in their driveways or yards. The law doesn't apply to collector cars (unless they are not parked on a paved surface.

The reason for that law here is to keep people like my new next door neighbor from storing old junk cars at their house, or operating a garage out of their home. My new neighbor owns some kind of auto repair shop close by. When he first moved in he would fill up his driveway with cars that had to be pushed into his driveway when unloaded off his trailer. Then he would just let that junk sit in his driveway, sometimes several months. Finally I think the neighbor on the other side of him (he's a retired police LT of detectives) reported him. They came out put tickets on each car and made the guy move them. Then he moved them all out and we don't see any cars over there except the ones him and his wife drive. We do have other people in the neighborhood that have several old collector cars (and tractors) parked in the yard on the grass. No one bothers them, some are covered, some aren't.

[randroid]

Gents,

Perhaps easing some trepidation and angst, as is my wont, there's another side of this that I experienced and what I found is almost amusing. Last year some withered old fart went down two streets of our semi-isolated square mile of houses and targeted 28 different vehicles as perhaps not entirely within the ordinances of the City of Loveland, CO. Sure as the day is long we all got ticketed and were made to disguise our vehicles under big tarps, which are ever much more attractive than a vintage vehicle.

I complied but last Spring I wanted to start prepping my '48 P-15 for paint and needed to uncover the car so I trundled down to the cop shop to discuss my options. They found the Officer who issued the citations and her basic attitude was that although the tickets needed by law to be issued, she would not issue them again. She recognized this as harassment on the part of the snitch and found it to be a disgusting and un-neighborly thing for him to have done. Her words after I told her what my car was were that it's a lot nicer looking than a blue tarp and she wasn't going to participate in this sort of bullying against the people she called friends, neighbors, and members of our community. She also suggested that if this clown tried to bust us again he'd be asked why and better have a solid reason for it or the DA's office might be able to find another obscure law he might not to want to be prosecuted under.

My summary is that these laws will be passed because there's always somebody out there wanting to climb the political ladder to further his personal agenda, but the enforcement of these laws will be left to the discretion of the enforcing officer.

All is not lost regardless of who is in office or which bills are on the books. Hope this helps.

-Randy

[james curl]

You just need to figure where the money is. The people on the city staff see people who want ordinances written to protect the public interest, but also puts money in their pockets. In my hometown they passed ordnance that does not allow anyone in the city limits to keep a motor home or towable recreational vehicle on their property. They must park them in a lot designed for such vehicles and pay rent to park there. We also have the old car ordnance but you can take the same non-running car to the storage place and park it uncovered in plain sight and as long as you pay your rent you are OK. Most ordinances are written to help someone make money. Here your car must be inspected and licensed even while you work on it, now who benefits in this case, your insurance agent and the State. The agent has few liabilities with your car sitting in the garage and you are not using the States highways.

[PatS....]

And we as supposedly free citizens sit back, say nothing and are treated no differently than a Russian or an Iraqi. I wonder why we don't get effin mad as hell and do something?

I'm gonna give this all I've got to make sure it makes sense and is logical before it gets written into law.

I'm not much of a political activist but I know how to get these pinheaded politicians attention when I have all the pertinent facts. They're gonna wish I'll just go away...and I will when I get what I want.

[Norm's Coupe]

Well guys, I'll agree we should be able to do what we want and keep what we want on our own property. However, there is a limit to that.

If you live in a suburban subdivision you don't want to see a lot of junk of any kind laying around in peoples yards. Not even a bunch of parts cars, or old cars waiting for who knows how long to be restored. Its can be eye sore. I know of one such house in my neighborhood. The guy has had a P15 Club Coupe sitting on the side of his driveway for who knows how long. Most of the time it sits there with at least one flat tire and it's slowly rusting away. Someone must have complained about it in the last few years (probably the people next door to him) because he did finally put license plates on it. I ask him once several years ago why he didn't restore it. His answer was that the people in the hobby charged too much for parts. So, is the car ever going to be restored?? I doubt it, but yet he won't sell it because it was his first car. All he's done to it in the last 15 years is put another engine in it, and that was an industrial engine he picked up some place locally cheap. If you get too many cars and junk in the yards it makes your house and neighborhood look junky too, not just theirs.

Now, if you live out someplace, like someone like Tim Adams it doesn't matter as much. That said, from the pictures Tim has posted of his yard and house over the years, I don't see junk and old cars sitting in the yard either. Looks like he keeps everything as neat as possible in the yard. He's even gone to the extent of building a shelter for them, which also keeps them out of site for the most part.

The bottom line is. While yes it's our property, we also must think about our neighbors at the same time. What we think looks neat (old rusty cars), our neighbor may not agree, and thats why these laws were made. Not only can they look bad to others, but if not constantly worked on they become homes for rats, mice and other critters. I for one don't want to supply those critters with a home on my property, and neither does your neighbor.

[JerseyHarold]

Here in New Jersey, you can't have an unregistered vehicle in public view. In a neighboring town, the enforcement official tried to lift the tarp from a vehicle to check if it had plates, but the owner stopped him because THAT was illegal. Go figure.

Selective enforcement is another issue. In 1996, when we first came down the road to where our house was being built, there was a 2-door silver Cutlass, in plain view 20 feet off the road, in someone's driveway without plates. The car sat there deteriorating until a couple of years ago before being hauled away. I wonder who the owner knew to avoid being hassled.

[kiwi mopar]

Man you guys have it hard over there.

as i know as long as it not on the street if fine to have as many old cars as you like.

i have 5 non moveing car on my place. but i do have them all in a shed.

but in the old place i own at one time i had 7 cars that was not in the movble state.

[knighthawk]

figure this one out ! on main street, in this little Kansas town, in front of his body shop, the owner has a '57 Caddillac, in very bad shape, covered with badly ripped tarp, PARKED ON THE SIDEWALK ! I've been here a couple years, and it was there when I got here !

[Norm's Coupe]

figure this one out ! on main street, in this little Kansas town, in front of his body shop, the owner has a '57 Caddillac, in very bad shape, covered with badly ripped tarp, PARKED ON THE SIDEWALK ! I've been here a couple years, and it was there when I got here !

I would think that would be illegal in any city to park even a new car on the sidewalk. Maybe he gets away with it because he calling it a sign or advertising his shop.

[PatS....]

Maybe because no-one has complained. Here it would be gone within hours. No registration on public property, which I don't have a problem with.

I just want them to stay the he!! out of MY property.

[62rebelP23]

neighbor on west side: two teachers with middle school aged kids. never home as far as i can tell; never see them, they never see me. neighbor on east side: old retiree and his wife who could care less what i do in my yard.

behind me: railroad yard full of stinky ass diesel engines. out front: an empty street. visible from the street: one yellow Falcon (thanks Tim) and a big white garage door, hiding another falcon, my cambridge sedan, and my Galaxie. in the past ten years i've had ONE complaint (loud knock on wood here) and it wasn't about a car, it was lumber i had out back. at one time i had ten (TEN!) cars in my backyard and i was really itchy at the time....