New B-3-B owner with some basic questions

[ktb]

My dad and I trailered our family's granite gray 1951 Dodge B-3-B-108 Pilot House with fluid drive and lowside bed from CA to TX last week, and I'm getting started on getting it running again after sitting ~25 years.  There are some key challenges that we could use some of the forum's sage advice on.

 

1. The keys have been lost.  I removed the ignition lock cylinder and am working on the passenger door lock cylinder (need a smaller flathead to remove the setscrew).  The gas cap is also lockable, but this is a non-original part, and we will probably just pick the lock and replace it.  If our local key shop is unable to do anything with the original lock cylinders, does anyone know of an online source for old mopar keys or cylinders?  Is there a recommended gas cap replacement?

 

2. Spark plug wires.  The O'Reilly webpage showed Standard Motor Products part # 3600 as direct replacement, but the Rock Auto info page on them shows wire lengths of 9"-11"-15", and measuring the old wires from the Dodge, I'm seeing 18"-21"-24" wires.  Is there a good set of longer cut-to-length/DIY plug wires available out there, or a source for custom-fit wires for our 218 engines?

 

3. 6V Battery.  For now I plan to leave the original 6V / positive ground / generator electrical system in place.  Are there any recommended 6V battery options out there (besides the $250 Optima Redtop 6V)?   

 

4. Original wheels are 15" with ancient 6.70-15 tube tires.  I plan to get 205/75R15 tires installed - is there any other inexpensive radial size (preferably taller but still narrow enough to fit on the original wheels) recommended? 

 

5. Radiator / cooling system.  Original radiator is cracked and overflow tube has a worn-through spot due to rubbing on the center hood section structure.  I believe the radiator cracked due to an incorrect positive-pressure cap being used.  I will have a local shop braze/clean/retest the original radiator and will source a new zero-pressure radiator cap.  Also the heater control valve (?), right rear corner of engine head, is badly corroded and will need replacement - any idea if these can be found or substituted?

 

6. Hand-starting crank nut hex size?  I'd like to try turning the engine over by hand but do not have a hand-starting crank.  Does anyone know the hex size of the outer part of the hand-starting crank nut so that I can try to rotate the engine by hand with a wrench or socket?

 

7. Brakes don't work.  Stiff brake pedal and stuck hand brake handle/cable (these I'll be addressing later, but just wanted to throw it out there for future discussion).  For the hand brake it looks like it's just the cable that is stuck - the local hand brake lever works, although the front of the driveshaft and hand brake lining are very oily from an apparent transmission leak.

 

8. Driveshaft stuck engaged.  Another long-term project.  Turning the rear wheels also spins the driveshaft.  The clutch pedal goes up and down with appropriate resistance, and the 3-speed column shifter shifts freely, but it would appear that the transmission is stuck in gear even with the clutch pedal depressed and shifter in neutral. 

 

I think that's enough for now. There are many challenges ahead, but I'm super-stoked to be starting on this project and look forward to sharing progress with the forum!  Thanks in advance!!

 

- Kyle

[moparfun]

Gotta Love it, Welcome to your new adventure. Right place to get answers, sounds like you got a plan. Get as many books that you can that cover your truck and post questions

[Dave72dt]

Try Standard # 3800 instead. It's for an 8 cyl and will have longer leads. If you want metal core wires try 3802 but it will cause problems with electronic ignition systems.

 

There are at least 4 standard size 6V lead-acid batteries, API classed as 1H, 2H and 4H each a bit physically bigger than the previous and more crank power and a long, narrow 6V, 3EH commonly used in pairs in some John Deere tractors.  Try an ag center to find these if box stores can't or won't get them for you.  Check your box dimensions first.

 

The driveshaft is supposed to turn when you turn the rear wheels.  One wheel on the ground and trans in gear it will not when turning the wheel that is off the ground.  Both wheels off the ground and trans in gear one wheel will go forward, the other backwards.

 

Early 70's Dodge pickups used a cable operated heater valve that you may be able to find or if you can live with manually closing it under the hood, common plumbing shutoff valves can be plumbed in.

 

[bkahler]

1 hour ago, ktb said:

My dad and I trailered our family's granite gray 1951 Dodge B-3-B-108 Pilot House with fluid drive and lowside bed from CA to TX last week, and I'm getting started on getting it running again after sitting ~25 years.  There are some key challenges that we could use some of the forum's sage advice on.

 

1. The keys have been lost.  I removed the ignition lock cylinder and am working on the passenger door lock cylinder (need a smaller flathead to remove the setscrew).  The gas cap is also lockable, but this is a non-original part, and we will probably just pick the lock and replace it.  If our local key shop is unable to do anything with the original lock cylinders, does anyone know of an online source for old mopar keys or cylinders?  Is there a recommended gas cap replacement?

 

My local lock smith was able to re-key both the door and ignition locks with no problem. 

 

1 hour ago, ktb said:

2. Spark plug wires.  The O'Reilly webpage showed Standard Motor Products part # 3600 as direct replacement, but the Rock Auto info page on them shows wire lengths of 9"-11"-15", and measuring the old wires from the Dodge, I'm seeing 18"-21"-24" wires.  Is there a good set of longer cut-to-length/DIY plug wires available out there, or a source for custom-fit wires for our 218 engines?

 

II bought spark plug wires from one of the vendors like DCM Classics, etc.

 

1 hour ago, ktb said:

3. 6V Battery.  For now I plan to leave the original 6V / positive ground / generator electrical system in place.  Are there any recommended 6V battery options out there (besides the $250 Optima Redtop 6V)?   

 

4. Original wheels are 15" with ancient 6.70-15 tube tires.  I plan to get 205/75R15 tires installed - is there any other inexpensive radial size (preferably taller but still narrow enough to fit on the original wheels) recommended? 

 

If your truck is a 51 B3B then the original wheels would have been 16".  I run P225/75SR16 radials on my 51 B3B.  Are you sure they are 15" wheels?

 

1 hour ago, ktb said:

5. Radiator / cooling system.  Original radiator is cracked and overflow tube has a worn-through spot due to rubbing on the center hood section structure.  I believe the radiator cracked due to an incorrect positive-pressure cap being used.  I will have a local shop braze/clean/retest the original radiator and will source a new zero-pressure radiator cap.  Also the heater control valve (?), right rear corner of engine head, is badly corroded and will need replacement - any idea if these can be found or substituted?

 

Your radiator will likely need to be re-cored.  My re-core cost me about $750 at the local shop added to the $150 to buy an original style radiator.  Not the cheapest but I'm glad I did it.

 

1 hour ago, ktb said:

6. Hand-starting crank nut hex size?  I'd like to try turning the engine over by hand but do not have a hand-starting crank.  Does anyone know the hex size of the outer part of the hand-starting crank nut so that I can try to rotate the engine by hand with a wrench or socket?

 

I don't know the size off the top of my head, but if the clutch disc is frozen to the flywheel I doubt you'll be able to turn it over by hand.  You'll likely need to resolve #8 before you can proceed.

 

1 hour ago, ktb said:

7. Brakes don't work.  Stiff brake pedal and stuck hand brake handle/cable (these I'll be addressing later, but just wanted to throw it out there for future discussion).  For the hand brake it looks like it's just the cable that is stuck - the local hand brake lever works, although the front of the driveshaft and hand brake lining are very oily from an apparent transmission leak.

 

For reasons to lengthy to explain here I ended up installing front disc brakes and a Jeep differential that had disc brakes as well.  Lots of people like keeping the brakes original and that was my intent but in the end I went with the disc brakes and I'm glad that I did. 

 

1 hour ago, ktb said:

8. Driveshaft stuck engaged.  Another long-term project.  Turning the rear wheels also spins the driveshaft.  The clutch pedal goes up and down with appropriate resistance, and the 3-speed column shifter shifts freely, but it would appear that the transmission is stuck in gear even with the clutch pedal depressed and shifter in neutral. 

 

It's possible the clutch disc is frozen to the flywheel.  I've seen that more than once in older vehicles that sit for long periods of time.  When I was younger and ran into this problem on my TR6 I used the starter to try and break it free.  This isn't necessarily the best approach but it did work for me.  Just try turning the engine over with the starter and see what happens. 

 

1 hour ago, ktb said:

I think that's enough for now. There are many challenges ahead, but I'm super-stoked to be starting on this project and look forward to sharing progress with the forum!  Thanks in advance!!

 

Nice looking truck!

 

1 hour ago, ktb said:

- Kyle

 

[JBNeal]

 

Crawl under that beast and remove the flywheel cover, put a prybar on the ring gear and see what colorful german phrases you can utter...this might obviate the need to proceed on any immediate parts purchases.

[B1B Keven]

Nice project truck! Welcome to the forum.

 

Hand crank nut is 1 3/4".

 

https://www.handhwiring.com/cloth-wiring

 

https://www.ledlight.com/ledlight-6-volt-positive-chassis-catalog.aspx

 

I know a guy that works on gauge clusters and speedometers.

 

 

[Merle Coggins]

Welcome to the 'family'. 

1. Hopefully your locksmith can help you with your locks. If not an aftermarket ignition switch will get you going until a proper one can be tracked down

2. My first set of plug wires came from my local Farm & Fleet store. It was a generic cut-to-length set for tractors. They worked fine until I upgraded to a Pertronix ignition and I upgraded to their plug wires too. 

3. Check with your local battery house, or farm store. They may have 6v batteries in stock. As mentioned earlier, measure the battery box and get the largest one that'll fit. Also, I recommend checking the condition of your battery cables and connections. Be sure to use 1 ga cables at minimum. Many of us fine 0 ga. or 00 ga. to be preferred. The 'off the shelf' cables at the big box stores tend to be 4 ga. for 12v vehicles. 

4. As mentioned, most 1/2 ton trucks came with 16" wheels. But I've seen many with 15's, especially in California for some reason. Maybe the factory out there (San Leandro?) use 15's as standard vs. the 16's out of Detroit. Either way it'll depend on the width of your rims. My B2C has the original 15" X 5.5" wheels. I am running 235/75R-15's without any problems. 

5. Good luck with your radiator. If you can't find a Zero pressure cap you can just cut the seal do that it won't seal, hence making it a zero pressure cap. 

6. I couldn't remember the size of the crank nut, but I thing someone answered that for you. 

7. Regarding the Park Brake cable. If you can get it removed, try soaking it with penetrating oil and gently pulling it one way or the other. It'll likely free up over time. That's what I had to do with mine. Once I got it freed up, and well lubed, it have been working trouble free ever since. 

8. The truck should roll with the trans in neutral, even if the clutch is stuck as someone mentioned. Maybe the Park Brake is locked on? I suppose it's possible that the trans got stuck in multiple gears. I've seen it happen before. You'll just need to play around with it, or worse case... tear it apart. 

 

Looking forward to seeing your progress.  

[bkahler]

2 hours ago, Merle Coggins said:

8. The truck should roll with the trans in neutral, even if the clutch is stuck as someone mentioned. Maybe the Park Brake is locked on? I suppose it's possible that the trans got stuck in multiple gears. I've seen it happen before. You'll just need to play around with it, or worse case... tear it apart. 

 

Merle, good point about the truck rolling if the transmission is in neutral.  I missed that tidbit