51 B3B build thread - after all these years

[DJ194950]

PIc of recommended seal? A o-ring?

 

DJ

Edited October 12, 2020 by DJ194950

[bkahler]

The one on the right is the one that JB said worked for his truck.

 

[JBNeal]

The link ya posted to one of my build threads was helpful, and the subsequent post by Davin shows the seal and pinion that it fits onto.  Also in that build thread post is a link to the original sleeve repair assembly, showing the depth of the sleeve counterbore.  I'm a little fuzzy on the details as the parts manual doesn't have much detail in the pinion area in the exploded view, but there are differences among the transmission speedometer pinions as well as orientation on the transmission...the 3 speeds have the pinion parallel to the axles, so gear oil wants to leak out; the 4 speed has the pinion at an upwards angle so that gear oil drains back into the case.  Your pinion looks like it has an o-ring groove, but I don't reckon that would work in this application.  I found no seal on my 4 speed when I rejuvenated it, and after 10k miles, enough gear oil seeped out onto the sleeve to attract enough dust to clog that seep up.  So my suggestion is to install the pinion and sleeve into the transmission with some teflon tape on all the threads, screw on your speedo cable hand tight + 1/8 turn, and roll on

[Brent B3B]

Yeah, I took apart two of my b3, 4speeds just now looking for that o-ring and...... zilch ?

 

Must be a 3speed thing like JB said.

the only reference I found to the o-ring was this

I am comfortable not having them and I don’t THINK they leak from that spot (hard to tell from all the other leaks LOL) 

[bkahler]

8 hours ago, JBNeal said:

The link ya posted to one of my build threads was helpful, and the subsequent post by Davin shows the seal and pinion that it fits onto.  Also in that build thread post is a link to the original sleeve repair assembly, showing the depth of the sleeve counterbore.  I'm a little fuzzy on the details as the parts manual doesn't have much detail in the pinion area in the exploded view, but there are differences among the transmission speedometer pinions as well as orientation on the transmission...the 3 speeds have the pinion parallel to the axles, so gear oil wants to leak out; the 4 speed has the pinion at an upwards angle so that gear oil drains back into the case.  Your pinion looks like it has an o-ring groove, but I don't reckon that would work in this application.  I found no seal on my 4 speed when I rejuvenated it, and after 10k miles, enough gear oil seeped out onto the sleeve to attract enough dust to clog that seep up.  So my suggestion is to install the pinion and sleeve into the transmission with some teflon tape on all the threads, screw on your speedo cable hand tight + 1/8 turn, and roll on

 

7 hours ago, Brent B3B said:

Yeah, I took apart two of my b3, 4speeds just now looking for that o-ring and...... zilch ?

 

Must be a 3speed thing like JB said.

the only reference I found to the o-ring was this

I am comfortable not having them and I don’t THINK they leak from that spot (hard to tell from all the other leaks LOL) 

 

Thank you both for checking.  What you describe makes a lot of sense based on what I see with the parts I have.  If a seal was supposed to be used I would have expected some sort of recess in the gland nut for the seal to reside in.  Mine doesn't have a recess for a seal.  In one of the threads I found someone modified their gland nut to accept a seal.   I have no desire to do that so I'll leave as is.

 

I will now happily move forward and install the speedo drive gear

 

Thanks!

 

Brad

 

 

[bkahler]

I'm getting closer to the point where I can install the new wiring harness that I've made.  There wasn't much left of the original wiring harness when I dismantled the truck so I didn't have a whole lot to work with.  Back in 2007 or 2008 I started searching for information and came across the Pilothouse.org site where Dave Erb had uploaded some really good information based on a wiring harness original bought and documented by Allen Parkhurst. 

 

So in the spring of 2008 I printed out that information and proceeded to design and build my own harness.  Since I was on a work assignment in Pasadena for a year I spent a lot of my spare time scrounging through the junk yards in the area and working on oddball B3B projects.  Probably the major one was the fabrication of the wiring harness.

 

When I made the harness in 2008 I was using Dave Erb's diagrams which were for a B2B and I failed to notice that little tidbit of information.  Once I realized my wiring harness was not built to work correctly with my gauge and switch locations I started looking into the wiring diagrams for the B3Bs I noticed there are two different versions.  The difference between the B2B and what I am calling the early B3B wiring is one wire between the headlight switch and the ammeter (B2B) vs headlight switch and ignition switch (early B3B).  

 

The difference between the B2B and what I am calling the late B3B wiring harness are two wires.  The first one is the same as the early B3B wiring change and the second one is a wire between the horn and voltage regulator (B2B) vs horn and ammeter (late B3B).  

 

Since my truck is a 51, first year for B3Bs I'm calling my truck an early truck and will use the early B3B wiring diagram.  What that means for me is I only have to worry about the wire between the headlight switch and ignition switch will will be just a short jumper.    The wire from the headlight switch to the ammeter that is currently in the wiring harness will be taped off at both ends and kept as a spare.  

 

I guess I got lucky in that the wiring changes between the B2Bs and B3Bs were not major.  A simple enough change for me and I'm good to go

 

 

B2B wiring diagram

 

Early B3B wiring diagram

 

Late B3B wiring diagram

 

 

 

Brad

 

Edited October 13, 2020 by bkahler

[Lingle]

interesting tidbit I learned from GGDAD1951 when I visited him is that at one time both the pilothouse.org and this forum were the same and were split at some point.

 

Keep up the good work on the build!  Im far from needing a harness but good to see the information is still valid and applicable for me since I have a 51 B3F, although do not know if it is early or late.

[bkahler]

I remember back when there was a pilothouse.com.  Not sure why there was a split.

 

I have 1st and 2nd edition copies of the owners manual.  The 1st edition has one wire different and the 2nd edition has two.  Unfortunately they don't have dates.  

 

I would think the 1st edition would be for 1951.  The 2nd edition would be for 1952 or 1953.  That's my story and I'm sticking to it

 

Brad 

 

 

[Brent B3B]

9 hours ago, Lingle said:

interesting tidbit I learned from GGDAD1951 when I visited him 

Dang Lingle, if I knew you were going to Ggdad’s I would had you mess up his shop for me, or at least hide Puma’s brush ?

 

Brad, did you run 4 wires to the rear? 
I ended up using JB’s “modified diagram”.... very happy 

 

Edited October 14, 2020 by Brent B3B

[ggdad1951]

On 10/13/2020 at 8:32 PM, Brent B3B said:

Dang Lingle, if I knew you were going to Ggdad’s I would had you mess up his shop for me, or at least hide Puma’s brush ?

 

Brad, did you run 4 wires to the rear? 
I ended up using JB’s “modified diagram”.... very happy 

 

 

was that YOU who hid my dust collector remote I can't find?  ?

[bkahler]

I finished refurbishing and assembling the heater last night.  I think I'm happy with how it came out.  The heater was originally a model 62 with a 6-volt motor.  Now I think it's a model 61-62-75 because it took that many different heater parts to make it whole again!  The model 75 had a 12 volt motor which was handy since I am switching over to 12 volts.  I left the motor wires extra long.  Originally the ground connection was just connected to a screw on the heater cover and the positive wire was only about 18" long.   Right now both wires are about 36" long.  

 

Actually installing it the truck was probably the easiest thing I've done so far.  It slipped right into place and with no fenders or doors in place yet it was easy to hold the heater against the firewall and install the lock washers and nuts

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Brad

 

[jerseycj8]

On 10/3/2020 at 6:18 PM, bkahler said:

I made a lot of progress since my last post.  Other than filling the steering gearbox with corn head grease the steering system and front suspension is totally complete.  Installing the support clamp around the steering column was a small chore due to the rubber isolator.  I bought it new from DCM Classics and it was a really snug fit.  I had to use fully threaded 1/4" bolts to get it drawn up close enough to where I could install the 3/8" bolts.  

 

The truck is now back to sitting on it's wheels although I still need to torque the lug nuts to final torque.  Rotating the steering wheel from side to side yields maybe an 1" of movement before you feel resistance.  That's considerably better than the 1/4 turn of the wheel that was there previously!

 

 

 

 

I painted the intake and exhaust manifolds last week and installed them yesterday.  I think it only took me five tries to get everything line up right and the correct studs in the correct holes, but they are installed

 

Now it's time to start thinking about throttle linkage again.  

 

 

 

I didn't realize it previously so I was somewhat surprised to find the clutch and brake pedals aren't in the same plane.  The clutch pedal is something like 1-1/2" or so closer to the firewall.  Any idea why Dodge put them that way?

 

 

 

Lastly I need help identifying which side of the windshield gasket faces out.  I have someone coming Monday to install all of the cab glass (except doors) and I'd like to make sure it's installed properly!

 

One side has a recessed section for the center bar.  And the other side is totally flat.  Which side is faces out?!

 

 

 

 

Brad

 

Brad - I am stalking yet one more of your threads.  In the photo of the steering column and bracket, there appears to be a large felt coupler cushion between the shaft and 2 brackets.  I bought my project mostly in boxes, so I now know what that inner bracket, but don't see a felt coupler.  Any ideas?  Thx, Evan.

[JBNeal]

additional information - steering column clamp bushing

[jerseycj8]

8 minutes ago, JBNeal said:

additional information - steering column clamp bushing

Thank you JBNeal.....I didn't see that on DCM.  

[bkahler]

3 minutes ago, jerseycj8 said:

Thank you JBNeal.....I didn't see that on DCM.  

 

That's the one I bought and used.  Fit was fine although it took a little effort to bring the clamp together as I mentioned in my post. 

 

Brad

[ggdad1951]

Nice job on the heater!  Interesting paint job! 

[bkahler]

10 hours ago, ggdad1951 said:

Nice job on the heater!  Interesting paint job! 

 

Thanks.

 

The color was based off of the original as found in the truck and confirmed by the Model 75 that I bought for the heater core.  The current color might be a little shinier but closely resembles the original.  I would have liked to get a true color match but decided it wasn't worth the effort.  

[ggdad1951]

59 minutes ago, bkahler said:

 

Thanks.

 

The color was based off of the original as found in the truck and confirmed by the Model 75 that I bought for the heater core.  The current color might be a little shinier but closely resembles the original.  I would have liked to get a true color match but decided it wasn't worth the effort.  

cool,  I was wondering about the painted circle.  Choice or was that how that cover came?

[bkahler]

9 minutes ago, ggdad1951 said:

cool,  I was wondering about the painted circle.  Choice or was that how that cover came?

 

Here's a picture of the heater in the truck after I brought it home from Idaho.

 

 

It's interesting how Dodge changed the logo painting from time to time.  This is a model 62.  I have a model 75 cover that has the entire round section painted silver.  I forget what the cover I sent you looked like but I'm thinking the cover was all one color.  

 

Brad

 

[wallytoo]

on the model 61 in my truck, no logo, and color is the same as the body of the heater.

 

[ggdad1951]

2 hours ago, bkahler said:

 

Here's a picture of the heater in the truck after I brought it home from Idaho.

 

 

It's interesting how Dodge changed the logo painting from time to time.  This is a model 62.  I have a model 75 cover that has the entire round section painted silver.  I forget what the cover I sent you looked like but I'm thinking the cover was all one color.  

 

Brad

 

 

I've never seen that scheme before.  I've seen no silver to the whole medallion silver, but never a bulls-eye.  Looks like you tucked it in tighter to the center?

[bkahler]

1 hour ago, ggdad1951 said:

 

I've never seen that scheme before.  I've seen no silver to the whole medallion silver, but never a bulls-eye.  Looks like you tucked it in tighter to the center?

 

The heater is centered over the fresh air opening in the firewall.  The placement probably looks a little skewed due to the angle I took the picture.  There is plenty of room for the defroster attachment to be installed.  

 

Here's a slightly better picture of the heater before I started refurbishing it.

 

[ggdad1951]

I meant the below comparison.  

 

[bkahler]

Ah d*mn, I screwed it up ☹️

 

If you hadn't mentioned it I probably never would have noticed!  

 

Fortunately with the glovebox not installed it will be easy to remove the cover for repainting.  I wasn't happy with the silver anyway so this gives me a chance to redo

 

Thanks for pointing out my flub!

 

Brad

 

[bkahler]

Maybe someone a little more knowledgeable than myself can tell me if this is a good or bad way to plumb the fuel pump.  The pump is mounted with rubber isolators with both inlet and outlet hard piped to the pump.