replacement solid-state Voltage Regulator available??

[Go Fleiter]

Hello all!

  Is such fully electronic device available? 6 Volts, 50 Amps needed, if I remember well.

I would like to test one. Here is the reason:

After all these years of improving the car´s electrical funktions with (more or less) hidden, more reliable devices, the old electro- mechanical voltage regulator is the only major part beeing able to stop my Plymouth en route.
Yes, a spare one is always on board, but I hate these inaccurate devices, lesser contact quality now than 60 years ago!
I usually try to adjust some regulators at once. This speeds calibration up a lot, as I have not to learn the procedure again and again for one single unit only.
The temperature of the devices is crucial to their performance, so I go to a lonely spot and let engine run while calibrating- I find this even more annoying!

My wife refuses to risk loosing 3 days again just because of a failing (new! chinese??) distributor contact set, as we did in 2007 in Cote d´Azur. Since then I have an electronic ignition - happy go lucky! I whish to reach this staus for the voltage regulator too...

Thanks for any hints!
Greetings from Düsseldorf!
Go

 

PS.: asked this in the POC- Forum a month ago,

but only got  tips not fitting my needs or getting no results.

Edited September 29, 2019 by Go Fleiter

[Sam Buchanan]

A reliable 6v electronic regulator is indeed available.......and as a bonus it comes with a reliable source of generating electricity:

 

https://www.qualitypowerauto.com/item_24/6-Volt-Alternators-Positive-Ground.htm

 

I have one.... I like it! 

[Go Fleiter]

Thanks for the useful link!

  Well, my car came with minus ground.

But Qualitypowerauto maybe has some for me, just asked them, if this

https://www.qualitypowerauto.com/item_544/6-Volt-GM-Negative-Ground.htm

contains a regulator, it is one wire and has the old  DC generator look.

I hope they will answer!!

Thanks!

Greetings from Düsseldorf!

Go

[Sam Buchanan]

These one-wire alternators have a built-in regulator, just connect the single wire to your harness and you are good to go. The ammeter will continue to work normally. I found the proprietor of this vendor to be very easy to deal with and eager to make sure their product works properly.

 

You will like having bright headlights at idle speed. 

 

Edited September 29, 2019 by Sam Buchanan

[Pete]

HI Sam,

 

Thanks for the nice drawing.

 

A question: would it work to run the wire from the one-wire alternator to the lug on the starter switch and from there to the battery terminal on the regulator (keeping everything else the same as your drawing)? My '39 has:

 

   1) The original foot operated starter, no solenoid

   2) Right now only the neg batter cable and a wire to the ammeter are connected to the starter switch

   3) Only the horn relay and the other terminal on the ammeter and connected to the regulator battery terminal

 

Pete

[chrysler1941]

4 hours ago, Sam Buchanan said:

A reliable 6v electronic regulator is indeed available.......and as a bonus it comes with a reliable source of generating electricity:

 

https://www.qualitypowerauto.com/item_24/6-Volt-Alternators-Positive-Ground.htm

 

I have one.... I like it! 

I'm a bit confused. he was asking for a regulator and your link is for an alternator ???

And how can the ammeter show drain when connected like your drawing????

[keithb7]

There is no need for an external regulator when you upgrade to an alternator. It is a very good upgrade. The regulator is built in to the alternator. The alternator puts out more amps than a generator, even at idle. It can keep up to all the demands of the various loads in the 6V system. Using an alternator I don’t think there will ever be a negative draw shown on the ammeter. Unless the alternator is failing. That’s when the dummy light comes on in a modern car. 

 

That’s my understanding. Please correct me or add to my comments if I’m mis-understanding of the alternator. 

 

The alternator keeps everyone happy except the Mrs who monitors the finances. 

Edited September 29, 2019 by keithb7

[Los_Control]

8 minutes ago, keithb7 said:

The alternator keeps everyone happy except the Mrs who monitors the finances. 

I agree with you. I think that this is a modern way to correct a few issues that the older charging systems had.

I would think it to be a upgrade like disk brakes over drum brakes.

Still not original and depends what the owner really wants.

 

I thank you for the link and did bookmark it for future reference if needed.

[Sam Buchanan]

3 hours ago, Pete said:

HI Sam,

 

Thanks for the nice drawing.

 

A question: would it work to run the wire from the one-wire alternator to the lug on the starter switch and from there to the battery terminal on the regulator (keeping everything else the same as your drawing)? My '39 has:

 

   1) The original foot operated starter, no solenoid

   2) Right now only the neg batter cable and a wire to the ammeter are connected to the starter switch

   3) Only the horn relay and the other terminal on the ammeter and connected to the regulator battery terminal

 

Pete

 

You can remove the regulator, it is not needed. The only reason the old regulator is shown in the drawing is for those who wish to keep the regulator in the engine bay for appearance reasons and it is being shown as merely a junction. But the old regulator has absolutely no function if you use the one-wire alternator. As long as the alternator is patched into your wiring with the ammeter between the alternator and the loads in the car the meter will continue to function.

Edited September 29, 2019 by Sam Buchanan

[Sam Buchanan]

3 hours ago, chrysler1941 said:

I'm a bit confused. he was asking for a regulator and your link is for an alternator ???

And how can the ammeter show drain when connected like your drawing????

 

It is possible my attempt at subtle humor may have gotten lost during the trip to Denmark....... 

 

The alternator has an electronic regulator......hence he can have a new-tech regulator and as a bonus.....a new alternator! 

 

As has been mentioned, the alternator is so efficient there won't be any indicated drain, it will be able to accommodate whatever load our old cars can put on it at any engine speed. The ammeter actually takes on the function of a load-meter instead of the traditional ammeter because it indicates the amount of current the alternator is providing to keep the battery at full charge. When I have all the lights turned on the needle barely deflects to the right.....and the battery stays charged.

 

An alternator is a great upgrade that solves the problems associated with the antique charging system.

Edited September 29, 2019 by Sam Buchanan

[Sam Buchanan]

7 hours ago, keithb7 said:

 

 

The alternator keeps everyone happy except the Mrs who monitors the finances. 

 

The new alternator cost considerably less than the $$$$'s I was looking at throwing at the antique stuff to bring it up to where it would function only partially as well (on a good day!) as an alternator.  

Edited September 30, 2019 by Sam Buchanan

[Sam Buchanan]

7 hours ago, Pete said:

HI Sam,

 

Thanks for the nice drawing.

 

A question: would it work to run the wire from the one-wire alternator to the lug on the starter switch and from there to the battery terminal on the regulator (keeping everything else the same as your drawing)? My '39 has:

 

   1) The original foot operated starter, no solenoid

   2) Right now only the neg batter cable and a wire to the ammeter are connected to the starter switch

   3) Only the horn relay and the other terminal on the ammeter and connected to the regulator battery terminal

 

Pete

 

Pete, connect the wire from the alternator to the wire(s) that is currently (sorry....) connected to the regulator BAT terminal. Then use the regulator as a nostalgic paperweight on your desk.   

Edited September 30, 2019 by Sam Buchanan

[Go Fleiter]

Thanks all!

 The solution 1 wire Alternator in an old fashioned Generator´s housing will be my choice.

https://www.qualitypowerauto.com/catalog.php?category=145

 

It is 484 $, but it will be worth it for my wife (!) and me!

:))

Greetings from Düsseldorf!

Go

[Pete]

Hi all,

 

Thanks for your replies. I should have been more clear in my initial post and included more info.

 

I'm familiar with running a one-wire 6v positive ground alternator. I've been running one for years in my 1938 Dodge Brothers pickup. In that case there was a two-stage regulator attached to the generator. Since this setup had only one wire coming off the regulator, all I had to go was install the alternator and attached that existing single wire to the alternator. I wasn't concerned with keeping the look original.

 

What I'd like to do in my 1939 Plymouth sedan is to keep it looking as original as possible, but with the improvements an alternator brings. So I'd like to keep the old regulator, but only use it for it's Batt terminal.

 

I've ordered a one-wire 6v positive ground PowerGen alternator to replace the generator. My current setup is strictly stock. What I'm thinking is I can disconnect the two wires at the generator and tape them off. Then replace the one wire from the alternator with a larger wire (8g or 10g) to the starter switch post. There is already a wire from there to the Batt terminal on the regulator.  

 

Pete

 

 

[Sam Buchanan]

14 minutes ago, Pete said:

 

I've ordered a one-wire 6v positive ground PowerGen alternator to replace the generator. My current setup is strictly stock. What I'm thinking is I can disconnect the two wires at the generator and tape them off. Then replace the one wire from the alternator with a larger wire (8g or 10g) to the starter switch post. There is already a wire from there to the Batt terminal on the regulator.  

 

Pete

 

 

 

That should work very nicely.

[chrysler1941]

16 hours ago, Sam Buchanan said:

 

It is possible my attempt at subtle humor may have gotten lost during the trip to Denmark....... 

 

The alternator has an electronic regulator......hence he can have a new-tech regulator and as a bonus.....a new alternator! 

 

As has been mentioned, the alternator is so efficient there won't be any indicated drain, it will be able to accommodate whatever load our old cars can put on it at any engine speed. The ammeter actually takes on the function of a load-meter instead of the traditional ammeter because it indicates the amount of current the alternator is providing to keep the battery at full charge. When I have all the lights turned on the needle barely deflects to the right.....and the battery stays charged.

 

An alternator is a great upgrade that solves the problems associated with the antique charging system.

Yes alternator is more efficient bla bla but there are a few of us who like to keep it as original looking as possible. The new expensive Power Gen and similar Gen-Nator is a good idea.

But the post was for a solid state regulator for a DC generator. These are only produced up til 20A. It could be interesting to know if some one made a 30A model for our cars. 

I was so excited to see a link and fumbled around on their site looking for the regulator and didn't find it.  I didn't get it was joke.

 

By the way one terminal alternator do drain battery due to reverse voltage across 3 diodes. Not much ca 0.7v. The three terminal alternators are preferred, drain can be switched off and has charge lamp terminal.

Looking at your drawing, I guess the square block divided into 8 connected to battery is  you positive feed. Ammeter should be in series connected before load, and not parallel with load. For instance if you leave lights on with engine off, you have no way of seeing drain on ammeter.

[Adam H P15 D30]

10 minutes ago, chrysler1941 said:

SNIP:

By the way one terminal alternator do drain battery due to reverse voltage across 3 diodes. Not much ca 0.7v. The three terminal alternators are preferred, drain can be switched off and has charge lamp terminal.

Looking at your drawing, I guess the square block divided into 8 connected to battery is  you positive feed. Ammeter should be in series connected before load, and not parallel with load. For instance if you leave lights on with engine off, you have no way of seeing drain on ammeter.

No they do not.  I have a one wire and the Ign off draw is no where near that.

[chrysler1941]

6 minutes ago, Adam H P15 D30 said:

No they do not.  I have a one wire and the Ign off draw is no where near that.

OK, so how many volts does your drain ?

[Adam H P15 D30]

7 minutes ago, chrysler1941 said:

OK, so how many volts does your drain ?

Never checked, never needed to on 3 cars running them.  Sometimes these cars sit for months with the battery connected without discharge, couldn't do that with a 3/4 amp draw.

 

EDIT: I assume you meant 0.7a not v

Edited September 30, 2019 by Adam H P15 D30

[chrysler1941]

1 minute ago, Adam H P15 D30 said:

Never checked, never needed to on 3 cars running them.  Sometimes these cars sit for months with the battery connected without discharge, couldn't do that with a 3/4 amp draw.

 

EDIT: I assume you meant 0.7a not v

Nope I meant 0.7 volts. This is a normal reverse voltage of one diode.  Alternator has three in parallel from plus to minus. This is a very small drain and will take many months to pull down a car battery. The three terminal alternator has a Sense terminal for ING. When off it will disconnect battery and eliminate drain. One terminal models has sense internally connected to battery terminal all the time.

[Adam H P15 D30]

Never measured an ign off draw in volts, only voltage drop but to each their own.  If it takes several months to drain the battery, what's the problem?  New cars with all the computers will do that....  Maybe trying to solve a problem that's not really a problem?

[Sam Buchanan]

1 hour ago, chrysler1941 said:

Yes alternator is more efficient bla bla but there are a few of us who like to keep it as original looking as possible. The new expensive Power Gen and similar Gen-Nator is a good idea.

But the post was for a solid state regulator for a DC generator. These are only produced up til 20A. It could be interesting to know if some one made a 30A model for our cars. 

I was so excited to see a link and fumbled around on their site looking for the regulator and didn't find it.  I didn't get it was joke.

 

By the way one terminal alternator do drain battery due to reverse voltage across 3 diodes. Not much ca 0.7v. The three terminal alternators are preferred, drain can be switched off and has charge lamp terminal.

Looking at your drawing, I guess the square block divided into 8 connected to battery is  you positive feed. Ammeter should be in series connected before load, and not parallel with load. For instance if you leave lights on with engine off, you have no way of seeing drain on ammeter.

 

My apologies since it is obvious you were offended by my post.

 

No, alternators are not the ideal solution for some applications, a point I thought was made in a previous post. 

 

The wiring diagram I posted is a cut-n-paste from the website of the vendor where I purchased my alternator, I claim no originality, was just trying to be helpful for a fellow poster.

 

As far as whether or not there is objectionable drain with a one-wire alternator or if it is even an acceptable option.......think I'll go get the popcorn popper warmed up..... 

Edited September 30, 2019 by Sam Buchanan

[Sam Buchanan]

3 hours ago, chrysler1941 said:

 

Looking at your drawing, I guess the square block divided into 8 connected to battery is  you positive feed. Ammeter should be in series connected before load, and not parallel with load. For instance if you leave lights on with engine off, you have no way of seeing drain on ammeter.

 

In order to insure that nobody is left with the impression that the alternator vendor has presented erroneous info via his circuit diagram, I wish to offer the following clarification.

 

 

A careful reading of the diagram shows current path (this diagram is for a neg ground vehicle) transitioning from the alternator to the loads in the car. The diagram indicates the load path may begin with a fuse panel, or an amp gauge, or a horn relay. The current then is passed out to the accessories. In our application, the first item in line from the alternator is the amp gauge just as is the case with the old generator. This is a series circuit and allows the ammeter to indicate loads being absorbed by the accessories.

 

This diagram is correct and allows the ammeter to show a discharge if the lights are on without the engine running. I just checked my car and that is the way the ammeter works.......but I think I would be more apt to see the headlights left on rather than a deflection of the ammeter needle....   

 

Edited September 30, 2019 by Sam Buchanan

[chrysler1941]

3 hours ago, Sam Buchanan said:

 

My apologies since it is obvious you were offended by my post.

 

No, alternators are not the ideal solution for some applications, a point I thought was made in a previous post. 

 

The wiring diagram I posted is a cut-n-paste from the website of the vendor where I purchased my alternator, I claim no originality, was just trying to be helpful for a fellow poster.

 

As far as whether or not there is objectionable drain with a one-wire alternator or if it is even an acceptable option.......think I'll go get the popcorn popper warmed up..... 

Na I wasn't offended, I'm not a teen-ager ? just  couldn't find the !"#¤%&/( regulator? 

I have been searching one for some time. Obviously no one want's to make one for these obsolete generators.

By the way, all you with alternators, how do you know it's charging. Have you hooked a charge lamp?

 

Just curious, do you guys have daylight lightning rules for vintage cars? Here if vehicle registered before 1950, then not required.

 

Edited September 30, 2019 by chrysler1941

[Sam Buchanan]

12 minutes ago, chrysler1941 said:

 

By the way, all you with alternators, how do you know it's charging. Have you hooked a charge lamp?

 

 

If the ammeter needle is deflected right of the center mark the alternator is charging. The meter operates, and is wired, the same way as with a generator.

Edited September 30, 2019 by Sam Buchanan