51 Plymouth, Mustang II Kit, Custom Stub?

[Dave72dt]

Bob, you may find you need to cut the firewall as well as the trans tunnel for any V8 swap if that compartment was only designed to fit a straight 6  A measuring tape will be your best friend in determining whether or not those cuts are needed.  Pay close attention to the oil pan and it's position amongst the suspension.  It'll tell you how far forward or back and up or down you can go.  You may need to look at alternative pans and pickups for better placement.

[Plymouthy Adams]

most often, the rear distributor is a draw back and reason for the cut....modern electronics have no distributors....they also have shorter water pump snouts...they also have no need truly for a fan on the engine....the hugger exhausts are a plus.....the 5 speeds on the floor fit perfect on the tunnel....the list goes on and on....there is not need for old school stuff and carbs etc...but...I also respect the fact many folks know their limitations.

[Adam H P15 D30]

I've always felt that loading an old car up with modern computer junk somehow takes the old car away.  A SBC in anything is soooooo boring and has been done many times over, why not do something a little different?  Old school stuff is right at home in an old school car.  Carbs and distributors served their owners for many trouble free miles  and parts are very easy to come by.  If I feel like driving something with F.I., air bags, smog devices, I drive my F150, if I want to take a step back in time I drive a hotrod and I try not to mix the two.

My point is to figure out what you want in an OLD car, If it's a fuel injected something that gets 25mpg so be it, if it's to be a "hotrod" better fond something "hot" to put in it, if it's a cool cruiser, better find something "cool" to put in it.  If it's a commuter that you want to maximize economy, safety and comfort, park it and drive a modern car.

 

Adam

[st63]

On 2/27/2018 at 7:54 AM, Bob Riding said:

Good point- My brother in law who restored 30s-50s cars as a side business would use whatever motor/drivetrain the client wanted but preferred the crate motor/SBC for just the reason you stated- you can buy parts anywhere. What OD tranny should I start looking for that might fit under the '52 without cutting the firewall, etc?

As far as OD transmissions to pair with the SBC, the 200-4r or 700-r4 are the most compact....smaller than the Chrysler A518 or similar units.   I want to stay with a Mopar engine (a 318) for my '50 P-20, but found that using a Mopar OD trans would require making floorpan modifications.  I found that I could avoid that by adapting the 200 or 700 GM units.  Adaptors are readily available (though you won't need one with your SBC).  They're essentially the NON computer controlled version of the modern GM 4l60E, which is an excellent OD transmission.  Art Carr in Huntington Beach has a lot of experience with these trannys. http://cpttransmission.com

Edited February 28, 2018 by st63
spelling

[Plymouthy Adams]

modern fuel injection does not automatically make an old  car a hot rod....no more than a chevy engine will make it dependable, in the case of the chevy engine in a mopar, it makes it junk....lol  but I am very very biased.....and often too fast and honest with my opinion

Edited February 28, 2018 by Plymouthy Adams

[Adam H P15 D30]

2 hours ago, Plymouthy Adams said:

modern fuel injection does not automatically make an old  car a hot rod....no more than a chevy engine will make it dependable, in the case of the chevy engine in a mopar, it makes it junk....lol  but I am very very biased.....and often too fast and honest with my opinion

I’m not sure if you were referring to my post or not but modern FI makes it more of "street rod". Certainly not a hotrod. A SBC makes it a belly button street rod or a cookie cutter street rod. 

I am also very biased, LOL

 

Adam

Edited February 28, 2018 by Adam H P15 D30

[Plymouthy Adams]

I look at a rod more as a performance related where burning rubber and loud exhaust reigns king along with the many overdone body mods like shaving chrome, Frenching components, slamming to the ground, chopping tops and other such notions....I love the modern appointments, if technology had not been lacking in the day, you would have all that stuff on the older cars....yes it is era related, no doubt, no argument.  I fancy  the basic stock bodies and that is where my 40-50's nostalgia ends.  Oh I like them seeing them stock also, just my favored manner of dress in that livery.   Like a few creature comforts, few safety upgrades and power on tap when needed not necessary to be in another persons face.

[MarkRyba]

On 2/23/2018 at 11:41 AM, Bob Riding said:

Hi Mark,

Glad the ‘51 made finally made it! I am looking to do something similar with my ‘52 Suburban, which currently is without engine and transmission. I have a usable 350 SBC and wonder if it and a turbo 350 would fit without cutting the firewall, transmission hump etc.

What powertrain are you and your grandfather going with?

 

Hey Bob! So sorry, haven't been on here a while as I thought this thread had died out.

That powertrain is about similar to what we're going with, I was gifted a 327 from a family friend and we're planning on a turbo 350 right now unless we find a 700R4 somewhere for a reasonable price. Ford 8.5" for the rear. I have read in some other threads that we may need to mount the engine a little off-center, but I'll let you know as we get further along with the project. We're going to be doing some mockups for placement once we get the front end put on (we did end up going with Fatman) before hopefully getting the body off in early summer. 

[Plymouthy Adams]

call me curious, but, with the fatman, why would there be a need to offset the engine....surely the R&P steering does not invade the encroach upon the engine's allotted space.  

[MarkRyba]

We just placed the order for the kit the other day, so I can't say we definitely will, that's just a common theme I've seen from the research I've done thus far. Won't know for sure until we actually get the kit installed.

[Bob Riding]

On 3/7/2018 at 7:55 AM, MarkRyba said:

Hey Bob! So sorry, haven't been on here a while as I thought this thread had died out.

That powertrain is about similar to what we're going with, I was gifted a 327 from a family friend and we're planning on a turbo 350 right now unless we find a 700R4 somewhere for a reasonable price. Ford 8.5" for the rear. I have read in some other threads that we may need to mount the engine a little off-center, but I'll let you know as we get further along with the project. We're going to be doing some mockups for placement once we get the front end put on (we did end up going with Fatman) before hopefully getting the body off in early summer. 

Hey Mark,

Sounds good- I’ll be following your progress- maybe you should do a build thread?

 

[Erik V]

My 39 Luxury Liner has a bad right front spindle. I've called Fat Man and a amuse other places on what I could do. Mustang 2 bits are high labor to install properly but cure most of my bad parts, but around 2 grand in parts. Not sure which direction to go. 

 

When you guys went with aftermarket or liberated parts from other cars, how did you tackle the steering? I want to keep my 3 ott, and it seems unlikely with any major conversion. 

 

Kingpins, bushings, all steering arms and joints, and one spindle are needing work. 

[Plymouthy Adams]

two grand would be a minimum cost do it yourself fit and weld kit as you hopefully have thrown in the cost of forward frame rails as the coil spring box has to go.....if not considered the forward rails, this is the time to kick that pig...

[greg g]

I just don't get this infatuation with Mustang two stuff.  Have any of you ridden in or driven a Mustang two???  They were terrible. A friend had one, it wallowed over bumps, bottomed out over railroad crossings, squeeled tires around corners at any speed, couldn't keep tires on the front.  Maybe the after market ones have improved the concept a bit but still they were poor handling and driving cars.  Why not just freshen up what you have, install frame mounted upper shock mounts, mount some aerostar van springs,  a Cherokee sway bar.  If you want to lower it you can get dropped spindles, but you can get nearly the same drop in front by repositioning the lower spring pocket to the underside of the A frame. Why reinvent the wheel with inferior design and engineering while weakening your frame in the bargain?

[wayfarer]

As long as there are still some 2-wd Daks in the Craigslist postings I'll use them. 

I do believe that it is easier to do a front stub than go the erector set way.  Just my 2¢

[Plymouthy Adams]

8 minutes ago, wayfarer said:

As long as there are still some 2-wd Daks in the Craigslist postings I'll use them. 

I do believe that it is easier to do a front stub than go the erector set way.  Just my 2¢

amen...done a few, easier than fall backwards off a log....cost.....buy three more cars to work with the money saved....of course, these are not plastered all over the hot rod mag advertisement pages...(mopar would sue them to ruination)