MWPauly09 Posted September 3, 2016 Report Share Posted September 3, 2016 Hello everyone. Am restoring a 1953 b4b pick up. I want to switch to 12 volts and am wondering if anyone has found a 12 volt starter that will work in place of the 6 volt starter that was org. eq uipment on these trucks I know the 6 volt can be used however in our area there no rebuilders left anymore. Also does any know if the 6 volt starter can be converted,, to 12 volt and if so by whom? Any help would be appreciated. Thanks in advance and may everyone and their families enjoy the labor day weekend. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Plymouthy Adams Posted September 3, 2016 Report Share Posted September 3, 2016 you can't restore and go 12 volts at the same time....... the 6 volt starter will work on 12 with short burst to start..the spin speed will be faster and thus with a well tuned engine will start quicker with the shorter high speed burst. You can get the starter changed to 12 volt at an auto electric shop...you may be able to find a 56-59 12 volt laying about..it will be identified also by the green data tag. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Young Ed Posted September 3, 2016 Report Share Posted September 3, 2016 Watch the teeth count on the gear. For cars they changed it after 56 so you need a 56 starter. Not sure if trucks are the same. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Don Coatney Posted September 3, 2016 Report Share Posted September 3, 2016 Does your existing starter have a foot activated pedal or a electric relay? If it is a foot controlled starter I don't think you will find one setup for 12 volts. However as part of your upgrade (converting to 12 volts is not a restore) you can convert to a relay activated starter control. But as Young Ed said count the teeth. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John U Posted September 3, 2016 Report Share Posted September 3, 2016 I ran my 6 volt starter for ten plus years never had a problem it worked fine shouldn't be a problem Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MWPauly09 Posted September 3, 2016 Author Report Share Posted September 3, 2016 Thanks for the replys so far. I realize this is not an exact restore, the only changes are the 12 volt conversion and radial tires. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Don Coatney Posted September 3, 2016 Report Share Posted September 3, 2016 Is there a reason you want to convert to 12 volts? If so what? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MWPauly09 Posted September 3, 2016 Author Report Share Posted September 3, 2016 2 hours ago, Don Coatney said: Is there a reason you want to convert to 12 volts? If so what? Not looking for an argument, I"ve been a mechanic since the middle 60"s. I just have felt 12 volt systems were more reliable than 6 volt. That being said I have also considered Staying with 6 volts and using a 6 volt alternator. Does anyone have any experience with a 6 volt alternator? I am replacing the whole wiring harness due to age damage. The present starter is foot pedal activated. I learned to drive in a 1947 dodge pick up with that type of starter and have always though were neat. Again thanks for your thoughts. Mike P. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Don Coatney Posted September 4, 2016 Report Share Posted September 4, 2016 I also have no need to argue. I have a 1948 Plymouth converted to 12 volts. I also have a 1948 Dodge I purchased recently, still on 6 volts with a 6 volt positive ground alternator. Both are reliable and run well. Nice thing about the 12 volt system is I can power up my GPS and charge my seldom used cell phone. On my 12 volt car I installed a 12 volt starter from a 55 Plymouth. Main reason being I discovered that not only does the starter motor run twice as fast but also the Bendix engaged the flywheel super fast and did not sound good. The 12 volt starter sounds much better. With a foot starter that would not be an issue. Many folks are happy running a 6 volt starter on 12 volts. As mentioned 12 volt starters have a green tag.I modified my original generator bracket to mount the 12 volt alternator. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Plymouthy Adams Posted September 4, 2016 Report Share Posted September 4, 2016 the six volt system when properly maintained and proper gauge wires used is not any less reliable than the 12 volts. heavy battery cables need be used and your grounds and connection points must be clean and tight to prevent voltage drops which will kill the system quick. Second big killer is the starter should the rear bushing be worn and elongated causing the armature to drag on the field winding.. most folks wish to keep the stock looking battery..that is good but a group two battery is the better choice and one I cannot get locally, not fond of a group one from either a local big box or the local tractor supply place, both are lacking in my opinion. So I took the 6 volt Optima out of the Packard for my 54 Plymouth and it is certainly a different animal in cranking power and reserve... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MWPauly09 Posted September 4, 2016 Author Report Share Posted September 4, 2016 Good morning. Don and Plymouthy, can the delco 10 si alternator be changed from 12 volts to 6 volts and if so what is required? With regards to wiring I plan to purchase the Quik wire 14 circuit harness with additional ground in each wire group .I prefer to have grounds to go directly to the battery as much as possible rather than use a common ground such as body or frame. I may reconsider switching to 12 volt if I can switch my rebuilt 10 si single wire alternator. Thanks Mike P. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Plymouthy Adams Posted September 4, 2016 Report Share Posted September 4, 2016 the 6 volt alternator be it positive or negative application is special built and you will buy it as such...personally I would never run the Delco unit and have no positive comment to add...... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeff Balazs Posted September 4, 2016 Report Share Posted September 4, 2016 Wire size for an actual 6 volt harness will work just fine if you switch to 12 volt. If you try to use a universal type 12 volt harness in a 6 volt system you will likely have some under sized wire problems that will create reliability issues. Quality Power makes a 6 volt alternator based on the single wire GM unit. I have this set up and like it a lot. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MWPauly09 Posted September 4, 2016 Author Report Share Posted September 4, 2016 Thanks for the reply's ,I will keep this site posted on what I decide. Need to give more thought before proceeding. Take care Mike P. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
55 Fargo Posted September 5, 2016 Report Share Posted September 5, 2016 On 9/4/2016 at 8:41 AM, MWPauly09 said: Good morning. Don and Plymouthy, can the delco 10 si alternator be changed from 12 volts to 6 volts and if so what is required? With regards to wiring I plan to purchase the Quik wire 14 circuit harness with additional ground in each wire group .I prefer to have grounds to go directly to the battery as much as possible rather than use a common ground such as body or frame. I may reconsider switching to 12 volt if I can switch my rebuilt 10 si single wire alternator. Thanks Mike P. yes it sure can be 12 volt - or 6 volt + or _. You can either buy this alternator built for your needs, or do it yourself with the kits. I am currently using a 12 volt 10SI 12 volt alt, no problems at all so far in 4 years. The starter, the 6 volt can be used on 12, but there are pitfalls, long cranking should be avoided. 1956 and later 12 volt starter it will have a green tag, am not 100% sure if the ring gear is the absolute same as the earlier 6 volt, but think it is. 6 volt is fine, I much prefer 12 volts, regardless of any opinions on here, and I have had both. If you go to 12 volt, you could get a mopar alt and regulator too. Nevermind what any negative types tell you, investigate and make your own decisions, if you stay with a 6 volt, that'll be fine too... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MWPauly09 Posted September 11, 2016 Author Report Share Posted September 11, 2016 Hello again. As promised an update on my 1953 b4b project. I have decided to use the Delco 12 volt 10 s.i. alternator thus switching to a 12 volt system. I will use the org. 6 volt starter as I have located a shop that will rebuild this starter and a spare. Most opinions including mine are the 6 volt starter will work fine as long as extended cranking is avoided. I appreciate all the reply's to my question and have learned much from this site on this subject and many others. Thanks again and take care, Mike Pauly Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fargo52 Posted November 3, 2016 Report Share Posted November 3, 2016 I run 8volt battery yes eight volts and it starts great , lights are brighter , 6 years and still working perfect , just had to turn up the regulator to 8.5 volts. Only issue is I can't charge a cell phone , Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
55 Fargo Posted November 3, 2016 Report Share Posted November 3, 2016 58 minutes ago, fargo52 said: I run 8volt battery yes eight volts and it starts great , lights are brighter , 6 years and still working perfect , just had to turn up the regulator to 8.5 volts. Only issue is I can't charge a cell phone , Why, cell phoned typically charge at 5volts Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
maok Posted November 3, 2016 Report Share Posted November 3, 2016 Just some basic information on electric motors - a starter motor is just an electric motor with a fancy gear set at the end to turn the flywheel. Generally the voltage applied to it is the speed it turns at and the current draw is the torque it can exert. Remember, the voltage and current come from the battery. This is why we use bigger batteries (ie. Cold Cranking Amps - CCA) for larger and higher compression engines. Lot more torque and hence current is required to turn the stationary engine to firing speed. However, half the current is required if the voltage is 12v as oppose to 6v but the 'power' is exactly the same. So regardless of 6v or 12v the same amount of power is being used for the same torque required. An electric motor can handle as much voltage as you can apply to, but the length of 'time' determines how long it will hold that voltage before it starts cooking. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
55 Fargo Posted November 3, 2016 Report Share Posted November 3, 2016 1 minute ago, maok said: Just some basic information on electric motors - a starter motor is just an electric motor with a fancy gear set at the end to turn the flywheel. Generally the voltage applied to it is the speed it turns at and the current draw is the torque it can exert. Remember, the voltage and current come from the battery. This is why we use bigger batteries (ie. Cold Cranking Amps - CCA) for larger and higher compression engines. Lot more torque and hence current is required to turn the stationary engine to firing speed. However, half the current is required if the voltage is 12v as oppose to 6v but the 'power' is exactly the same. So regardless of 6v or 12v the same amount of power is being used for the same torque required. An electric motor can handle as much voltage as you can apply to, but the length of 'time' determines how long it will hold that voltage before it starts cooking. Well yes they will power up, and draw double the amperage than the same motor would on 6 volts, lots of heat develops and things fry including the wire leads. A 6 volt starter motor will live on a 12 volt diet, as it is operated for a brief period of time, again wire leads should be beefy to handle the current load and heat... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fargo52 Posted November 3, 2016 Report Share Posted November 3, 2016 You got me rethinking about putting a cell phone (cigarette lighter) in it, I assumed it would not work and never attempted it,and you know what they say about assuming . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
55 Fargo Posted November 3, 2016 Report Share Posted November 3, 2016 26 minutes ago, fargo52 said: You got me rethinking about putting a cell phone (cigarette lighter) in it, I assumed it would not work and never attempted it,and you know what they say about assuming . Let us know what you discover.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dennis46PU Posted November 3, 2016 Report Share Posted November 3, 2016 (edited) 1 hour ago, fargo52 said: You got me rethinking about putting a cell phone (cigarette lighter) in it, I assumed it would not work and never attempted it,and you know what they say about assuming . I know this much, those cigarette lighter chargers don't like positive ground. As far as the starter on 12 volts, I've been running my 6volt positive ground original starter on 12 volts negative ground for several months now. I was concerned about rotation by going to negative ground and that was discussed in a thread I started - no problems. I have my engine tuned to start about as fast as I can get off the foot pedal. Edited November 3, 2016 by Dennis46PU Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
maok Posted November 3, 2016 Report Share Posted November 3, 2016 30 minutes ago, Dennis46PU said: I know this much, those cigarette lighter chargers don't like positive ground. As far as the starter on 12 volts, I've been running my 6volt positive ground original starter on 12 volts negative ground for several months now. I was concerned about rotation by going to negative ground and that was discussed in a thread I started - no problems. I have my engine tuned to start about as fast as I can get off the foot pedal. Its not the cigarette light socket as such but the USB adaptor/charger/whatever its called. Simple solution is to re-wire the cigarette lighter socket to match. And if you do smoke, the socket will still work with your cigarette lighter. Regarding to the 12volts v 6volts, the real bennefit is the speed of cracking with 12volts. Much faster starting if the tune is right. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
maok Posted November 3, 2016 Report Share Posted November 3, 2016 26 minutes ago, maok said: Simple solution is to re-wire the cigarette lighter socket to match. Actually, when I think about it, this may not be as easy as I state above. Easier to just buy a hard wired 12v USB adaptor/charger/etc. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.