50 Windsor Highlander Temp Guage / Overheating?

[wolfy]

I have searched around for some information on my 1950 Chrysler Windsor and the water temp.  Found some useful information, but I just need some help with some verification of a few things.

 

I just got the car at the end of June.  The temps when I got the car were unseasonably cool, in the 70-80's.  Now we are getting back to normal with temps in the upper 90's-100's.  

 

My gauge has no numbers.  It has Cold, a tick in the middle 1/3 of the gauge, which I assume is normal, and the hot tick.  

 

I noticed that in the warmer temps, 95F with Heat index of 110F, my water temp gauge was creeping up to the hot tick mark. So the first thing I did was to flush the coolant system.  It was dirty, I did a nice flush about 3 of them, until I got clean clear water out..  The water was just old, no big pieces, just needed cleaned.  I replaced the hoses at this time as well.  Used the garden hose to flush out the heater core as well.  Radiator does not appear to be plugged.  However it is the original one.  Filled with 50/50 mix of a good quality Antifreeze. 

 

After this the temp gauge is now closer to the middle to 3/4 toward the hot tick mark.  So it did help, just not as much as I would like.  Again temps were 95-100 with the heat index of 110-120F  Yes it was warm.  I was able to drive the car 30 miles / 45 min of stop and go traffic in those temps, however the gauge just seems to high for my liking.   If I need to check it manually, how do I do that?  Where do I test and with what would be a good comparison?

 

Does anyone know what the Hot tick means?  Or maybe a better question is where is everyone else running on these gauges?  What are you all seeing or where does your gauge read?

 

Car never boiled over, I just don't want to be running too hot and risk causing any issues.  

 

The fan has only 4 blades.  Radiator is the honeycomb style.  

 

 

Any suggestions?  I would like to replace the thermostat, The only thing I have found for the right thermostat is: J-127  Is this the right one for me?  Still have the numbers matching flat 6

http://www.oldmoparts.com/parts-cooling.aspx 

 

My main goal for this car is to just drive it.  I don't want to worry about any heating issues.  

Edited July 27, 2015 by wolfy

[DonaldSmith]

Maybe nothing is wrong.  Engines like it hot.  Your radiator does not boil over.

 

You may run into the "vapor lock" phenomenon after parking with a hot engine.  The modern fuels can evaporate out of the float bowl.  An electric fuel pump is the common cure.    

[jeffsunzeri]

Check your gauge first. It's simple to do, and pretty important for your peace of mind. It's about a 3 on the 1-10 scale of difficulty:

 

1. Drain your coolant.

2. Remove the temperature bulb from the head (rear left side). Make sure to use two good fitting flare-nut wrenches to avoid twisting and breaking the capillary tube.

3. Borrow a cooking thermometer from the Kitchen.

4. Boil a pot of water and take it to your car, and submerge the bulb in the water with the thermometer.

5. Have a friend note the needle position on the gauge as you read the temperatures. It should take about 20 seconds for the gauge to fully react.

 

You want to have the first half of the gauge read up to 160 - 180 Deg. F. This is where your engine temperature should remain if all is well and healthy.

As gauges get old, they tend to indicate low.

 

When you're done calibrating your gauge, re-fit the bulb. You won't need any sealant. Refill with 50/50 coolant.

If you don't have good wrenches, or if you doubt your 'skillful touch', have an experienced mechanic do this to avoid damaging the capillary.

[greg g]

Removing the sensor can ruin the tube on these old cars so be very careful or just put the thermometer in the radiator and see what temp your temp actually is.  Remember your 50/50 mix of coolant and water has a boiling point around 225 or higher if your system is pressurized so you have a 20 degree cushion over 212,  also you need to leave some room at the top of the radiator for expansion.  As long as you have about an inch and a half over the cooling fins you should be good to go. Are you running a thermostat?

[Don Coatney]

This is the thermostat I installed in my engine.

 

[wolfy]

Wow you guys are just great!  I believe I am running a thermostat as I haven't removed one and it does warm up nicely like it should.  

 

I did put in a new 4lb radiator cap as my old one was shot.  I believe it was 4lbs, whatever it was I replaced it with a new one with the same pressure rating.  And yes with the 50/50 mix I believe it should be in the 225 range.  The radiator level is spot on.  Maybe I will leave the cap off and let it get nice and "hot" and see what the temp reads.  

 

I am very hesitant on removing the old cap tube,  I know on my old 52 GMC, once you let that magic gas out of the tube it is shot.  Mine is operating right now what I would consider correctly.  I was just hoping for a typical range of what that Hot tick means and the one in the middle.  Or where others needles are running.  I know its not scientific but just a point of reference.  

 

I don't want to run the car over 210F.  I would rather it be below that. Maybe my number needs to be changed but I would feel much better in the 160-200F range.  Does that sound about right?  

 

Don that number comes back at a 180F thermostat.  Any inputs on a 160F stat?  

 

Do you guys think that should be my next step to replace the thermostat and see what I get?  Plus take a reading of the coolant temps once warmed up with the rad cap off?

[casper50]

  Yes I'd run it up to temp and check with a thermometer. with someone inside checking where the gauge needle is when you read out certain temps.

Edited July 27, 2015 by casper50

[greg g]

Look at the overflow tube on the radiator. If its at the top of the expansion tank or below the sealing gasket of the rad cap its 0 pressure.  Some of the late 40's may have been beginning to be pressurized or your radiator may have been updated at some point in the cars life.

[_shel_ny]

4# cap is probably correct for your 1950 Chrysler. Parts book shows plain, and 4# numbers for 1950 Chrysler 6

 

The # J-127 is just the vendors internal system reference #. They will send you the correct one for your vehicle. If you want to be sure 160 or 180, a call to them would provide that info.

 

 

1954(and prior models) Passenger Car Parts List has #s for either a 160, or 180 thermostat.

 

Ones like Don's are available at many parts stores.

 

Putting in a 160 thermostat will not help overheating problems( if you indeed have one) 

 

 

Edit: the style of thermostat housing(internal bypass, or internal bypass ) that you have will determine the physical type needed.

Edited July 27, 2015 by shel_ny

[mopar_earl]

This is the thermostat I installed in my engine.

180?

Never mind, I checked napa site, is a 180,which is what I need. Thanks for posting part number. Happen to have the gasket number?

Thanks,

Earl

Edited July 28, 2015 by mopar_earl

[Dodgeb4ya]

My 1950 Chryslers all run a bit above the 2nd mark as shown on 80-90 day temp degree drives. Right about 170 degrees.

Shut em down and heat soak runs the guage almost to 3/4 of the guage.

Radiators have been cleaned... blocks clean with good D tubes.

Both six and eight cars run this way.

Edited July 28, 2015 by Dodgeb4ya

[Dodgeb4ya]

Some 1950 Chrysler C49 N-Yorker temp guage tests.....

[wolfy]

This is awesome, exactly what I was looking for.  Thanks for giving me some piece of mind.  I believe mine is running a bit too warm based off of your descriptions and pictures. Maybe???  I will try to test my gauge to see what it reads and compare.

 

 

If I am using your calibrated method, Dodgeb4ya,  Mine would be running about 190 and creeping up to 205 or so when sitting at traffic lights running.  Now this was when it was 95-100F outside with the heat index in the 115 area.  Never hit that hot tick mark yet

 

In contrast I took it out last night it was 88F and heat index was 99.  Felt much cooler,  Sun was down so that helped.  Using Dodgeb4ya's nice number calibration put me right at 170F just like was shown on your pic above.  

 

So maybe I do need a bit more work or in those warmer temps I am coming up to the limit of the cooling system. I just don't want to get into a situation where I damage something.  

[TodFitch]

. . . Now this was when it was 95-100F outside with the heat index in the 115 area. . .

Head index is based on the relative humidity of the air because for human body heat regulation we sweat and the evaporation of moisture off our skin keeps us cool. The higher the humidity when we are trying to keep cool, the hotter if feels for the same actual temperature.

 

Car cooling systems don't, or shouldn't, have moisture loss due to evaporation. So I don't think the heat index makes much difference, just the actual temperature of the air.

[wolfy]

Head index is based on the relative humidity of the air because for human body heat regulation we sweat and the evaporation of moisture off our skin keeps us cool. The higher the humidity when we are trying to keep cool, the hotter if feels for the same actual temperature.

 

Car cooling systems don't, or shouldn't, have moisture loss due to evaporation. So I don't think the heat index makes much difference, just the actual temperature of the air.

Yes you are absolutely correct.  In these closed loop systems it does not matter.  Now open systems like a cooling tower for example it makes a huge difference.  It is related to the "wet bulb" temp but that can be correlated directly back to the RH and heat index.  

 

Just put those numbers in there for extra info.  But yes you are right that heat index value doesn't make any difference as there is no evaporation.  Better stated the difference is negligible.  Sorry I'm a nerdy mechanical engineer...  

[wolfy]

Okay. Just maybe for my own verification Here is a picture of my temps from my drive yesterday evening.  Temps were 93F.  Here is where my gauge sits after 20 min drive around town.  

[casper50]

Looks good to me.