Oil filter question

[coW52Dodge]

I did my first oil change on my 52 1/2 ton and replaced the filter with a NAPA FIL1080, which appears to be a generic replacement filter according to many posts here.

The filter that was in there when I got the truck looks similar except that it has a stand off on each end:

It seems to keep the filter in a specific location in the canister and clearly stops it from flopping around:

The new filter does not have these standoffs so, consequently, it sits much lower in the canister. It obviously could potentially flop up when I go through over a bump:

Is this the right filter for my truck? Does this matter that it flops around? I could just cut some spacers out of brass pipe, I guess, to keep it in a similar location, if it makes a difference.

Also, the previous owner really had the wingnut on top of the canister cranked down way too much, it seems. Come to find out that the gasket does not quite fit right and he was compensating for it. The new gasket isn't much better.

What does everyone else do to alleviate this problem?

I could just carefully trim a millimeter from the edge to make it fit properly. I'd hate to crank it down as much as he had it.

[Merle Coggins]

Is there anything stamped into the cover to designate what kind of filter you have? Mine clearly shows that it is a Deluxe Filter and calls for a JC element which, as I recall, crosses to a Napa 1011. It is the sock type filter. Here's a couple pics of my filter for reference.

And it uses this filter.

[coW52Dodge]

Thanks, Merle. My can top says the exact same thing so these are the wrong filters. The previous owner used a metal cartridge filter so I looked for something similar. When I noticed that a lot of people here used 1080 filters, I figured that was the one needed.

Can anyone here use these 1080 filters? If so, make a $10 donation to this site and I'll send the one I took out of the box to you.

(edit: just found out I can return the one I hadn't taken out of the box)

Edited July 14, 2009 by coW52Dodge

[Reg Evans]

I have several filters here and they vary in size. A puralator measures about 4 3/8" inches from the bottom of the lid edge to where the bottom shoulder curves in. A Fram measures 5" and another Fram measures 8". Does your lid have a spring attached that presses on the top of the oil cartridge. Photobucket seems to be down or I would have posted some photos.

Got Photobucket to work.

Edited July 14, 2009 by Reg Evans

[coW52Dodge]

Does your lid have a spring attached that presses on the top of the oil cartridge.

Mine is just like Merle's, with a half-sphere looking thing at the top that has holes all over it.

[Reg Evans]

It sure would have been simpler if they hadn't made so many different kinds eh ?

[coW52Dodge]

It sure would have been simpler if they hadn't made so many different kinds eh ?

Yeah, no kidding.

[John-T-53]

My filter says use JC cartridge with G-101 cover gasket. The gaskets I've gotten with these oil filter elements have never fit right either. The first time I changed the oil I learned the hard way - drove across town and soon a big plume of oil smoke was surrounding the truck. Who knew??

This discussion prompted me to take an in-depth look at the filter design. I've always been unsure as to what filter would work the best. I've used both the cartridge and sock types as mentioned earlier in this thread. For the sock type, which way is it supposed to be installed?

Taking an engineer's perspective, I've always been skeptical of these filters doing much good based on their internal design, in addition to the fact that it's a bypass system. Mine appears to work like this:

Contrary to the description under the "Technical Tips" page on this website, my filter's inlet is at the bottom of the canister and the outlet on the side near the top (it's stamped "outlet"). From the bottom, oil flows up to the top through a central fixed tube. It then flows through holes drilled in the cover bolt shaft and out over the top of the element (see pics). The canister outlet is very close to this point, so oil doesn't seem to have to pass through much of the element before exiting. Wouldn't it make more sense if the center tube had outlet holes near the bottom (where the internal void is on the sock element) so that oil would flow through more element material? What if the sock were installed with the void on the top?

Edited July 14, 2009 by John-T-53

[MBF]

There was a post on this in Vintage Truck magazine a couple of years ago. In net, I believe the suggestion was that if the crankcase was clean, and a PCV system installed using hi detergent oil- and can (excuse the pun) the bypass filter. The additional expense of the filter replacement according to the writer would be more than offset with the use of a PCV system and good oil. I did see an oil pump for a flathead six that had a spin on cartridge mounted to the outer housing. That in effect made for a fully filtered system but I've never seen another since the one I saw on ebay a few years ago. Mike

[Bradley S.]

My truck has a filter system just like Merle's. The cartridge I recently removed that had been in there since who knows, was stamped Hasting 316. No one I have called has ever heard of this number.

I have a NAPA 1011 sock filter to replace it. The gasket that comes with the filter fits the lid perfectly. The filter, however, is a tight fit in the canister. Like rubber mallet tight. I don't really want to use it because I don't know how I am going to get it back out without making an absolute mess. I just can't find an equivalent to what I removed.

I am starting to think frequent oil changes will do more to preserve the engine that these filters will ever do.

Brad

[grey beard]

Brad,

I agree with you. I use the sock, and they are a tight fit. I doubt they do much good at all, in addition to which they only flow oil when the pressure is at certain points - too low or too high and the design of the pressure relief valve blocks the oil from the filter, so it's only a part-time oil filter that only filters a small percentage of the oil used by the engine.

Marty Bose on this forum and a guy by the name of Richie both have done work-aounds to plumb up a spin-on remote full-flow oil filter to our 218 L6 engines. Each of them used different ideas, but both appear to be working well. You might do a search on the forum for their posts from a few years ago. I saved their photos but not the nomenclature.

I use a PCV system and, of course, detergent oil. Likely this combination along with frequent oil changes will do a lot more than the bypass filter, no matter what element is inside the can, IMHO.

[billwillard]

John-T-53

There were a lot of aftermarket filters put on the flathead. No mater what it says on the filter the right way is to run top to top and bottom to bottom. There are two lines going to the block. The top line should go to the top of the filter. If you run the top line from the block to the bottom of the filter when you shut the engine off the dirty oil runs into your main oil gally which feeds the cam and main bearings. You would be much better off with no filter if you have it plumbed backwards.

[Young Ed]

I don't think the bypass filter is as bad as you guys think. Can't say on the sock filter ones but the more conventional filter ones filter down to a much smaller particle then a spin on filter. I believe it you keep the bypass style hookup and convert to a spin on you are much worse then using the OEM stuff

[TodFitch]

I don't think the bypass filter is as bad as you guys think. Can't say on the sock filter ones but the more conventional filter ones filter down to a much smaller particle then a spin on filter. I believe it you keep the bypass style hookup and convert to a spin on you are much worse then using the OEM stuff

Actually the sock types are better than the paper element ones. In the parts book you will see that the sock type is the heavy duty version. The sock type is a "depth media" type filter and those can often filter down to sub-micron levels.

[Merle Coggins]

John-T-53

There were a lot of aftermarket filters put on the flathead. No mater what it says on the filter the right way is to run top to top and bottom to bottom. There are two lines going to the block. The top line should go to the top of the filter. If you run the top line from the block to the bottom of the filter when you shut the engine off the dirty oil runs into your main oil gally which feeds the cam and main bearings. You would be much better off with no filter if you have it plumbed backwards.

Bill, why would I intentionally hook my filter up backwards from that the filter manufacturer recommends? My filter housing, like others here, is clearly marked "IN" at the bottom port and "OUT" at the upper port. I studied my filter some when I first cleaned it up and installed in on my engine. The bottom "IN" port feeds into the center tube which has a couple of holes in it about 1/2 way up. When the cap is installed it plugs the top of the tube so the oil feeding in will exit through the holes and migrate through the filter media. The dome under the cover holds the filter down under the upper "OUT" port. As the oil filters through the filter media it eventually fills up the canister to the void at the top where it can flow out of the "OUT" port and return to the engine sump.

... The filter, however, is a tight fit in the canister. Like rubber mallet tight. I don't really want to use it because I don't know how I am going to get it back out without making an absolute mess...

Brad

Yes, the filter fits in tight when new. It helps some to roll it back and forth on a hard surface, like a rolling pin, in an attempt to make it skinnier. It also helps to grease it up a bit around the outside. Once it's in, with the pull wire at the top, fit the gasket and install the cover. When it's time to change it, just pull the cover, put a small container under the drain plug and remove the plug to drain as much oil as possible. Now grasp the wire and pull it out. You'll be amazed at how easy it comes out compared to how it went in. Again have a container handy to set it into when you pull it out. Now you can wipe out the inside if the canister and replace the drain plug, then install the new filter as described above.

It sure would have been simpler if they hadn't made so many different kinds eh ?

Imagine how parts stores would look if one filter fit EVERYTHING.

Merle

[John-T-53]

Bill, why would I intentionally hook my filter up backwards from that the filter manufacturer recommends? My filter housing, like others here, is clearly marked "IN" at the bottom port and "OUT" at the upper port. I studied my filter some when I first cleaned it up and installed in on my engine. The bottom "IN" port feeds into the center tube which has a couple of holes in it about 1/2 way up. When the cap is installed it plugs the top of the tube so the oil feeding in will exit through the holes and migrate through the filter media. The dome under the cover holds the filter down under the upper "OUT" port. As the oil filters through the filter media it eventually fills up the canister to the void at the top where it can flow out of the "OUT" port and return to the engine sump.

I never found the two holes midway up the center tube until I looked again right now with a flash light and paper clip. They were plugged solid with baked on gunk! This makes more sense now. The cover bolt actually contains the relief valve. Should the filter element become completely clogged, oil would flow all the way to the top of the canister, through the holes in the center of the bolt, and over the top of the filter to the outlet. From now on, I'll make it a point to probe all these holes at every oil change.

As for the Napa 1080 filters, I think they would work fine as long as the element is kept centered over the inlet holes, and the seal between the element and center tube is tight. But as stated earlier in this thread, the sock filters do the best job!

[Young Ed]

I run the 1080s in both my car and truck. They have different housings though. The only part I see with them is by the time I take them out the spring pushing on the top of the filter has made that fiber disk a loose fit on the center pipe. Is that an issue? I was thinking I could put a giant washer in there for the spring to push against.

[John-T-53]

I run the 1080s in both my car and truck. They have different housings though. The only part I see with them is by the time I take them out the spring pushing on the top of the filter has made that fiber disk a loose fit on the center pipe. Is that an issue? I was thinking I could put a giant washer in there for the spring to push against.

If the element doesn't seal tightly to the center pipe, then the oil will pass through the gap instead of the filter media, rendering it useless. That's a good point - using a fender washer with this type of filter will keep the center fiber seal from getting chewed up by the spring.

[Young Ed]

Its only not tight on the top. Bottom is still tight and its still got some tension on it to pull it out. I might try the washer. I don't think it can hurt anything.

[billwillard]

Merle, The dirt should be caught on the outside of the filter where you have more surface. As I said before some filters will say in on the bottom and some will say out on the bottom but you can only put the filter in one way. I say the lines should be top to top and bottom to bottom. I tryed to send a pic from my 55 56 plymouth service manual (page 215 if anyone has one) that shows the bottom line goes to the pressure relief valve which is the bottom hole in the block. On page 167 of my 36 48 plymouth master parts list it also shows the oil flowing from top hole in the block to the top hole in the filter and the oil guage. The oil flows from the oil galleries to the top of filter and when you shut the engine off it can't run back from the top. Why would you hook your filter up backwards? I don't know. Do it your way. Your engine.

Bill

Edited July 16, 2009 by billwillard